Transcripts For CSPAN Susan 20240705 : vimarsana.com

Newsworthy and interesting highlights of our key coverage. Eez points of interest anytime online at cspan. Org. And now susan rice reflects on her time as President Bidens domestic policy advisor, she talked with jonathan of the Washington Post as she prepares to step down from her position. She speaks about her proudest moments, the biden administrations inclusion initiative, and also weighs in on the debt ceiling debate. The capehart podcast on Washington Post live. I am jonathan capehart, associate editor at the Washington Post. Susan rice has been the United States ambassador to the United Nations and the National Security advisor, both to president barack obama. This friday, susan rice ends another impressive stint in Public Service, this time as the director of the Domestic Policy Council under President Biden. And joining me now for the exit interview is ambassador susan rice. Ambassador rice, thanks for coming back to capehart on Washington Post live. Ms. Rice its great to be with you, jonathan. Thanks for having me. Mr. Capehart i think this is your third time on my podcast, so thank you very much for coming on so many times. Lets deal with something serious, and this is part of your portfolio as a member of theas the director of the Domestic Policy Council. May 24 is the oneyear anniversary of the mass shooting at robb elementary in uvalde, texas. In response to that and the mass shooting 10 days earlier in buffalo, new york, at that at the grocery store, that bipartisan Safer Communities act passed a month later, and its the most significant piece of Gun Legislation in 30 years. What is this law meant to accomplish . Ms. Rice well, jonathan, as you said, it is the most meaningful gun safety reform legislation that weve had in almost three decades. It does several things. First of all, it provides unprecedented resources to communities, to schools, and support for Mental Health. It imposes greater conditions on background checks for young people under the age of 21 who may be seeking to purchase a weapon. It invests in Community Violence intervention programs, which are very effective efforts to reduce violence on our streets and at the Community Level by using trusted messengers who can diffuse conflict and support community reconciliation. It also provides a vehicle for an executive order that the president issued in the month of march this year, which will enable, through executive action, the broadest expansion of background checks allowable without new legislation. So there are many ways in which the bipartisan Safer Communities act is a meaningful piece of legislation, but the reality is, jonathan, its not enough. And as you can see from whats happening in our communities every day, were reminded just this month of the horrific tragedy in buffalo, as you mentioned, and then today is the anniversary of the shootings in uvalde where we lost 21 souls. So what is still needed is for the congress to fulfill the remainder of its responsibility, which is quite considerable. President biden has done more than any president to date to improve gun safety and take executive action. Hes reined in ghost guns and stabilizing arm braces, which turn pistols into rifles. Hes put Strike Forces in place to try to disrupt the flow of guns from various communities into our cities. Hes cracked down on rogue gun dealers. But at the end of the day, we still need congress to reinstitute an assault weapons ban, a ban on highcapacity magazines, to implement National Red Flag laws and safe storage laws, and to ensure that we have universal background checks for all gun sales. So there are many steps that congress can and should take and that also could be taken at the state level as well that would meaningfully improve safety in our streets. And the irony here, jonathan, also is that the vast majority of American People support commonsense gun safety legislation on bipartisan basis, and so do thosea majority of gun owners. So the failure of republicans in congress to be willing to do more in this space is really out of step with the bulk of the American People. Mr. Capehart and to put a finer point on it, the latest poll i saw was from fox news that didnt just show a majority of americans supporting various gun safety proposals, but an overwhelming majority. Were talking north of 80 percent majority of americans supporting commonsense gun safety legislation. Theres another sad anniversary that we are marking, and that one is tomorrow, may 25th, and its the third anniversary of the murder of george floyd. You shepherded an executive order that was designed to address issues around policing and race, and you built an Improbable Coalition of Law Enforcement leaders, civil rights activists, and families of people who had been killed by police to support it. First, what does the order do . Ms. Rice the order does a vast number of things, jonathan, but let me back up and give that to you but also to give our audience the context. You will recall that after George Floyds horrific murder, there was work in congress on something called the George Floyd Justice and policing act. It passed the house of representatives in 2021 with President Bidens very strong support, but it stalled in the senate largely because, again, unfortunately, republicans were not interested in seeing that legislation enacted. That legislation would have banned choke holds, noknock warrants, mandated body cameras, changed and restricted the use of force, and implemented a number of very important and commonsense reforms, not only at the federal level but at the state and local level. Now, without legislation, President Biden has the ability only to mandate those sorts of reforms at the federal level. So the executive order, which the president signed a year ago tomorrow, mandated that the federal government also ban all choke holds, revives and restrict the use of force and implement policies across all the federal agencies to ensure that we do that, restrict noknock warrants, mandate the use of body cameras, ensure that there is a federal Law Enforcement accountability database so that when there is police misconduct, that it is available for Law Enforcement agencies to check and make sure theyre not hiring somebody from another agency or locality that has a known record of misconduct. There are so many things that this order does from improving our Data Collection to improving the standards of training, helping officers who have wellness issues and suffering the stresses of the job achieve the support that they need, helping our communities recover from the stress of gun violence as well as of interactions that have been so counterproductive in many cases with police. And so what was remarkable about the executive order is that it really was a product of a collaboration and a coming together of civil rights groups, very importantly, the families of victims of police brutality, and Law Enforcement themselves. Many, many Law Enforcement organizations partnered with the all of those groups and with us to help to craft this executive order in a manner that garnered broad support across that spectrum. And tomorrow we will be releasing a detailed update on how we are implementing that executive order. Weve been hard at work over the last year making sure that we are meeting as many of the deadlines and requirements of that order as we possibly can, and we will report on our progress tomorrow. Mr. Capehart and tomorrow being thursday, may 25. Another element of your extensive portfolio has been to infuse Racial Equity and justice within federal agencies. How do you go about achieving that . Is it something how does it look in practice versus the effort that it takes to actually get it done . How much intentionality has to be a part of achieving those goals . Ms. Rice well, a great deal. So let me back up and explain. On President Bidens first day in office, he signed a historic executive order infusing equity in everything that the federal government does. What do we mean by that . We mean by enabling underserved communities, whether they are communities of color, rural communities, lgbtq communities, disabled communities, people who have been underserved, to have their perspectives and needs addressed by federal programs and policies. And so for everything we do, whether its how we collect data, how we devise our budgets, how we structure our programs, we want to make sure that we are getting to those people who may otherwise have been left behind and have historically been left behind. And some people misunderstand equity to be solely about race. Thats not accurate. Its about helping all sorts of people and communities that have not fully benefited from the tools and the support of the federal government to be able to access that support. So we are doing much more in terms of consulting with those communities about their needs. When we think about putting together the president s budget or new program and policy initiatives, were trying to ask ourselves, are we designing these things in a way that gets to the needs of those who may have been left behind . So to give you a couple of examples, the bipartisan infrastructure law that was, as i said, bipartisan law signed by the president , investing hundreds of billions of dollars in improving infrastructure, had elements in it like ensuring that there is Broadband Access in every household, in every Community Across the country in an affordable way so that kids dont have to go sit in mcdonalds parking lots in a rural area or in an internet desert in an urban area to be able to do their homework. So as we implement that bipartisan infrastructure law, were being very intentional about making sure that the resources go everywhere and particularly to those places where that have been historically underserved. Another example in that same legislation is this law should ensure that we are able to remove lead pipes and lead service lines, so we dont have more flint, michigans, and challenges like we see in jackson, mississippi. We want to be sure that as we do what we are able to do with the resources we have, that we are doing it intentionally in a way that benefits everybody. Mr. Capehart mmhmm. Youre the first person to be to have been domestic policy advisor to the president of the United States and a National Security advisor to the president of the United States, and so i want to get your perspective on this particular pressing issue. Now, i know youre not involved in the debt ceiling negotiations, otherwise, you wouldnt be sitting here right now ms. Rice that is correct. Mr. Capehart right now talking to me. But i want to tap into your Foreign Policy and National Security experience here because im just wondering, what does this degree of brinksmanship over the full faith and credit of the United States have on americas standing in the world . Ms. Rice well, jonathan, if the United States were to default on its debt for the first time in our history, it would have extraordinary ramifications and implications for not only our standing in the world but the global economy. On the domestic level, millions of jobs will be lost. You know, Retirement Savings would be devastated. There will be a recession of significant and damaging proportions. The cost of borrowing will go way up, but internationally, people will look at the United States and say not only have you acted in a selfinflicted way to damage everybody elses economy in the world, but how can we look to you for leadership, whether its in visavis russia and ukraine and our competition with china . It would be absolutely devastating, and that is why President Biden has been so clear and Speaker Mccarthy has also affirmed that default cant be on the table. We have got to find a way through this, and it is inconceivable from the perspective of our standing in the world, the power that we have, the challenges that we face on the international stage, that we would put ourselves in a position of, in effect, taking ourselves off the global stage in any meaningful way. And that damage, jonathan would not be shortlived. It would be longlasting. Mr. Capehart mmhmm. You know, again, keeping your National Security hat on, how concerned should the United States be that those other nations around the world are looking at the brinksmanship here and might decide, you know what . Maybe the dollar isnt the best currency for us to put all of our future and our Financial Systems have it based on that . Maybe we should look to the chinese. Maybe we should look elsewhere and make those currencies our reserve currency . Ms. Rice well, first of all, i do not expect that we will be facing a default. That is not something that i find conceivable. It would only be in that context that i think the concern that you raise might come to the fore. On any day of the year, i would put my money in u. S. Treasuries and u. S. Dollars ahead of any other currency and in particularly the chinese yuan. I dont foresee that just as a consequence of the negotiations that are ongoing and the fact that were still not yet at resolution. But should there be a default and again, i find that inconceivable then the risk of consequences like that over the long term cant be discounted. Mr. Capehart mmhmm. So how does a Foreign Policy expert like yourself, because thats where you started in the Clinton Administration correct me if im wrong state department, head of the Africa Bureau . Ms. Rice yes. Mr. Capehart right . Ms. Rice actually, i started my career here at the white house at the National Security council at the ripe age of 28 as a National Security council staffer, and then in president clintons second term, i served as the assistant secretary of state for african affairs. Mr. Capehart so then how does someone with the extensive Foreign Policy background and credentials that you have switch to domestic policy . What was that phone call like that you had . I think it was with ron klain, now the former chief of staff, when he called you and said, hey, madam ambassador, former u. S. Ambassador to the un, how would you like to turn your attention to domestic policy . ms. Rice well, first of all, it was a really exciting and welcome new challenge for me. The fact is, jonathan, before i got into Foreign Policy in my mid, late twenties, most of the stuff that id been interested in and that id been focused on really had been domestic. I worked on Domestic Violence issues. I worked on Racial Justice issues. I worked on poverty issues. And that was sort of where i began, and then it was really when i went to graduate school that i thought, okay, let me Study International relations, because i had expected i was going to go on to law school and be some kind of Public Interest advocate or social policy advocate, that i thought id Study International affairs and just, you know, broaden myself. Well, i got hooked on it, and i never really i never went to law school. I got my phd in International Relations instead, and i never worked really in domestic policy, even though thats, in many ways, where i began. And so this opportunity came along, and i was really excited to learn new stuff and apply the experiences and the skills and the tools that i learned with almost 30 years of working in National Security policy to domestic policy. On the National Security side, we have a very established process and apparatus for how we make decisions, and it flows from the National Security act of 1947. We have very set structures of cabinetlevel decisionmaking meetings, subcabinetlevel decisionmaking meetings, paper processes as we, you know, tee up decisions for the president , very rigorous implementation. I was, having lived that for so many years, able to bring that sort of structure and rigor of the policymaking process and some of the tools that we have used successfully on the National Security side to our domestic policymaking. And thats proved very helpful and enabled us to fire on multiple cylinders and to get many things done simultaneously. So i feel like im using very much the same muscles that i was accustomed to using as National Security advisor, for example. Im just applying it to a new set of issues, and for me, thats exciting because its been a great learning opportunity. Ive gotten very engaged and excited about all of the domestic policy issues that im working on, and at this stage in my career, in many ways, thats more energizing and refreshing than coming back to some of the same historic and intractable challenges that i worked on for decades before. Mr. Capehart okay. Ms. Rice now youre making me feel really old. [laughter] mr. Capehart one thing you didnt point out, you didnt you decided not to go to law school. You write in your book, tough love, that the thing you really wanted to do when you were growing up was to be a u. S. Senator, and so, you know, theres still time. Theres still time for that. The other thing, am i to take it by your talk about the processes and structures that you were used to on the National Security side, was the domestic policy side so chaotic that you were like, hold up. We need to put some scaffolding and some frames around this, or were not going to get anywhere . Ms. Rice well, obviously, every administration is different. What i inherited from the Prior Administration did not seem to me to be that structured and disciplined. I think in the obama and the Clinton Administrations, which i was privileged to work in, there were such structures, and there was a process, but its never been quite the same degree of rigor and precision that we have had historically on the National Security side. So i tried to bring what i knew works in policymaking from my years on National Security to domestic policymaking, and im grateful that at least in this context, in this administration, its worked. And its helped us to get a good bit of work done for the American People. And of course, President Biden, having been Vice President , having sat every day at the National Security decisionmaking table before he came to the presidency, understood those processes and i think thought that it would be worthwhile for somebody like me to be able to bring some of that experience from the National Security side to domestic policymaking. And im grateful that he had the trust and confidence in me to let me take on a whole new domain. Mr. Capehart so, ambassador rice, some rapidfire questions. Your proudest moment as chief domestic policy advisor . Ms. Rice tough one. I would say one of the issues we already talked about, quite frankly, which was bringing together civil rights groups, police, families to accomplish the historic policing eo. Im also really proud of all the work that weve done on health care to bring nine million more americans on to Health Insurance that didnt have it at the start of this administration, lower their costs. And im really also proud of the work weve done to try to tackle the Mental Health crisis, which has got to be a critical, ongoing piece of effort. Mr. Capehart your biggest regret. Is there something that you didnt accomplish that you wish you had in the time that you had, which is longer than you told the president youd be there . Ms. Rice well, again, not just a personal regret, i wish that we had been able to achieve the enactment of Voting Rights legislation, for example, and pass the George Floyd Justice and policing act. And i wish that some of the elements of the president s build back better agenda, particularly as they relate to care, childcare, home care, paid leave, would have been able to have been enacted legislatively. But all of these things and the work were that still needs to be done on guns are ongoing priorities that none of us would give up on. Mr. Capehart broaden the aperture a bit here, especially given what you said about your work on Racial Justice and social justice before you went into the Foreign Policy realm. I was just wondering, what do you make of the nationwide effort to erase parts of american history, particularly the contributions of African Americans and our experiences in this country, in our country . Ms. Rice yes, in our country. Its outrageous, jonathan. And this effort to try to erase whole segments of society from our history whether theyre African Americans or latinos or Jewish Americans or lgbtq americans, its pernicious. Its designed to divide. Its designed to undermine our National Cohesion and our ability to remain a functioning, vibrant democracy. And it cant be allowed to stand. Its really, truly an effort to tear us apart. We need to be a nation thats proud of our history. There is a great deal to be proud of. There are things there are chapters that are painful and difficult. Weve got to acknowledge and reckon with those. Thats what a great nation does. We learn from our history. We learn from our successes. We learn from our failures, and we get better and better. And those who are afraid to allow our children to learn the truth are not they have no interest in the wellbeing and growth and development of the next generation, and i question their commitment to the National Enterprise of democracy and one nation indivisible. Mr. Capehart and the greatness of our nation can be seen in just in your own family history, which you write about in your book detailing from whence your people came to right through to where you are right now. Its been reported that you dont want to be the next president of the brookings institution. Okay. Youre saying no. All right. Thats a confirmation. Ms. Rice no, im just saying its been reported. This is urban legend. Mr. Capehart oh. [laughter] ms. Rice but anyway, i love the brookings institution. I was honored to serve there as a scholar. My mother was a scholar there. Mr. Capehart right. Ms. Rice but i have not had any indepth or serious conversations about being the president of brookings, and for me, my only certainty is that i want to take some time away, enjoy my family, travel, have a great summer, and then maybe in the fall, ill be willing to think about what i want to do next. Mr. Capehart oh, okay. Because thats where that question was going. So what is the what would be the next the perfect next gig . Ms. Rice i have no idea, and thats whats so exciting about this next chapter. Not only do i not know, im not trying to figure it out right away. I really want to just take some time, decompress. I served, jonathan, eight years of the Clinton Administration, eight years of the obama administration, two and a half years in this administration, which has been an extraordinary privilege with an Extraordinary Team at the Domestic Policy Council. Ive loved every minute of it. Ive loved serving President Biden and getting to serve our country again, but im looking forward to some time with family, friends, and just sort of thinking about, you know, at this stage of my life and my career, what does make sense next . And im not trying to answer that question anytime soon. Ok, i have one last question for you. It is the most important question because in your book, in tough love, you write about your love of the democratic party. How soon after you leave that the white house we will have a going away before i leave and like all of my parties there will need to be music, and i will be very surprised if it doesnt lead to righteous dancing. And afterwards, we can talk about what comes next. But i will have more time to plan parties than i currently do. Thats the good news. One of my favorite xers of you is new years eve, it is you in the pictures of you its new years eve, and you are rocking out. Susan wright, outgoing director susan rice that the outgoing director of the u. S. Security council. Good luck, thank you for coming to Washington Post live. Congress returns nextee for legistis this and votes. The house will ronne wednesday at noon. They will consider several bills to bck widens administrations ban of gas stoves. In the sat is back in session on tsd a 3 00 eastern. Senators will continue workn more of President Bidens executive and judicial nominations including dale whole de ho to be a district judge. You can watch all ofrt congressional coverage on our free video app, cspan now, or online at cspan. Org. Watch video on demand anytime online at cspan. Org. And try our points of interest feature, aimeline tool that uses markers to guide you to newsworthy and interesting highlights of our key coverage. Online at cspan. Org. Cspan now is a free mobile app featuring your unfiltered view of whats happening in washington. Live and ondemand. 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