Transcripts For RT Documentary 20240711

Was a case we took about 2 and a half now maybe 3 years ago now. And she was accused and convicted of killing her landlord in buffalo, new york in 1995. And its also obviously a false confession cases. The police are going crazy and they cant solve it 18 months go by. And renees connection to the victim was that it was her landlord. And so they are start looking into renee, who at the time was heavily addicted to drugs crack cocaine. And because she gets arrested for something else, and they start interrogating her. And she confesses to killing her landlord. With this guy karim. So she says, kareem, and i went to my landlords house, we were going to rob her. The robbery goes bad, and karim stabs her. So its, shes a good century, can make it a felony, murder being present during the commission of a crime, and somebody gets killed. We started sort of doing, you know, just regular google searches on the players names. The detectives and everything in this t. V. Show and women behind bars comes up and theyve done an episode. Case where they got in the, in the prison and interviewed her and then interviewed this joseph court was the cop on the case. The way her body, when she decided to go, you just saw, it was time to told the truth. I believe her confession is kind of nonsense. Theres inconsistency between the physical evidence and what she says. And during the show, he says, well, i mean we knew that Corinne Walker was in florida at the time of our crime and toward karim was of the crime. I guess they knew Kareem Walker was in florida at the time the crime then renes confession cant possibly be true because shes confessing to going to rob the landlord with kareem and the defense been able to put that on her confession would have made no sense that the defense was never told the whole thing is so full of holes and so bogus. I cant put my finger out and say like, you know, this is the thing. But i think if we dug in it, we could find that thing that could get her out because its all its just all of it. So its messed up. How do they record this confession . And didnt know, i mean, did they make, you know, they typed it up and then read it to her and made her sign it. So there is a type of confession is the only version of the confession. Theres no like original notes. They have or something that we have to wonder about. She says, details about the crime scene because they showed her photos of it that you know how the body was lying, being shown her, those photos of some kind of new evidence that didnt exist at the time of the trial or didnt, didnt exist at the time of the trouble it wasnt known right . And it wasnt presented during the trial. And then we have to show that it could have been a different outcome which i think we can, but its going to be hard. Our goal is of course to get renee out of prison, but it can take a really long time, sometimes many years. And one of the 1st things we do in cases like this is to comb through the confession and find all that in consistencies. To clearly show that the confession is false and if theres a cream walker drove me to 90 long the plan was i was going to go into the front door and karim was going to come up the back door. He was going to tie her up with a piece of white extension cord that he brought with him at babson time, kareem hit louise in the side of the face, and louise fell to the floor and kind of went out. If that happened, he would be standing punching her here right. When cream ted here in the face, he knocked the wig off. A wig landed on the floor in the kitchen kitchen. He tried to tie louise up with the plastic or he had. Then carry comes from behind louise. He stabbed her at least twice. However, we know its 8 times louise fell to the floor again. It was a large amount of blood on the floor next to her body. So the only thing she gets right is that the way it was knocked off that theres a plastic cord involved in this case. Thats correct. And the phone cord is where the extra d. N. A. Is. Behind this in the its gene fisher by rios and renee lynchs attorney. I have a call with her this morning. Oh good things. How i how i live. Oh oh oh i am quite i i i i well, i know its hard for renee went to trial, she testified been very incoherent, lee. She was high during the trial. You know, it was, she was not a good witness for her. So she recanted right away afterwards. And her confession is that is it was a coerced. When i talked to him about this, theyre like, well this is i would never say contests where people say, ive been talking about this for 30 years and thats the 1st thing. Everybody says, and i gather it wouldnt happen today. Its not one kind of person that gives a false confession. We are all told go into the circumstances of interrogation. We all know there are trained detectives ive spoken to who say i can get anybody to confess to that from any of the little boats that they have a 95 percent confession rate and see a lesser of a lesser near perfect and identifying the perpetrator that is every suspect you identify is the perpetrator, right . If youve got a confession rate at that level, you produce an awful lot of false confessions. The rene lynch, when i talked to her about it, she explained to me, i was so shocked that they convicted me. She said because there was no evidence of a confession so powerful, it can stand alone. So heres the jury. On the one hand, theyve got the confessions of the woman and theyve got the confessions trope, the d. N. A. Changes everything. And sometimes ive likened the final product of a confession to a hollywood production. It is scripted by the Police Theory of the case. It is rehearsed and action camera ready to go. And thats what the jury sees. They dont see the whole production, they just see the final. I dont see how the judge or jury can look past a false confession. Is that also the presence and we have a number of documented cases in which the person who falsely confessed actually came to believe the lie that they were told about their own behavior. Which is a whole nother level of insanity. And some of them believe it for a long time afterwards. And i think there are you see here the engineer in the melted thompson case we had he was a danish inturn who came he was a danish, he was a College Student studying to become a teacher. And he came and interned at i. P. S. , which is really, you know, like a 20000. 00, a year priest by the un. And it was a code teacher who accuses meltzer of molesting all the kids in the class. And hes on the cover of the daily news. They take his focus, his facebook profile pictures, him with his niece on his shoulders. So they put that on the cover of the daily news and write sex monster. And they go arrest him in the morning and bring him into the station and they have a female cop interrogate him. She tells him, well, you know, we have video of you molesting these kids, which they had videos, but hes not molesting anybody. So they had this woman who accused him, had taken videos of him in the classroom, interacting normally with children. And so either the cops had watched it or they had watched it and were blatantly lying to him, but there was no video of him molesting kids, but he hears that right. And he thinks holy, well, if im on video, i must have done it right. They let him continue to believe this lie that hes cut red handed on tape molesting these kids. And i think that, that, you know, he started, you could tell through the hole when they finally are recording him. Hes doubting himself. You know, hes, hes wondering, did i do this well, the pandemic . No, certainly no borders and is blind to nationalities, has emerged. We dont have a charity. We dont have the facts in the whole world. Beats to be the chief judge of common every crisis, at least we can do better, we should everyone is contributing each in our own way. But we also know that this crisis will not go on forever. The challenge is great. The response has been massive. So many good people are helping us. It makes us feel very proud that we are in it together. This is a story of women, women with troubled histories and complex court cases. You know, some of us deadly leave off who lives out there who are not the person that the cheesiness of the day are considered the most dangerous of criminals. Shes in a still body off 23 hours of the day. Tell me that its not enough. An issue in the world of women on death row is your media a reflection of reality . In a world transformed what will make you feel safe . Isolation or community . Are you going the right way or are you being led . So direct. What is true . What is faith in the world corrupted . You need to descend to join us in the depths or inmate in the shallowness. Mr. Thompson, can you tell me why youre here to say yes. Im here because in order for inappropriate behavior with its ok. So why dont you tell me the ending, how this started, what happened . You know, what you know . Well, if i can feel what i can remember, just had to go down just a few moments about it and then proceed in the missing person in the head thing in its place and playing around to insular in my shorts and you know, short of Going Forward in that or question where you were going and so what, when you think of your pleasure at one time at a central or as an individual to have to be i dont know, you know, never, ever dislike does not do it. If you read out a statement and it has your handwriting and it just waiting over briefly, doesnt look like its been changed in any way. And thats your signature at the bottom. Because youre at this hour earlier today, youre going to show the camera. I dont even think people in the us really get that the police are allowed to lie to you. I think most people would think that if i am speaking to a police officer, hes telling me the truth. But now to toms, i mean, in denmark, its illegal for the police to lie to you. So he really, i think, was, was really says extra susceptible to Something Like that. It took us filing the civil rights suit to even get access to these tapes. The District Attorney wouldnt give it to us when the criminal case was pending. We asked the court, we moved for a court order to get it. The judge just wouldnt give it to us. But they sat on these tapes for 8 months. He had this case hanging over his head and they knew that there was nothing in the tapes. Right. There was the only evidence. There was yes, luckily, melted never got convicted right. We were able to stop it before that happened. But it took, i mean, it almost killed him Sexual Abuse Involving very Young Children were brought to the attention and used to do the District Attorneys office to thoroughly investigate and involved in 2 children, particularly in this instance preschool ages and one of the 2 dismissed this case, after you have gathered in our tent that we have to have you know, have you ever seen anybody use like a piece of a foam court to prop up the waves or put it just all the way forward to . I dont know if i have a case where there is a piece of foam cord found inside of why would you lay it on your head to give the league a little for a little while, but its better if theyre flat because if there is some clue feed in the hair is not like its just like a 3 to 4 inches of phone cord. In a space. Were trying to get permission to test all the old evidence for d. N. A. But to do that, we have to collect as much information about her innocence as we possibly can. Go back and interview witnesses documents, go back to the crime scene. I keep coming back to this thing that the cops knew. He was in florida and kept going with the story that they did together like wife, if they know hes in florida, why dont they like your lives . Theyre lying to us because hes and we know hes in florida. Why dont they are confronted by hearsay . That how can they be permitted to go forward with a serious of a case that they know is not true. Name a trial basically matter. So thats why the trickery and the only way to convict somebody of this was to do it that way. Yes. It just makes me so jaded and really disgusted with the District Attorneys office is that i feel like, you know, the, you know, theyre supposed to be at the top of the chain right there. Its supposed to be the ones making sure the cops made mistakes, or people below the cops made mistakes, then theyre the ones who are responsible for fixing it. Why not do d. N. A. Testing . Think why not me . Were all, were not infallible. We can all make mistakes. Why not check . I mean, her names going to be in prison for the rest of her life. Why not just check . You know, they can never answer that question. So you just end up in court with, you know, them opposing your motions for d. N. A. Testing and unending ability gating instead of working together in renes case, its especially frustrating because, i mean, they certainly believe that this was done. Not the stabbing was not done by her. Right. So there is this said, i mean, theyre basically admitting that they have a cold case and theres a murder out there, and they still dont want to do it. You know, its did 2 people either 2 people or somebody other than renee, committed that crime. And that person is out and about, and d. N. A. Contesting could show who they are, but theyre still posing as am you know, the central park jogger case was my 1st interaction with false confessions our firm represented corey wise on his civil rights case way to start i mean, youre diving right into the bed there. You know, the circumstances that play in that case were huge amount of pressure on the police and the authorities to make arrests and make them step forward. 7 years in prison. With one of most notorious crimes in the history of new york city, it was a crime in which a woman who was a wealthy Upper East Side investment banker was out jogging and was dragged into the woods in central park and almost beaten to death. And there was front page news every day, everywhere, and they are out to get arrests and they got him when you get to the false confessions, in that case, it was a classic, you know, mismatch. They were totally overmatched, underrepresented, if represented at all. I dont know what they could do, corey, even have anyone in the room with now is going to be 16. So he was considered an adult, sadly. And so his mom was not allowed in there and they, you know, had given them lawyers, they all waived their, their miranda rights rights. Where you live, christine says that it is very, very serious in this neighborhood. We dont know. Are there any way to use an example . We do say that youre seeing there are stages and surely you can see where this point is way it is hard for people to understand how this can help produce a confession, something they didnt do. And there really is a complicated set of stories. There is no one reason you know why is confessed to get out of this bad situation. He was under pressure from many, many hours. He was likely be told that others were giving stories and that to, to cooperate in order to go home. And it is very telling in the central park 5 case that every one of them, every one of the boys and every one of the parents who were present were surprised. The boys were arrested after their statements. Every one of them i was going home, right . Well, you know what, that sounds crazy right here. Thought you were going or confess to a rape and go home, right. But you know that one false confessors were interviewed afterward and theyve been exonerated. And the 1st question, everybody wants those, i dont understand why dont you confirm the most typical response . Because i want to go back in this and people often say afterwards, you know, i was so im tired, im so stressed. I figured let me sign this confession. Itll all work itself out, in the end. The detective so often say, you know, we have d. N. A. , were going to send these things that claiming they have lost is a way to scare the criminal into submission. It may be right. But if the person youre talking to is not the criminal but an innocent person that the law becomes a promise of future exoneration. Makes it easier to contrast, right . Were going to do some tests. Were going to take blood samples from a lot of different people. Right, and i just want to know that if we do that, we will probably get an order to take a sample from you. And then well compare it to tests or this area because youre in a position now where you know that theres going to be a match day even better off. Tell us about it now or the stairs instead of saying something thats natural, part of the story. One of the things i think they made you say was that you cut her on the legs. Where did you, how did you come up with that . I dont know, came from no, i dont know. Made it up. I dont know. I dont know maybe exclaimed joe biden, to be president elect obama group. Thats not how it works. Final vote make that determination and we arent there yet. Close the election. And what is the possibility, how big country explain the election in which you will sleep . We will wish we really do need probably will she do it . Sure i can border. Remember the edge that would have been murdered by hugo. That when us goes, all of those are going to use that word because those told me again, we will see in the movie it is with the weve seen it all seen it was and it was, but i is the most insidious some of it is in your speech come off and it is the of the 20th century was thing in or of revolution. The Great Depression and world wars, the 21st is the century of mental illness. Those arent my words. Thats what therapists and psychiatrists tell us. The only question is, should we accept it as a fact . Or no. This is a story of women. Women with troubled histories and complex court cases. You know, some of us daily leave, whole lives out there. But were not the person that theyre accusing this employee of they are considered the most dangerous of criminals. Shes in a Still Holding off 23 hours of the day. Tell me that its not enough. And it is a good world of women on death row and authorities in the u. S. State of georgia order, a recount joe bidens, narrow margin of victory there and several other states claiming the president ial election coming up on the program this hour, riot police fired tear gas in the armenian capital, as frauds accused, the government of capitulating to azerbaijan, by signing a peace deal with the armenian ministers. With the truce, most of the disputed region, one of