Transcripts for BBC Tees BBC Tees 20171027 030000

Just for news. This is the same if it's 4 o'clock and 5 miles this is a full night and I'm not gonna get the main news on 5 lines a cyber attack on the n.h.s. Could have been prevented and in sports Rangers sacked their manager this is b.b.c. . News with the b.b.c. News on 5 Live his Liam smartly a cyber attack which crippled parts of the n.h.s. In May could have been prevented if basic security measures had been put in place more than a 3rd of trust in England were disrupted by the want to cry ransom according ransomware according to the National Audit Office Here's our technology correspondent Catherine Jones a 3rd of n.h.s. Trust across England were hit about 900000 appointments ended up being cancelled including $139.00 cancer referrals and the National Audit Office says the hospital's infected by the ransomware could have prevented that if they'd installed a patch they'd been warned about that and they failed to act the people of Catalonia are waiting to find out whether Spain will decide to impose direct rule stripping the leader of his powers and a meeting of the cattle and regional parliament colors pushed him on referred the decision over whether to declare independence to M.P.'s to Cox's in Barcelona colors put him on gave a televised address where he said that he'd been thinking about calling snap elections but haven't had any assurances from Madrid that they would suspend article 155 The imposition of direct rule from Madrid and therefore he wasn't going to call it Donald Trump has declared a public health emergency in the u.s. Because of the widespread addiction to opioid painkillers the Us president says more than 140 Americans die every day because of overdoses is the 1st lady Melania Trump drug addiction can take your friends neighbors or your family no state has been spared and no demographic has been untouched which is. I my husband and he's the medium station has dedicated itself to combating this health crisis by using every year source available a couple who sexually assaulted a child and Lifestream that on the internet have been jailed 34 year old Sarah Gotham from Plymouth was sentenced to 9 years in prison and her partner 36 year old Craig Forbes from talkie was given a year sentence you know intonations back to report has concluded that the Syrian government was behind the chemical chemical attack in a rebel held town earlier this year which killed more than 80 people investigators say the nerve agent sarin was dropped from an aircraft. Twitter has banned 2 of Russia's biggest media outlets from buying out on their platform which today and Sputnik are accused of attempting to interfere in the u.s. Election last year our correspondents mirror Hussein is in New York Twitter is one of the re companies that are going to be facing. Next week on Capitol Hill by Washington lawmakers they're going to be asking social media companies Facebook Twitter and Google about the 26th election and what role those companies actually play and President Truman has all of the release of nearly 3000 classified documents relating to the assassination of President John f. Kennedy in 1963 however hundreds of sensitive files are being held back until April pending a review of concerns raised by the CIA and f.b.i. Time to the sport now with James Burford after just 7 months in charge Pedro has been sacked as Rangers manager former boss Sally McCoist has told 5 Live Sports he'd like to see Walter Smith and Graham Sue ness return to the club the chairman of the f.a. Greg Clarke says the organization has lost the trust of the public over its handling of discrimination claims against women's manager Mark Sampson Prop Joe Myler is said to be available for England's 2nd match of the autumn against Australia with a decision to spread his 3 week ban over a 4 week period expected to be reversed Meanwhile Exeter back row Sam Simmons has received his 1st England call up but experience flying to James Haskell has been left out of Eddie Jones $34.00 man squad and Martina Hingis has announced she's retiring from tennis at the end of the season you already made to come back from retirement but says now it's definite. This is b.b.c. 5 live on digital on the smartphone and tablet the weather cloud and rain clearing southward across England and Wales over the next few hours leaving close guys and cooler conditions in the north a pit of isolated fog and frost would last the Clear Skies overall Friday will be brighter and cool. Apart form in the south and the far south west will be cloudy at 1st a lousy dry day but it will be windy in the Northeast b.b.c. 5 Live 5 lives young commentators see a conversation like this today if you know young person $81115.00 he saw what it Your listening to up all night and I'm Nick Garnet there are problems in the rerun of the election in Kenya and some places votes are being counted and others the elections been suspended with no opposition taken Is there any real point in this vote the un Security Council says it's worried about rising tensions and reports of violence between Iraqi federal forces and the Kurdish Peshmerga forces from both sides been battling so-called Islamic state forces up to now with that battle seemingly one is there a battle now for land and another day and another series of revelations about the behavior of Hollywood execs and the entertainment industry but it's prompted many people to re-examine their own experiences of harassment by their work or throughout their education a former student of Oxford University has named the University professor who sexually harassed her even though the man as involved is dead I'll be asking her why. If she's acted now 30 years after it happened all at and an awful lot more between now and 5 o'clock we start though in Kenya where votes in the rerun of the election being counted in many parts of the country but the poll was suspended in 4 counties until Saturday and those areas opposition supporters clashed with the police in many polling stations didn't even bother opening it all the opposition leader Raila Odinga has called on his supporters to boycott the poll because the wrong is the journalist specializing in Kenya she's been reminded me why this rerun is taking place well this is an election that was actually already stated once before this year in order. And during that election no hurrican yet I was declared to be the winner by a sizable margin and the opposition cried foul and launched a legal challenge which went to Kenya Supreme Court and rather Tehran's main isn't the Supreme Court said that the election result was not credible it didn't say there had been rigging but it did say that there had been procedural problems in the transmission and collating of results and therefore that the whole thing was invalidated and this is the 1st time that ever happened in Africa so it was really a kind of milestone in African history and I think it prompted a lot of rejoicing but at the same time it's clear that it really hasn't cleared and playing up so the elections been perspire now in 4 counties because of security challenges what what level of unrest has the been. Well we've seen I gather that the death toll so far as 3 deaths. There's been some bullets. What tends to happen in these situations is is in the opposition strongholds in Kenya which are in the west of the country in the town of Kisumu in particular which is the stronghold of and also in a lot of the informal settlements the slums of Nairobi they are they tend to have very high proportion of people from the West and their supporters the right so there were people who'd been told by riot we're not taking part in the election with boycotting the selection we don't wait to vote and we don't want anyone to vote and so there's a kind of situations where they'll be running clashes with police security forces and and the police in Kenya have shown no compunction about cracking down extremely hard and in fact they've been accused of going you know in the in the August elections they're accused of going house to house and raping people and looting houses they do tend to go in extremely hard they use live bullets often not just rubber bullets they fired tear gas and people get shot bystanders get shot children get shot so I think the death toll so far is 3 May well go up so if the opposition doesn't actually want wanted to take place at this time and it isn't a contest as it's not it's not an election where one side will win one side so what's the key thing to look for is it is it the turnout is it the fact that people actually can be bothered or not bothered to vote what are they looking for yeah I mean I think basically the strategy of the opposition of the Nascar they call themselves Nascar this opposition coalition led by Rollo dingoes they want to prove that they're a player and. If they can make sure that brochure people turn up to vote though shown that they can't be they can be bypassed they can't be ignored and they feel that they've been ignored and they've had elections rigged. Hall now 3 successive elections so turnout is going to be crucial the electoral commission just came out and said that it estimated turnout at 48 percent and we know that Jubilee who can get an incumbent party they were hoping for 60 percent so it's already down 60 percent but in fact a lot of people I'm hearing from are saying there's no way it was 48 percent and it has to be so that the electoral commission in Kenya has lost a lot of credibility over the last few months it seemed to be very politically infiltrated have been there's been an occasion in which Electoral Commission fled the country saying that she had been receiving death threats the chairman of the electoral commission himself said that he didn't think the poll this poll that we had today with going to be credible so when he then comes up with the 48 percent turnout figure I'm really not sure how many people are going to see that as credible so the so it's the danger is that it will be seen as as a as a legitimate vote in the same way that the previous one was was yes. I mean I think we're in a series of sort of rolling cycle of political crisis we've obviously seen extremely low turnout those pictures all over social media of deserted. Polling stations today polling stations where 111 picture shows a sort of monkey sitting on an unused chair and you know that's the image that will become great around the world. Is only really the president for half the country and then that raises the question of is the is he going to allow that situation to continue or is he going to reach out and try and bring the opposition into the hold in some way but Ok so that's the long term picture what about the short term outlook for Kenya. Are we going to see a period of of continuing political unrest do you think that that he will bring in the opposition that the some deal can be done is that what the end game is. That's only the end game of. An incumbent really doesn't want to have to do that I mean they've been very very stubborn in that regard I think many people feel that if they hadn't been so hard line in not wanting to give. Us the to the table this crisis would have been averted I thing in the short term we're going to see Saturday clearly it's going to be another tense day with at least 4 counties probably many more I mean to stage you know air they'll go through the motions of having a another poll because the electoral commission so they can get the materials to the polling stations so they've got and they're going to try again on Saturday those are opposition strongholds so nothing is going to happen there the law has been announced election result which will obviously go to Kenyatta he'll be declared again the president of Kenya and then I think we could see we'll see you know there may be well some demos protests I think that will continue and we could see another legal challenge going to the Supreme Court with us saying this is not a credible election because after all now we know that Supreme Courts are very unpredictable in their findings and it's all very very damaging not just for Kenya but for East Africa because you've got to think that there are a host of countries that depend on things going well and Kenya being stable just to get basic supplies through to them you've got landlocked countries you've got real wonder you've got Uganda they get petrol they get food stuffs they you know they have containers unloading at Mom passed there every day which are destined to go into our country they have lorries rolling through the country if if for any reason the unrest were to spread they are going to suffer and we saw this 10 years ago when there was a massive political crisis after an election and they were running out of fuel taxes were being. Grounded flights went operating and overall you know tourist numbers are going to be massively hit 10 years the place where a lot of people like to go in December it's a very popular tourist destination over Christmas I am not sure that many people are going to want to visit until the situation has been cleared up and it's a massive economic hub for the whole of the region so it's going to certainly not quite a few points up its growth rate with c.n.n. Affects everybody any staff became a wrong that's for 15 or 5 Live the seemingly daily revelations regarding Harvey Weinstein and indeed others in the entertainment industry have prompted many people to re-examine their own experiences of harassment other work or through their education many have been encouraged to talk about their experiences by the social media hash tag me too well McGraw is one woman who's gone a step further She's published an article naming the university tutor she says sexually harassed her during her time at all with university he's since passed away we're not naming him during the interview because we haven't been able to approach his family but earlier a spoke to Mel about her experiences at university she described what happened well it happened on several occasions. Oxbridge has had then a system of $122.00 or so you would turn out for a tutorial with your tutor and it would just be you and them in a room and many of the tutors her room and sometimes flat. On the college ground so you could be in their personal space. And I would turn out. For my tutorial and the door would open on my tutor would be there and he would always well he would often have a range to shout to have been in the shower and when I knocked and. It appear in his past rebel once. In a tiny little town. And we would sit there for the next hour and I would be expected to. Read my essay and talk about it and. With this guy this guy who would often be a man spreading and I didn't see anything or an advantage if I did but it was just a very uncomfortable environment and he would often make inappropriate remarks about my hair or once he left a note in my pigeonhole to say that he noticed I didn't have a boyfriend. And it just made me feel that I was being policed sexually all the time were the people subjected to similar treatment was this one of those those ghastly things that in hindsight that we all refer to as an open secret. It absolutely was an open secret certainly among the students and if the college didn't know it must have been because they weren't listening very hard because he had a nickname which I won't give but he had a nickname which basically says he said it all so that's how we knew him and I think one of the reasons I decided to speak up was that he recently died and there was a bit tree for him in which he was described by the college as well loved and much missed and highly respected and certainly from my perspective and I suspect from other female students perspectives he was none of those things. And in some ways when you hear. Somebody being lauded by by people who who probably had an idea of what was going on it raises raises the hackles doesn't it it really does it brings it all back actually and I just felt a sense of just giant indignation and at the same time a feeling of responsibility both to speak up but also a sadness that by speaking up I was going to impact probably going to impact his family if they heard about it and I do regret that I feel sad about that but I think that's one of the many reasons why people who are in this position and it really wasn't This particular to tell targeted women but. Boys were targeted to by other students by other tutors and I absolutely know that for a fact and we were very vulnerable and we were protected when we rived at Oxford's I remember we were all given a little blue book that we all kind of giggled over and but at the same time kind of madly reading and it was a some facts of life book and it was very much where you know what goes where but I don't remember the word sexual harassment or actually appropriate behavior or any of those kinds of words ever coming up ever I mean I wouldn't have known. I wouldn't have known what to complain about. And I certainly wouldn't know who to complain to because the college also had a system of personal teachers where us signed a personal tutor who was supposed to look after you in a past Ok And so if you had any issues with not just the work done or whatever it was and you were supposed to go to them and he was also a bright person so the very person who was and supposed I was supposed to go to in these situations Had I realized I could go to anyone was the person responsible for the behavior but what I was really stuck What impact did it actually have on on the reason that you were there to study what would impact to have a not. Well I was the 1st generation in my family to go to university my parents had worked incredibly hard to enable me to go I knew I was very grateful to get I worked very hard to get him I was very grateful to get in. And when I got there I felt belittled. Because the only reason I stood out with this tutor was because my hair was a particular way and whether or not I had a boyfriend so I was very very demoralizing extremely demoralizing and it fed into. A more general culture of both sexes and and results in a not just in the university but among a section of the students. I was I was at university probably about the same time as you were what I remember about the time was that the the students unions were were very active in terms of women's rights and in terms of. Your own self of self being in your hands ownself of importance as a person yourself but what was the university like in those days was do you think it's you said that the the problem was is that your personal tutor and your tutor was the same person but what would you have been listened to if you would raise those concerns back then and do you think that's changed. I have no idea. And I think part of the problem was that it would never have occurred to me to raise those issues because they were never raised by the university and it was never made clear to us that they were issues that needed to be raised and I think the culture of sexism was rife I know that I wasn't the only they were students having affairs with with. Certainly. Not me but I know of other students who had affairs with tutors and there was also that there was a time when I was at university where one of the colleges which was at that time an all men's college was thinking about allowing women in and the nickname for this particular college is the House and the student strong a huge banner across the quad reading a woman's place is in the home not in the house and I had my tutorials some of my 2 tours in a college and I had to walk under that insult every time I went into the college so the feeling was. That this was a systemic thing it wasn't something that you would even have thought to. To raise with the college and or the university because it was pervasive and systemic throughout the University of the throughout university like and I was a would have called myself and you but I would call myself back then a feminist so it wasn't that. That I was I was unaware of feminism but the whole. Culture was such that these things wouldn't have been raised and since I. Since I came forward and named this person or talked about this person. Students who were studying with me said Oh I remember you talked about him at the time and this is 30 years ago so clearly it stuck in their minds and someone else such as someone said to me oh yeah we used to joke about in didn't we and now I realize that the joke was very sad the jokes were very sour and very sad but at the time we felt our only recourse was to turn into a joke and he was a joke he really was in the in any college and he was drunk a lot he would turn up to tutorials drunk so it wasn't just sexual misdemeanors he was a terrible to turn around now we've we've taken a decision we're told before we came on or. We've talked about the now or not to name him tonight because we haven't been in touch with his family. And we agreed that that wasn't the right way to go but I have to ask you why no and why name him now. Well. I think as far as why now. I think a lot of women have been revisiting. Earlier experiences in the wake of the Harvey Weinstein scandal and coming forward and I haven't used the hash tag me to but I know that a lot of women have used the hash tag me too and one of the reasons I haven't used the hash tag meeting is that for me I felt that. Any accuser needs to be held responsible as responsible for their accusation as the perpetrator does for their action so for me it was important that if I was going to say anything and and I was in a position to name this person that I would name them. That I would take that responsibility and I feel that I'm aware that many women it's not possible for all kinds of reasons for them to do that but for me that was important and I did it. Knowing that he has family and. Knowing that if they found out that would upset them unsure whether or not they knew about his behavior but I think the the the red mist really rose up for me when. I saw the obituary of him. Being described as but loved and respected and I mean this is one of our great supposedly great institutions and I can absolutely assure you that he was not loved and not respected by the majority of the students who studied under him certainly in my year I don't know how many of those were subject to his misbehavior . At one point he had access to the student bar and he stole. From students. He was out of control he really was he would sit in the tutorials even when he was dressed he would sit in the tutorials with or a mug sitting next to him and the mug never had any tea or coffee in it the mark and I'll call it is not alcohol I am not offending him at all but it does seem that he had problems as well I'm not going to be helped I'm sure he did have problems that could have been helped and he he should've taken the opportunity to get help for them well or kind of help was available but hey you know that wasn't my I was a student when you use his name how does I feel. That Lansing a boil really. I'm glad to be able to particularly the Particularly they name I'd forgotten his nickname actually until I named him and once I named him it came trotting back and I thought oh yes of course you know we all called him this and so it made it more extraordinary to me it kind it was a it was like it was evidence to me that this didn't happen and when I. When I discussed it with friends of mine who were contemporaries at college they remember too that the nickname even though they were cheated by him so great they didn't they didn't have the same experiences but he doesn't even say it was it was absolutely an open secret and not all that not all that secret because he would be weaving around the college in a state of the need relation very often very publicly so has this process you said been lancing a boil it has it been cathartic do you move on now from this. It's been very cathartic what I really like to come from it is I'd really like other people to. Also to feel that they can share their experiences. Not necessarily with that tutor but maybe with other tutors and particularly I think boys because I think it's particularly difficult for men to. Come out into the open and say that they were subject to sexual misconduct from predatory older men tutors in the case of Oxbridge and I know it went on and I think that by naming people we end the shame around the issue I don't feel ashamed. And I feel. That justified in naming. My abuser. Even though I know there's a great responsibility in doing that and I haven't done it like Mel McGrath talking to me a few minutes ago Time now for 30. Lines from anyone this is b.b.c. 5 Live time the latest news the name Smedley reports found that the n.h.s. Could have avoided the cyber attack in May If basic i.t. Security steps have been taken the national It Office estimates the want to cry ransomware led to the cancellation of around $20000.00 appointments Catalonians are waiting for the outcome of 2 parliamentary vote 2 to be held later the Spanish government will decide if it's going to remove the region's autonomous powers the Catalan parliament may declare independence opponents of President Trump or have criticized him for failing to offer additional money to treat drug addiction Mr Trump has declared a public health emergency of America's addiction to opioid painkillers but stopped short of calling a national emergency which would have generated federal funding and the authors of a un backed report say they're confident the Syrian government's you staring gas to kill more than 80 p. . People in a rebel held town in April present to Sat have previously denied responsibility for the chemical attack let's get the sport now with James Buffett former Rangers manager Ally McCoist thinks the club should bring back Walter Smith and Graham soon ness. Was sacked after just 7 months in charge he won 14 of his $26.00 games but McCoist thinks a couple of familiar faces should be welcome back to the best man for the job and the best man for the job should get the job of us not go I think David Moyes obviously has a fantastic reading the I should go out there but why not go to Oak why not going to some guy was just right I agree I'm sure to take over they were told in the shade on what they want to do because Shelly who is to have the qualities is going out of respect of the truth to call I'll backlash if I can just about club also in football the draw for the quarter finals of the League Cup has been made Championship sides Bristol City will welcome hold as Manchester United Arsenal take on West Ham Leicester at home to Manchester City and Chelsea host Bournemouth elsewhere having initially been ruled out Prop Joe Mala is set to be available for England selection in the upcoming autumn internationals Meanwhile Exeter backroads Sam Simmons has received his 1st England call up a rugby union reporter Chris Jones how small He's been one of the players in the Premiership 22 year old Eddie Jones likes his work rate so you know he's got a good chance to go sneaking into one of these much they scored he scored the most try to make the most metres and beat him the most defenders by a forward in the Premiership this season's of so he's got his reward I think what we're seeing in the back row especially 2 years to go to the Woke up a bit of a changing of the guard now Lewis Hamilton says he's not thought about as winning the Formula One world championship just yet the most a he's driver will claim his 4th title with just a 5th place finish in this weekend's Mexican grown Prix but insists it hasn't yet crossed his mind I've not really thought about it that much to be honest and not really sure why I think. I've just been enjoying the moment of the last race I felt great after winning there and. I'm really just focused on trying to do the same again I enjoy the weekend so much I enjoy driving in the race so much so that's what I've been looking forward to but just not really thinking too much about the fact that we can win it this weekend boxing and Anthony Joshua's says he wants to attempt to become the 1st man to hold all 4 world heavyweight titles the 28 year old's i.d.f. And a champion faces off against car last tack at Cardiff's principalities Stadium on Saturday but the w.b.c. And w.p.s. Belts still elude him these things that kind of make it hard to achieve I think that's what makes it so. Like that like that diamond in the Treasure trying to get to that poor gold at the end of the rainbow if we can make it happen I'll be all for it if not if not if not it's not your little world and it leaves a record to break for someone else so you guys are going to have exciting times in the future and England open up their rugby league World Cup campaign against joint hosts Australia in the morning live coverage on b.b.c. 25 Live Sports Extra from 10 o'clock this is b.b.c. 5 live on digital online smartphones and tablets a good morning to you why it's on the weather front service morning it's really not an awful lot happening today and it promises to be beautiful autumns day for most of us there is a little bit of cloud just across the south of the u.k. So here say anywhere around core more depth than maybe just about the southern counties could be a bit of cloud 1st thing this morning maybe even a spot of drizzle but that's pretty much it most of us across the u.k. Should be waking up to Clear Skies although across Scotland perhaps a little bit of mistiness around maybe across northern parts of England as well and it will be chilly very early in the morning in the glens of Scotland just a few degrees above freezing but the far south of the country closer to the English Channel coast around 12 degrees very early and then in the afternoon lots of sunshine as promised light winds as well temperatures will vary from around 15 in London 12 in Belfast 11 through the lowlands but I will mention that it is going to turn quite windy across the far north of Scotland Shetlander gale force winds in fact by the end of Friday so Friday a quiet day a make the most of the sunshine if you can today because the weekend is looking very different in fact Saturday and Sunday a lot more cloud across the u.k. And it will turn very breezy northwesterly winds throughout the country on Saturday lots of clouds and some spots of rain almost anywhere. It's the year West but I think the best of the weather through the weekend will always be across southern and eastern areas and also it's gotten fat chick true that we can't that's it for me I'm Tomasz Africa 5 life went on. To. Be a. Killer except Mexico race creed success this. Life I. Eased to. Sanctify flight college costs listen our digital radio. Radio. 436 the time on a card with you between now and 5 o'clock the u.n. Security Council has expressed its concern over the rising tensions and reports of violence between Iraqi federal forces and Kurdish Peshmerga forces from both sides have been battling so-called Islamic state forces but as more ground is retaken from the Hardys So the rival claims on territory have come to the fore the been sporadic clashes between Iraqi and Kurdish forces since Baghdad announced an offensive to enforce security in the disputed Kurd Koch province more than a week ago he were all Xmen is a former advisor to the president of Iraq Jalal Talabani and an analyst and commentator on Iraq and Kurdistan he spoke to me earlier from Erbil and I asked him if these splintering relations in the coalition has come as a surprise to him No really if you mean the international coalition to defeat ISIS I am not surprised because it's see. That this whole coalition was all the put together to defeat ISIS and now ISIS is on their own or is on its way out militarily and the usual American think thank you very much and the coalition is over and that leaves Iraq and Kurdistan at this area where we're frankly they are. They had a piece that was set up and an hour and a coexistence that was set up. What was it set up for was it what was it a real piece there or was it just. Has a bigger enemy to fight about stage Well initially this new Iraq came about the idea was to create a new federal democratic pluralistic Iraq where all people feel equal this idea failed miserably and the Kurds tried to go their way by going for a voting for an independence. But then the night of the Americas nor the Iraqis nor the neighbors were supporting that and the Americans and the others allies made sure that they send their message to tell them that you were because they told them that you will regret it the Kurdish leadership seems not to have heeded these warnings and thought that they are allies at the end of the day but. They they did not. They delivered on the on their warnings and they made the Kurds regret I think the vote. In effect doing at the moment have a land grab by both sides no there is no land grab Now the Kurdish forces withdrew back to their areas where they were in control of before 2014 in 2014 ISIS came and took over large areas of Iraq the Iraqi army failed and collapsed back in 2014 the areas that the Kurds advance to were areas controlled by the Iraqi army they moved in to protect these areas from ISIS now the Iraqi army is back there the Kurds moved back but it seems that the Iraqi army wants to go beyond the lines of 2014 and this is where the Kurds are resist. In certain areas so we'll look at the referendum now the referendum the Kurds held last month has been a source of huge concern for the states in which the territory falls Kurdish leaders offered to freeze the result of that referendum but the Iraqi government rejected that offer why did they do that well to be honest I'm in freezing the results is the most that I believe the Kurdish leaders can do because if they say we are canceling the whole thing it will be insulting and humiliating to the entire population that went out and voted the location of the rejection was very interesting because Prime Minister about the rejected the the could ish. Call for dialogue and for freezing the results out of Tehran I can feel that there has been some Iranian influence over that decision and the the idea behind it is that the situation becomes more complicated and the Iranians eventually would walk in and fix the situation between a real and back that how do you think that fix that well they will come in with a proposal for dialogue they could say Ok let's shelve the election they did their referendum results for a while and let's work on how on a better relationship for the future because practically speaking by the Kurds saying that they are willing to freeze their results is effectively shelving the results and if Baghdad is able to offer them anything better then they elections the referendum results will be will be canceled practically But then the Kurds cannot risk not having this on and risking going for an unknown negotiation with Baghdad without knowing what the end result is what about the role of the United States and Mr They have a peacekeeping role to play. They have the United States have the only role of the United States is that they express consent and this is what has been happening the United States does not look at the Kurds or at the others as our allies they look at them as proxies all cheap security companies that they did the fight for ISIS for them this is how the United States look at looks at this if you wish and I'm in a real and I can sense the this the feeling of betrayal amongst the people towards the United States everyone here is saying Iran has allies and has true friends and if you are a friend or an ally of Iran you are their friend to the last to the last bullet the United States treats their allies as proxies or us security companies that can do the war for them against ISIS and towards the end they just tell them just like as they took a taxi they tell them goodbye thank you very much for what you did for us I was in Bill this time last year. And at the time it felt very much. A separate country to the rest of Iraq. How does it feel now does is there it is there a concern that the whole of Kurdistan could could be in danger here that the what what is given over to Kurdistan the moment and has been accepted as Kurdistan is taken away in that the endgame here is that the Kurdistan will be pushed back I'm back I'm back I'm back and become smaller and smaller. This is the concern there Bill that you so last year is a totally different era bill today or the Iraqi Kurdistan that you saw last year is a totally different one today there is a sense of defeat there is a sense of betrayal and the people are just facing an uncertain future they don't know what's going to happen neither America nor Iran nor the neighbors none of them is giving anything positive to the Kurds the Kurds here are saying we gave all this blood all this fighting against ISIS we fought in the name of the free world but the result is we are getting the pro Iranian militias and the Iraqi army at trying to advance and advance into into the Kurdish areas and they are suffering an influx of refugees from the disputed territories there are a lot of refugees I.D.P.'s internally displaced people coming from the areas that the Iraqi army and the p.m.u. Popular mobilisation units have moved into and there is a real fear of the future of the i.d.p. Camps that were. Between Mosul and Erbil have a now disappeared or are they now being filled up with people who are are coming up from the south from the south they're still there the problem as today with the Iraqi army have just finished its Mosul venture and it's now going to move fast and now it's moving to Kurdistan this is this reminds us a lot of what happened to Saddam Hussein he finished from the Iran Iraq war and he moved to Kurdistan conducted the Anfal campaigns and everything else that sense of military victory is emboldening prime minister about the and the whole international community is like yeah. Great well done well then you control your country without any politics and without any proper plan for reconstruction or national reconciliation or services or anything else like that so it is in bold in the him I hope he has a plan but I very much doubt it he were Usman talking to me a little earlier for 45 the time in the last few minutes Australia's High Court has delivered a ruling that the country's deputy prime minister is ineligible to remain in parliament with more on that and the other stories making the news down under that speak to Phil Mercer in Sydney a very good morning to you and this is this is big news in Australian politics need just lay out the story for us. It is huge Nick the deputy pm booted out of Parliament for being a Jew National at the time of the last election in 2016 now the Australian Constitution says that subjects all citizens of quote foreign power aunts allowed to sit in Federal Parliament now Barnaby Joyce was part of the citizenship $77.00 M.P.'s whose cases were brought to the High Court or 7 were Jule Nationals at the time of the last election their defense was that they didn't know one m.p. Said that his mum had applied for Italian citizenship on his behalf and she hadn't told him and that. He was a match Canavan and he is one of 2 M.P.'s who've been cleared of any wrongdoing but what we have is 5 have been booted out of office Barnaby Joyce is the most significant he is a member of the government he is the deputy prime minister and his ex clues in from parliament means that the center right government loses its one seat majority in parliament there will now be a by election and more political turmoil for Australia was this created for this purpose though what was the the legislation put in place for was it really to to get sitting M.P.'s out of out of position. Well the argument is and it's been an oft quoted argument here that this ruling this section 44 of the Constitution was framed in a constitution that was drafted before the 1900 so it's a very old document many people saying it's just very old fashioned and ill equipped to guide Australian politics and if you look at the fact for example that a quarter of Australians were born overseas and about half of Australians were either born overseas or who have a mum and dad who was born somewhere else it's almost inevitable that since the 1st case of this citizenship saga emerged a few months ago with the Greens Senator waters resigning after she said that she'd found out she'd always been a Canadian citizen and hadn't known since then it was inevitable that others followed in those to be booted out of parliaments include Fiona Nash is a senior member of the government she is the deputy leader of the National Party now the Nationals are the junior partner in the center right coalition government here so Fiona Nash who is a jewel U.K.'s national she's been booted out along with Malcolm Robert said he was a One Nation Party senator also a Jew u.k. National and all of them said the look yes I understand I'm a Jew national but when I went to the election last year I didn't know but crucially for those 5 M.P.'s Nick the High Court has said well look ignorance is no defense and in a way you go getting in some ways people just didn't expect this day to happen that they they knew that it was around the corner but they didn't really think it would be enforced like this. Well it was interesting when the waters the Greens party m.p. She was one of the co-leaders of the greens when she fronted the media to drop that bombshell a few months ago to say that she was resigning because she just found out she was also a Canadian citizen the government here in Australia launched a huge political attack on the greens saying it was sloppy and it was a lack of Judy of care and if the Greens couldn't decide or find out if they would the nationals of other countries how on earth could they be trusted with government for example but that argument quickly exploded in the face of the government with 3 senior members of the center right administration being caught up in this citizenship saga so we understand that there are no more M.P.'s in the Australian parliament who are now Jule nationals of other countries and it's also interesting to note that the former Australian Prime Minister Tony Abbott who was born in London when all of this 1st emerged he put on Facebook or Twitter documents showing that he had properly renounced his u.k. Citizenship well before becoming an m pace it is a scandal that has dogged Australian politics since July and as we say the deputy pm Barnaby Joyce will face a byelection in the next few weeks or months but crucially Nick also legislation that Barnaby Joyce has helped to pass in the lower house of parliament could also be challenge because there will be people who say well you voted on this law and you weren't eligible to sit in Parliament therefore that law shouldn't stand so this is an almighty mess for the government to sort out here Ok let's go on to the next story that's the big over with you at the moment the criticism for the government over its decision not to establish an official voice in parliament What's this about. Well in May indigenous leaders from all over Australia gathered it or Ayres Rock this huge monolith in the center of Australia for an indigenous summit and one of the measures one of the demands to come out of that Aboriginal Congress was a demand for the government to establish an official voice in parliament representing Australia as original peoples now indigenous leaders said it was extremely important to address Indigenous disadvantage that this body be established a formal voice in parliament that would advise and guide government policy and if you look at the statistics briefly Nick Indigenous Australians die about 10 years before everyone else they suffer disproportionately high rates of poverty ill health imprisonment and unemployment so indigenous leaders were saying that this formal voice in parliament would help to address these problems that have beset Indigenous Australians for many many years but now the government is saying that it doesn't think this particular measure would pass a referendum if it was to be voted on by the Australian people said the Prime Minister Malcolm Turnbull saying that this indigenous voice in parliament will not be going ahead it has created great consternation among indigenous leaders as you'd imagine and also the Greens party leader Richard Diena Tali is insisting that Aboriginal voices in Parliament should be hurt that I want to be front and center in decision making and that's not a big I don't do things for us do them with us we need to make sure that there is a strong Aboriginal voice represented in your stride in Parliament at the heart of decision making so. They want to go on to another story is big concerns about the police in New South Wales criminalizing children what's this about. Yes this is apparently a blacklist a secret blacklist held by the New South Wales police it's the biggest force in the country including children as young as 10 Now these details have been revealed in a report by a group called the Youth Justice Coalition and it reveals a little known strategy of the New South Wales Police called suspect targeting a management plan or s t v and this involves according to this report individuals as young as 10 years of age being repeatedly visited at home by police officers subjected to frequent stop and searches the police here in eastern Australia Nick say that this particular strategy is designed to prevent crime academics and lawyers believe that it's having exactly the opposite effect by criminalizing children as young as 10 by treating them like offenders when they've committed no offenses it's worth noting too that some of the individuals on this particular list all violent offenders so far to say that in order to prevent them reoffending they are keeping a very close eye on them but the lawyers say it's those young people those young children who haven't officially been convicted of anything are being victimized and encouraged in a way to be criminals because they're being treated like one and so this the some of this work Nick is being carried out by Dr Vicky sent us now she's from the University of New South Wales and she says that one group in particular is targeted more than others they're limited to that we have in the case studies that we have to show that is that I have a representation of average people and I've representation of young people on the team pay so for example in $1.00 likely area command at one particular point in time so one month all 10 people subject to an extreme pay were Aboriginal in another likely area command a young person who was only 10 years old was subject to a team pay. Finally the reputation of the Australian capital is being given a shot in the arm Yes And usually if if you have asked any Australians you happens and will bump into about camera unless they have an affiliation with the national capital they were there or they are from there most Australians would no doubt consider camber to be fairly dull and soulless and this is being turned on its head by a Lonely Planet guide Nick listing Cambra is the 3rd top or hottest city to visit in 2018 behind Seville in Spain of course and Detroit in the United States Canberra is a city just over 100 years old and it has been pilloried for its lack of atmosphere it's home to Australia's parliament many diplomats along with lots of museums and the Lonely Planet says that revitalize precincts in the city are giving It's a new lease of life and no doubt when you look at the the lists created by the Lonely Planet they are designed to pardon the pun gonna publicist and also make headlines designed clearly to raise eyebrows although one columnist here in Australia said that those eyebrows would be raised high enough even if you'd said that camera was the number 3 city to visit in Australia let alone everywhere else what's it like you've probably been there dozens of times is it is dull I mean it has a reputation of being frankly just a lot of concrete and things that is it changing. Well to put this in perspective I'm from Swindon it will try the big Swindon Town fan and I remember doing an interview. In Sydney a couple of months ago with an academic or business person I can't remember who it was but she was fairly well to do and she was from the United Kingdom and we were just chatting before the interview and she asked me where I was from and I said Swindon and she looked at me as if she just treated in something in so I'm so well aware that certain places in the u.k. Have have reputations so I'm not about to disturb reputation of camera but it can be a little bit dull times there are many many roads lots of roundabouts and a distinct lack of people times but if you drill down there are gorgeous museums there it's home to a science museum called quest to call on and if you like that sort of thing you can visit the old and new Parliament House and it's also in the bushes Well you can often see kangaroos roaming in the in the parks and that's something you clearly don't see in the big cities of Sydney and Melbourne and presumably the authorities in Camber delighted with this. I magine they would or can't imagine they would get too much international praise and Canberra is where it is because once upon a time Melbourne and Sydney 2 cities that don't trust each other couldn't decide where the capital was going to be so in the end they built it in between the cities it's not quite equidistant it is closer to Sydney than Melbourne but crucially it does lie in the bush and it is a very relaxed place but as far as most Australians are concerned it is not the sort of place that they would like to go with a spare weekend up their sleeve film assert thanks so much take Harry self that's over in Australia and that's about it from me and the teen on up all night thanks to Paul Sophie James and Craig keep me on you for being up all night with me morning reports this next. March for this c.b.c. . It's 5 o'clock this morning reports on 5 Live I'm Liam Sadly our top story this morning a cyber attack which crippled parts of the n.h.s. In May could have been prevented if basic security measures had been taken according to an independent investigation there are still all its office is warning the health service and the Department of Health to get their act together in the wake of the wanna cry crisis here's our technology correspondent Rick effulgence Now this was a global attack which saw computers around the world locked up by these ransomware software but the n.h.s. Says this report really just wasn't prepared for it a 3rd of n.h.s. Trust across England where hits about 900000 appointments ended up being canceled including 139 cancer referrals. And the National Audit Office says the hospital's infected by the ransomware could have prevented that if they'd installed a patch they'd been warned about that and they'd failed to act there had been a plan a national plan to deal with a cyber attack but it hadn't been communicated at a local.