Transcripts For RT Documentary 20210308

sins in the. center of the anytime you do an exoneration case where there's been a false confession it's like trying to write a trice. everybody's already against you the person has been convicted by a jury charge thinks he's guilty the jury thinks he's guilty now you have to convince everybody that they're wrong. so ok so you're deeply invested in is a case of an alien ship who has been in prison for 20 years renee lynch. was a case where he took. about 2 and a half now maybe 3 years ago now and she was accused and convicted of killing her landlord in buffalo new york in 1900. and it's also obviously a false confession case the police are going crazy and they can't solve it 18 months go by and bernie's connection to the victim was that it was her landlord and start looking into renee who at the time was heavily addicted to drugs crack cocaine and because she gets arrested for something else and they start interrogating her and she confesses to killing her landlord with this guy karim so she says kareem and i went to my landlord's house we were going to rob her the robbery goes bad and karim stabs her so it. can make it a felony murder being present during the commission of a crime and somebody gets killed we started sort of doing you know just regular google searches on the players' names and detectives and everything in this women behind bars comes up and they've done an episode case where they got in the in the prison and interviewed her and then interviewed this joseph court was the cop on the case the way her body. was time to go in truth. i believe her confession is kind of nonsense there's inconsistency between the physical evidence and what she says and during the show he says i mean we knew that corinne walker was in florida at the time of our crime. kareen was. i guess they knew karim walker was in florida at the time the crime then rene's confession can't possibly be true because she's confessing to going to rob the landlord with kareem had to do. fense been able to put that on her confession would have made no sense but the defense was never told. the whole thing is so full of holes and so bogus like i can't put my finger out and say like you know this is the thing but i think if we dug in it we could find that thing that could get her out because it's all. it's just all of it so it's messed up how do they record this confession and didn't know i mean did they make her write a statement they typed it up and then read it to her maters so there is a type of confession is the only version of the confession there's no like original notes they have or something like that we have. to wonder about. she says she knew details about the crime scene because they showed her photos of it. details that she know how the body was lying and being shown her those photos so we'd have to find some kind of new evidence that didn't exist at the time of the trial. or didn't know didn't exist at the time of the trial but it wasn't known right and it wasn't presented during the trial and then we have to show that if it had been could have likely been a different outcome or at. least i think we can but it's going to be hard. our goal is of course to get renee out of prison but it can take a really long time sometimes many years and one of the 1st things we do in cases like this is to comb through the confession and find all the consistencies to clearly show that the confession is false. and if there's a cream walker drove me to. the plan was i was going to go into the front door and karim was going to come up the back door. he was going to tie her up with a piece of white extension. chords that he brought with him at that time kareem hit louise in the side of the face and louise fell to the floor and kind of went out if that happened he would be standing punching her here right. on cream head here in the face he knocked the wig off the wig landed on the floor in the kitchen. kitchen. he tried to tie louise up with the plastic or he had then karim comes from behind louise he stabbed her at least twice however we know it's times. louise fell to the floor again it was a large amount of blood on the floor next to her body so the only thing she gets right is that the witness knocked off that there's a plastic cord involved in this case is correct and the phone cord is where the extra d.n.a. is. ringback this film is jean fisher byron nelson rene lynch's attorney i have a call with her this morning. oh good things. how i. o. . o. . o. . o. o. . o. y. growth are quite. high. oh i know it's hard. for. our. remaining one to trial. she testified in very incoherent way she was high during the trial. in which she was not a good witness for herself she recanted right away afterwards and her confession is that it was a coerced when i tops and you know about this they're like well i would never cross a contests where people say i've been talking about this for 30 years and that's the 1st thing everybody says i get it but it wouldn't happen to me. it's not a one time a person that gives a false confession we are all fall into the circumstance of interrogation we are all there is some training to text this i've spoken to who say i can get anybody to confess to. many of the lobos that they have a 95 percent confession rate. conceivable a lesser of a less you near perfect at identifying the perpetrator that is every suspect you identify is the perpetrator right if you've got a confession rate at that level you're producing a whole lot of false confessions the renee lynch when i talked to her about it she explained to me i was so shocked that they convicted me she said because there was no evidence of a confession so powerful it can stand alone so here's the jury on the one hand they've got the confessions alone and they've got d.n.a. confessions trumped the d.n.a. changes everything and sometimes i'd like in the final product of a confession hollywood production is scripted by the police theory of the case is rehearsed and. action camera ready to go. and that's what the jury sees they don't see the whole production they just see the final i don't see how the judge or jury can look past a false confession if they don't see the presence. we have a number of documented cases in which the person who falsely confessed actually came to believe the lie that they were told. their own behavior. which is. a whole nother level of insanity and some of them believe it for a long time afterwards right. there. here. in the melted thompson case we had he was a danish inturn who came. to danish he was a college student studying to become a teacher and he came and interned at i.p.s. which is really you know like a $20000.00 a year preschool up by the un and it was a code teacher who accuses me of molesting all the kids in the class and he's on the cover of the daily news they take his focus his facebook profile pictures him with his niece on his shoulders so they put that on the cover of the daily news and write sex monster and they go arrest him in the morning and bring him into the station and they have a female cop interrogate him she tells him while you know we have video of you molesting these kids which they had videos but he's not molesting anybody so they had this woman who accused him had taken videos of him in the classroom interacting normally with children and so either the cops had watched it or they had watched it and were blatantly lying to him but there was no video of him molesting kids but he hears that right and he thinks holy well if i'm on video i must have done it right they let him continue to believe this lie that he's caught red handed on tape molesting these kids and i think that that you know he started you could tell through the. whole when they finally are recording him he's doubting himself you know he's he's wondering did i do this. the world is driven by shaped by one person or those. thinks. we dare to ask. for it. illegal . it's seemed wrong. just told. me that you get to shape out. you can't get educated and engaged with equals betrayal. when so many find themselves worlds apart. just to look for common ground. mr thompson. can you tell me why you're here today you know. i'm here because of. my colleagues and. for inappropriate. behavior with kids ok so why don't you tell me. how they and how this started what happened you know what. you know well. you know what i can remember this time to go down just a few moments about. it and then. in a sense i. had presented. i had taken . its. place and placing it around my. consoler in my shorts. you know short of going forward in that or question where you were going. and so what when you think you can pleasure i want. that essential as an. individual to have to be. i don't know you know. a member of a dislike. of it if you read out the statement that's your handwriting and it just waiting over briefly doesn't look like it's been changed in any way. and that's your signature. because you write those that are here today they're going to show you the camera. i don't even think people in the us really get that the police are allowed to lie to you i think most people would think that if i am speaking to a police officer he's telling me the truth but now to tom's i mean in denmark it's illegal for the police to lie to you so he really i think was was really says extra susceptible to something like that it took us filing the civil rights suit to even get access to these tapes the district attorney wouldn't give it to us when the criminal case was pending we asked the court we moved for a court order to get it the judge just wouldn't give it to us but they sat on these tapes for 8 months he had this case hanging over his head and they knew that there was nothing in the tapes right. there was the only evidence there was yes luckily melson never got convicted right we were able to stop it before that happened but it took i mean it almost killed him. sexual abuse involving very young children were brought to the attention. and. district attorney's office strategies you know to thoroughly investigate and. interview children particularly in this instance we use for the last preschool. ages and one. thing to dismiss this case after all and. gather in our extensive investigation we have to have. you know have you ever seen anybody use like a piece of a foam court to prop up the waves or put it on. just the way forward to i don't know if i have a case where there is a piece of foam cord found inside of why would you. lay it on your head to give them a little too for a little. if they're flat. because if there is some clue feed in the hair is not like it's. just like a 3 to 4 inches of phone cord. 10. days case we're trying to get permission to test all the old evidence for d.n.a. but to do that we have to collect as much information about her innocence as we possibly can. go back and interview all the witnesses. documents go back to the crime scene. i keep coming back to this thing that the cops knew he was in florida and kept going with the story that they did together like wife if they know he's in florida why don't they like. your life. you're lying to us because he's in we know he's in florida why don't they are confronted by hearsay that how can they be permitted to go forward with a serious of a case that they know is not true name a trial basically matter. so that's why that's as trickery and the only way to convict somebody of this was to do it that way yes. it just makes me so jaded and really disgusted with the district attorney's offices and i feel like you know the you know there's supposed to be at the top of the chain right there it's supposed to be the ones making sure the cops made mistakes or people below the cops made mistakes then they're the ones who are responsible for fixing it why not do d.n.a. testing think why not me we're all we're not infallible we can all make mistakes why not check i mean her name's going to be in prison for the rest of her life why not just check you know they can never answer that question so you just end up in court with you know them opposing your motions for d.n.a. testing and unending ability gating instead of working together in rene's case it's especially frustrating because i mean they certainly believe that this was done not the stabbing was not done by her so there is a set the i mean they're basically admitting that they have a cold case and there's a murder out there and they still don't want to do it you know it's did 2 people either 2 people or somebody other than renee committed that crime and that person is out and about and d.n.a. contesting could show who they are but. they're still posing as. am. you know the central park jogger case was my 1st interaction with false confessions our firm represented corey wise on his civil rights case way to start i mean you're diving right into the bed there you know. the circumstances that play in that case were huge amount of pressure on the police and the authorities to make arrests and make. actual perpetrators step forward. 7 years in prison. with one of the most notorious crimes in the history of new york city it was a crime in which a woman who was a wealthy upper east side investment banker was out jogging at dusk and was dragged into the woods in central park and almost beaten to death and there was front page news every day everywhere and they are out to get arrests and they got him. when you get to the false confessions in that case it was a classic you know. mismatch they were totally overmatched underrepresented if represented at all i don't know what they could pick or even have anyone in the room with now is considered 16 so he was considered an adult sadly and so his mom was not allowed in there and they you know had given them lawyers they all waived their their miranda rights. rights. chris. says. that it's. this is very very serious this may be very we don't know if this is their. way to use an example we do say. after seeing their stages and surely you can see. why. it is hard for people to understand how this can. help how the produce a confession something they didn't to and there really is a complicated set of stories there is no one really so. you know why he's confessed to get out of this bad situation he was under pressure from many many hours he was likely be told that others were giving stories and that to to cooperate in order to go home and it is very telling in the central park 5 case that every one of them every one of the boys and every one of the parents who were present were surprised the boys were arrested after their statements every one of them i was going home right well you know what that sounds crazy right here thought you were going or confess to a rape and go home right but you know that one false confessors were interviewed afterward and they've been exonerated and the 1st question everybody wants those i don't understand why don't you confirm the most typical response because i want to go back in this and people often say afterwards you know i was so. tired i was so stressed i figured let me sign this confession it'll all work itself out in the end the detective so often say you know we have d.n.a. we're going to send them to the last 3 they think that claiming they have t.n.a. law is a way to scare the criminal into submission they may be right but if the person you're talking to is not the criminal but an innocent person then the law becomes a promise of future exoneration. makes it easier to confess right. we're going to do some tests we're actually quite samples from a lot of different. i just want to know that if we do that we will probably get an order to take a sample from you. and then we'll compare it to tests. or this. area because you're in a position now where if you know that there's going to be a match. you better off tell us about it now instead of saying something that's natural or this. one of the things i think they may just say was that you cut her on the legs and where did you how did you come up with that i don't know. came from no i don't know. made it up i don't know where it came from no i don't know. the binding ministration is still young but its foreign policy particularly in the middle east is an echo of past failures this ministration simply just not a learning curve small so does washington really support democracy in the world ukraine's crackdown on independent media should give us pause. this is crude oil. so they need to actually physically pump it out of the ground you would have well well. there's a lot of money with the oil and with that comes. a lot of a lot of people from all over the country. if you don't make a $100000.00 a year. as a minimum there's an issue. here maybe. they work well 16 hours a day hard work will work it's not easy work and so they want to relieve their stress of how do they relieve their stress these may move that out like these men that comfort these men that. people have been murdered up here people been raped they're massive drug issues up here you have a boom you have everything else that comes along with money. is you'll media a reflection of reality. in the world transformed. what will make you feel safe. tyson nation will community. are you going the right way or are you being that. what is true. is great. in the world corrupted you need to descend. to join us in the depths. of the shallows. the headlines this hour profiting from the pandemic to see new german politicians are quitting in a major scandal for allegedly earning hundreds of thousands of euros after brokering the face masks meanwhile the u.k. government faces claims of financial mismanagement during the pandemic after all from frontline health workers a pay rise of just one percent while it spends millions on a new media briefing room and as president biden's long away with really failed passes through the senate people face getting less than they did and the trouble. hello there is so 4 pm in moscow you were.