jack kemp is the book, "bleeding heart conservative who changed america" the author is with me now. i don't know if he would stick by boehner. you guys know better. but many conservatives say he abandoned the cause. >> hated real discord. he didn't like it when newt gingrich and the conservative opportunity society went after jim wright who deserved it. >> he didn't like even going after the other side. >> he was a policy guy. he believed about fighting about the level of ideas, not personalities and so on. and i think the whole idea of shutting down the government even over big issues would have been anathema to him. >> he would be anti-shutdown? >> he would be anti-shutdown. but he would be pro boehner, but he wouldn't care much about it look how kemp succeeded, not like ted cruz has tried to do with your calling the leader a liarnd you're fighting and the