relationship. they weren't always necessarily close allies, were they? >> not at all. when he was secretary of energy, we kept a low profile, got out after two years. i would like to read you what he said in 2015 about trump, quote -- he offers a barking carnival act that can be best described as trumpism, a toxic mean. mean-spiritedness and nonsense that will lead the rep party to perdition if pursued. no one be mistain, trump's candidacy is a cancer on conservatism. >> he did not mince any words at all. then became energy secretary. >> correct. >> jamie, thank you very, very much. let's continue the conversation with jonathan karl, the chief correspondent, and author of" "betrayal." what's your reaction to that
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