Transcripts For MSNBC PoliticsNation 20131010

President in talks at the white house. Boehner left the meeting moments ago, but theres one big catch in his plan. It doesnt reopen the government. The government will still be shut down. What is this . Ground hog day . John boehner sees his shadow and we get six more weeks of shutdown . This is not what the American People want. They want answers. But republicans are literally running away from the questions. Look what happened when one republican lawmaker was is asked a very simple question. Hi, congressman, would you be willing to support a vote on a clean cr to keep the government open . Republicans cant run away from this. People are hurting. All across this country. Heres what republicans are trying not to see. Theyre trying to ignore this on their local news back home. Area veterans are beginning to feel the effects of the Government Shutdown. I really have enough guilt with the ptsd and things im not over there and someone else is there in my place. And now im not being appreciated for what i have done here. And its just its real hard for me. Schools across the nation send a report at the end of each month to the state to receive reimbursement rates. With the feds shutdown, those checks have stopped coming putting some schools in a bind. I dont think the students should have to pay because we have some legislators that are fighting like children. Day nine of the Government Shutdown and more people in our area have been left without food. A child this age will never understand anything like that, anything about whats going on, anything about a reason why he just cant get any milk. A mother down to one can of formula. I know my kids get tired of seeing my cry, but sometimes thats the only thing you can do. You cant make it magically appear. Under boehners new plan, we would get six more weeks of this kind of pain. At least we could have another huge crisis right in front in time and in front of the thanksgiving holiday. Is that what americans want . To have their economy collapse just in time for turkey dinner . The bottom line is this. We got some good news today. Republicans are crumbling. The bad news is, theyre not all the way there. Yet. Joining me now are congresswoman karen bass and krystal ball. Thank you both for coming on the show. Thanks for having us on. Congresswoman, what do you think of this new gop offer . Should we just let the government stay shut down while budget talks go on . Well, i think the good news is that they have backed away. They can become realistic and recognized we are not going to deny health care for the American Public. And so we do see a crack in their strategy. And i think thats positive. On the other hand, theyre talking about raising the debt ceiling. Its not a clean raise of the debt ceiling. Because they want to take power away from the Treasury Department to use extraordinary means in order to continue functioning. And in addition, you know there is a bill they could put on the floor in the next hour that we could open the Government Back up. And we need to do all of that. But, you know, i do have to be encouraged that theyre taking some steps forward. We need to keep them moving in the right direction. Krystal, theyre cracking the door if not opening the door, but if im a federal employee on furlough, i want the door open. I want the government restored. But today, krystal, in a brand new nbc news poll with the wall street journal, it says it shows that 63 of americans believe refusing to raise the debt ceiling would be a real and serious problem. I mean, when theyre seeing almost 2 3 of the country according to this nbc wall street journal poll see this as serious, its no wonder that they changed a little of their position going in to see the president. Especially when the debt ceiling is such a poor name for it. People hear debt ceiling and think if we didnt raise that, wed spend less money and have less debt. Thats not it at all. Its actually being able to pay for the bills we already racked up. So when you see this level of interest from the American People, this many people seeing that its a real and serious problem, i think that moves the needle. I think the fact that gop popularity has dropped to record low levels, i think that moves the needle. And i also think we saw finally for the first time this week the market getting very nervous about the possibility of default. And republicans still, you know, very entrenched with the business community. I think seeing those jitters and contemplating the possibility of actually going over the cliff maybe made them pull back to some semblance of a rational position. Now, youve got with all of this going forward, you still have the republicans trying to make this point about the debt and the running well, let me show you one dramatic demonstration. Tom coburn, he used a prop, an oversized credit card, fake credit card to make a point about cutting spending. Watch this. This one shows the debt that we have as of october. It shows this expires in 10 13. Should we get another one or rip this one up . I think we ought to rip it up. But arent they really, congresswoman, talking about ripping up our economy . Well, i think they ab slewly are. Theyve already damaged the economy. And just like krystal said, this is about paying bills for things we have already spent money on. You know, i feel saddened that my republican colleagues dont get the message. You can walk around the capitol and the people that are protecting us, the people still working here are not being paid. So im glad theyre paying attention to the polls, but they need to Pay Attention to the fact children are not being fed with w. I. C. And other programs. Thats what needs to move the needle, frankly. Krystal, what is annoying to many people is they keep changing their reasons for the shutdown. First it was obama care. Then it was about spending. Then one gop lawmaker said it was about dignity. Before turning around and saying it was about, quote, something i dont know what. And Speaker Boehner says its about everything. Or maybe nothing. Listen to this. Thats a conversation were going to have with the president today. I dont want to put anything on the table. I dont want to take anything off the table. Whats that mean . Youve shut down the government. 800,000 federal employees. You dont want to put anything on the table, you dont want to put anything off the table. Whats that mean . Theyve completely lost the thread of whatever this was about to begin with. And the congressman who said, you know, i dont know what this is about. We have to get something. I think he was being the most honest here. At this point, they want something to save face with their base. And actually its important we dont give them that. Because if they have some face saving measure, thats going to encourage them to take the government hostage again in the future. And that is what at heart this is about. We have to end this cycle of sliding from crisis to crisis. We have to show them that this is not in their benefit and it is certainly not to the benefit of the American People. Congresswoman, what are you hearing about your republican colleagues . I mean, are you getting any information about whats going on in the Republican Caucus . Because were getting reports there was quite a contentious meeting today of republicans. Actually, ive been talking to my colleagues on the other side of the aisle all along. A number of them are embarrassed. They know theyre looking bad. I mean, if you think about it, everything crystal just described sounds like a childrens temper tantrum. And we have to make sure they behave properly the next time. I do think that a number of them feel because theyve said, theyve been on record saying, over 20 of them said they would vote for a clean continuing resolution today. That is what needs to go on the table right now. So im just hoping that after their meeting with the president that they will walk out and they will realize that its just not enough to say theyre going to raise the debt ceiling and not open up the government. We need to do it both and then after the government is open, after the debt ceiling is raised, then we sit down and talk about whatever it is they want to talk about. But the practical question that i want to raise, because this is just practical. If you can talk while you delayed the debt ceiling, why cant you talk when the government is open . It just doesnt make practical sense, krystal. I think the idea from john boehner is he could get the tea party part of his caucus to go along with a shortterm extension if he gave them a continuation of a Government Shutdown. That should tell you something. That it is a bonus, that it is a gift to them to keep the government shut down is an unbelievable situation. And what im really afraid of remember when we initially had the sequester, everyone thought this would be too awful for anyone to contemplate. It would be too awful to keep in place. Im afraid were in a place where the Government Shutdown is going to become the new normal. That these far right republican congressmen are not going to feel enough heat to reopen the government. So it is up to those moderate republicans who are embarrassed, who see that we need to reopen the government, they have to show some courage. That is the only way around this. Congresswoman, mr. Boehner left the white house, walked past the bank of microphones, said nothing. Just arrived back at his Office Walking past the microphones. Said nothing. I dont think he got what he wanted from the president. I mean, all of a sudden he has political laryngitis . Exactly. I guess he went in and expected the president to say, you know, whatever you want were there. But maybe hell go back and meet with his caucus. I suspect that what he heard from the president was debt ceiling clean, open up the government, and then we talk. Thats my guess. And i think thats what we need to do. Like i said, you walk around the capitol and you see people who are protecting us who are not even being paid. If they miss their paycheck and theyre late on their mortgage, do you think the banks are going to forgive them . This is our responsibility to do our job. Thats what they need to do. Well, thank you both for being here. And it sounds like theyre starting to move. We have got to keep the heat on and the pressure on. Theyre moving, not nearly enough, but theyre not where they were. If the American Public keeps pushing, maybe we can see some light at the end of this tunnel. And hopefully it wont be the train coming our way. Congresswoman karen bass and krystal ball, thank you for your time tonight. And catch krystal on the cycle week days at 3 00 eastern right here on msnbc. Coming up, the man pulling the defund obama care strings from behind the curtain is coming out. Why former senator jim demint is Speaker Boehners boss. Congressman Keith Ellison is on that next. The shutdown has proven to be the unmitigated disaster for the gop. We have brand new numbers on the results. And those results are amazing. And who is really running this party . Something remarkable is about to happen. Well explain. And friend or foe, i want to know. Email me. Reply al is ahead. [ male announcer ] eeny, meeny, miny, go. More adventures await in the new sevenpassenger lexus gx. Lease the 2014 gx 460 for 499 a month for 27 months. See your lexus dealer. For 499 a month for 27 months. From the classic lines to the elegant trim in each and every piece, kohler will make your reality a dream. Ito guard their manhood with trnew depend shields and guards. The discreet protection thats just for guys. Now, its your turn. Get my Training Tips at guardyourmanhood. Com have you joined the politicsnation conversation on facebook yet . We hope you will. Ten days into the shutdown, our facebook fans are fed up with the republican house. Ken says the Worst Congress in the history of all congresses. Jack says, the republicans dont care about the common person. Coming up weve got a brand new poll showing just how devastating the shutdown is for the gop brand. But first we want to hear what you think. Please head over to facebook and search politicsnation and like us to join the conversation that keeps going long after the show ends. The pursuit of a better life for our children is something we all share. But who can help prepare them for the opportunities ahead . Who can show them how to build on your success, but not rely on it. Who can focus on making your legacy last for generations to come . That someone is a Morgan Stanley financial advisor. And were ready to work for you. Humans. Even when we cross our ts and dot our is, we still run into problems. Namely, other humans. Which is why at Liberty Mutual insurance, auto policies come with new car replacement and accident forgiveness if you qualify. See what else comes standard at libertymutual. Com. Liberty mutual insurance. Responsibility. Whats your policy . Breaking news. The New York Times reporting president obama has rejected the republican plan to extend the debt ceiling without reopening the government. He told the republicans at a meeting at the white house no. Speaker john boehner arrived back at capitol hill just moments ago after that white house meeting. Boehner did not speak to reporters. Joining me now is congressman Keith Ellison, democrat from minnesota. Thanks for being here, congressman. Thank you. Thank you, reverend. Good to see you as always. Good to see you. What do you make of this news . They made this offer to the president of extending the debt ceiling while they talked through budget stuff. But keeping the government closed. New york times is reporting now the president said no to that offer. I think the president s right to hang tough. I mean, we had had a shutdown the shutdown rally today in the pouring rain, but still we had about 500 people come on out. And people would come to the microphone talking about the inability to pay for groceries. A man whos a single dad says he may have to go to a homeless shelter with his son. And a young mom says shes struggling and they dont know where theyre going to get their rent because theyre a twoincome family and the family depends on her income. She works for the census bureau. This cynical move where they listen to what wall street says and ignore the hard working people every day is not acceptable. I think the president is right. We understand, congressman, that at the Republican Caucus meeting today, that some republicans actually called for a clean vote. And that the vote would in turn open up the government if that vote was taken or would take place. And again, theres been resistance by boehner and others. But that some republicans in the meeting actually called for the vote. You know, there are reasonable republicans. They still exist. And god bless them. I hope they keep on getting more vocal. I can tell you one thing. If youre a moderate republican in america today, you must be feeling silenced and shut out of the conversation. The fact is, you know reverend al that eisenhower was a republican, he wasnt like these people. Even nixon wasnt like these people. Even bob dole says he didnt recognize these people. Ronald reagan raised the debt ceiling 18 times. So this crew thats in congress now is something weve never seen before. Maybe not since the 1850s or something. These guys are outrageous. Eric cantor had said the meetings were useful and they will keep going on into the night. What do you make of that . I think thats a good sign. We should keep talking. At the end of the day, the Republican Caucus says theyve got to stop playing games and open up the government and pay the debt. Were saying were here to open up the government. They need so say the same thing. If they want to talk about the Affordable Care act, no problem. They wont get 100 of what they want, but we can discuss it. There are things that maybe both sides can agree on. Theyre saying unless its all our way on the Affordable Care act, unless you deny People Health care, we are going to shut down the government and keep it shut down until you capitulate to what we want. And the leader of the band, ted cruz, his state texas has more uninsured people than any other state. Its really a scandal that a man with the most uninsured people in his state is leading the band to stop people from getting insured. That is so wrong. This is a president that seems resolute. It seems hes not looking for some kind of compromise at the expense of people. You had said today that you had a rally you participated in a rally against the shutdown. People are suffering. This is real pain. It is real pain. As a matter of fact, i was proud to see people of unions and regular citizens. I was proud to see members of Congress Standing there in the pouring down rain in solidarity with these folks. We stayed out there a long time because people are really desperate. But i think its important for us to realize that this shut down wasnt an accident. That theyve been bragging about it for more than two years. And now its here. Im not sure that the people who are playing it out, the people who caused the shutdown will be the people who reopen the government. But somebody needs to reopen it. And im prepared to vote yes on a clean continuing resolution right now. It needs to be go ahead. I was going to say, but it needs to be game free, simple, do your job. You dont get extra stuff for doing your job. It seems to me with all of the pressure that is being put to bear with the poll numbers showing how overwhelmingly the American Public are rejecting it, theyre weakening. Theyre now talking about extending the debt limit. We saw yesterday the Koch Brothers come out with a letter who were part of the group that were originally planning and talking about stopping obama care even if it meant Government Shutdown. It seems if the pressure continues and that the public continues to stand up, that we are beginning to see some cracks in the republican armor. Well, you know, heres the thing. Or at least the far right wing armor, i should say. All i want is my friends in the Republican Caucus to do whats right. Many of them, about 24, have said we should reopen the government no strings attached. Were hoping they will do that. But theyve got to find a way to break ranks with the tea party. Theyve got to find a way to recapture their own voice. A lot of people dont know this. My dad was a moderate republican. Hes proud he went to college on the g. I. Bill, but he voted for nixon. And he thought the bottom line is, he doesnt recognize these people. Hes like wait a minute, theyre going to wreck the government just because poor people are getting some health care . And its important to note, al, these folks have never wanted to extend health care to poor folks. Didnt like medicaid. Didnt like medicare. Didnt like social security. Theyd love to tear it all away. Now, were getting more details from the New York Times reporting on the meeting with president obama and the republican leadership. And theyre saying the president rejected the offer to extend the conversation to extend the debt limit while they had the conversations about the budget. With the government remaining closed. He would not accept their proposal as long as the government remained closed. But both sides, both the republicans and the democrats see this as the first breaking in the gop armor. Well, i hope so. Like i said, i dont see this in terms of a win. You know, reverend al, you dont do this but some folks in the press see politics like its some sort of athletic contest. Its not. Its real life. I dont think talking this in terms of winning and losing. The only real losers are the American People and the federal employees going without their pay. Im appealing to republicans of goods conscience to stop this and do whats right. The fact is that its wrong. And the poll numbers are showing that its wrong. American people are rejecting it. And theyre losing independents. But skip the election and skip the polls. Lets talk about whats right for the American People. And i think that if some republicans step out and help us open up the government, you know, people will remember who are courage in peoples time of need and who turned their backs. Congressman Keith Ellison, thank you for your time tonight. Thank you, sir. They must reopen the government, were being told the president said. Ahead, more details on the breaking news. President obama rejecting Speaker Boehners offers and brand new polls show a historic disaster is in the making for the gop. Stay with us. Vo irresponsible. Rep. Rokita obamacare hurts this country much more than any Government Shutdown. Vo reckless. Rep. Blackburn people are probably going to realize. They can live with a lot less government. Vo destructive. Rep. Bachmann this is about the happiest ive seen members in a long time. Vo the Government Shutdown is hurting veterans, seniors, and our kids. Now Tea Party Republicans are threatening. An economic shutdown. Refusing to pay our nations bills. Endangering american jobs. Tell them to stand up to the tea party. Enough already [ crashing ] [ male announcer ] when your favorite food starts a fight, fight back fast with tums. Heartburn relief that neutralizes acid on contact and goes to work in seconds. Tum, tum tum tum tums [ babies crying ] surprise your house was built on an ancient burial ground. [ ghosts moaning ] surprise your car needs a new transmission. [ coyote howls ] how about no more surprises . Now you can get all the online Trading Tools you need without any surprise fees. Its not rocket science. Its just common sense. From td ameritrade. 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More adventures await in the new sevenpassenger lexus gx. Lease the 2014 gx 460 for 499 a month for 27 months. See your lexus dealer. Zblmpbltss were back with more on tonights breaking news. The New York Times reports president obama has rejected the gop offer to extend the debt ceiling, but keep the government shut down. Heres House Speaker House Majority leader eric cantor speaking just moments ago. Our very useful meeting was clarifying the size as to where we are and the takeaway from the meeting was our teams are going to be talking further tonight. Well have more discussion. Well come back to have more discussion. The president said he would go and consult with the administration folks and hopefully we can see a way forward after that. Wow. Cantor seems like he wants a deal. Its no wonder gop leaders now seem more open to a deal. Because the polls show theyre in big trouble. A brand new nbc poll released just moments ago revealed just how disastrous this shutdown has been for the gop. The poll shows that just 24 of americans have a positive view of the Republican Party. 24 . Thats their worst rating ever in this poll. The tea partys doing even worse. Just 21 have a positive view of them. Thats also their worst rating ever. If this is a historic collapse. An epic rejection of a party by the American People. 70 of voters now disapprove of what republicans in congress are doing. So do they get it . Nope. We have seen now for ten days a Government Shutdown. Its not what we asked for. It is what was the result of the two parties not being able to sit down and talk. Its the result of two parties . No, not two parties. Just one. A majority of americans, 53 , blame the Congressional Republicans for the shutdown. Only 31 blame the president. These are cold, hard numbers. And the numbers dont lie. The American People have had had enough. Joining me now are Jamal Simmons and margie omero. Thank you both for coming on the show tonight. Jamal, let me try this different. The shutdown is killing the gop, isnt it . Yes. Listen, we saw this happen in the 1990s. The republicans tried this, it didnt work out very well for them. A lot of people werent believers. They werent around. They werent paying attention. A lot of these people were doctors and insurance salesmen and lawyers and school teachers. Whatever they were doing before they ran for congress, they dont really understand how politics works. At the end of the day youve got to be willing to cut a deal. The Business People in the Republican Party feel like theyre being left out and dont get to have a say. They know if we dont raise a debt limit, were going to kill the national economy. But margie, weve seen they come back with a proposal to extend conversations to extend the debt limit as long as theyre having conversations on the budget. Yet keep the government shut down. I mean, they just dont get it, i do that i . No. Theyre in a fantasy world where what theyre doing a popular and is considered to be good for the economy. Neither of those things are true. The nbc poll is consistent with what gallup is showing. Historic low Approval Rating for republicans in congress. Gallup also showed that the number one concern right now is government dysfunction more than the economy, more than jobs. This is a disgrace. What is the point, exactly . If its unpopular and people who work in the markets and Business Leaders dont think its a good idea, then why are we having this exercise . Why are we in this fight . Its completely misguided. Jamal, let me go back to trying something a little different. Lets pretend a minute you were a republican strategist and you were over there today, tonight right now and you were going to advise mr. Speaker boehner and cantor. What would you tell them to do given the standing with the public and given the fact theyve got this hard right tea party to deal with. How would you advise them to deal in the middle of this . The debate right now is not between democrats and republicans. The debate right now is between rational republicans who understand how the world works and the irrational radical republicans. They are in a coalition that has people in it who are against government. So how do you govern with people against government . My advice would be to Speaker Boehner find 30 or 40 republican who is agree with you. Get the democrats, get nancy pelosi in a room. Lets cut a deal. You decide youre going to do two or three really important things over the next year. Tax reform, immigration reform. Your speakership will be over, but youll be a national hero. Youve got to cut the cord with the crazy people in your caucus. I think jamal would be a great republican strategist. Margie, let me bring the polls back in. When you look at these are brand new polls hot off the press nbc polls. The gop is getting even more blame for this shutdown than the one back in 95. 53 blame the gop now. Back in 95, 43 blamed the gop. The public is much more worried about this shutdown than they were in the mid90s. Today 73 say the shutdown is extremely or quite serious. In 95, only 57 say the same thing. So the 1990s shutdown was a disaster for the gop if you look at the elections after it. This one looks even worse. Yeah. Its clearly a mistake. I havent seen a single solitary poll that shows more people blaming the president than blames republicans in congress. Ted cruz tried to show off a poll of his own to make some case and even his poll showed that republicans had more blame. So its unquestionable that theyre taking look. Were all losers as the congressman said in the segment before. And the president s going to take a hit on this. But ultimately republicans are the ones seen as not getting the sense of urgency for the people that are affected, not getting the urgency for our economy. And thinking this is a game as brinksmanship, as a political partisan game opposed to something where theres a lot of stake where were talking about actual real lives and food and medicine at stake. I know somebody sitting right now over at the white house hwh is floating credit card bills and hoping this is going to be done by the first of the month so they can pay their rent. This is having real impacts on real federal workers. And thats the real problem they have. The politics of it is also very interesting because democrats have already started campaigning on this. A Progressive Group has released a new tv ad in gop districts attacking lawmakers for supporting the shutdown. Watch. Sean duffy joins Tea Party Republicans in congress and shut down our government putting hundreds of thousands of americans out of work. Slashing head start for thousands of kids, putting benefits for seniors at risk, denying cancer treatments for kids, and halting food inspections. Economists say sean duffys tea Party Shutdown could weaken the economy and devastate middle class families. Now, were heading into the 2014 midterm elections. Polls are saying 39 would prefer a republicancontrolled congress. 47 would prefer democrat democraticcontrolled congress, jamal. They are heading into the midterm elections beginning to take a real political beating on this. Ill let margie hop in here, too, because at the end of the day we know what happened last time. The way the republicans have redistricted these districts, even though the majority of americans voted for democrats last time, republicans still won the majority. Even though weve got these numbers, theyve got this builtin safe zone that these republican radicals are sitting in so theyre not afraid of numbers like this. Margie, quickly. All right. Well im out of time. Jamal simmons, margie omero, thank you both for your time. Thank you. Still ahead, why is Michele Bachmann talking about impeachment and thuggery . Who runs the Republican Party . Something is happening tomorrow that reveals the answer. Thats next. With an innovative showerhead plus wireless speaker, kohler is the proud sponsor of singing in the shower. Cashback concierge, here. What is a cashback concierge . Well theres lots of ways you can get cash back. Im here to help you get the most out of your cash rewards. Its personalized, and its free. I want that. We have a concierge at discover, we treat you like youd treat you. Get the it card with cashback concierge. [ male announcer ] maybe youve already heard what theyre saying about the nissan altima. And we have to admit, that its all true. But dont just take their word for it, check it out for yourself. The awardwinning nissan altima. Nissan. Innovation that excites. Now get a 179 per month lease on a 2013 nissan altima. Now get a 179 per month lease on a 2013 nissan altima. Ito guard their manhood with trnew depend shields and guards. The discreet protection thats just for guys. Now, its your turn. Get my Training Tips at guardyourmanhood. Com i get out a lot. Except when its too cold. Like the last three weekends. Asthma doesnt affect my job. You missed the meeting again last week it doesnt affect my family. Your coughing woke me up again. I wish youd take me to the park. I dont use my rescue inhaler a lot. Depends on what you mean by a lot. Coping with asthma isnt controlling it. Test your level of control at asthma. Com, then talk to your doctor. There may be more you could do for your asthma. Right now 30 to 40 hard liner House Republicans are responsible for the Government Shutdown. People like congressman steve stockman. You remember him. Hes the congressman who invited a hateful rodeo clown in a president obama mask to perform in his home state. Then there are others like pall broun. Hes on the house science committee, but he thinks the whole Climate Change thing, quote, is a hoax. And lets not forget Michele Bachma bachmann. Shes been pushing the shutdown from the start. Heres what shes saying about the president. We can have an impeachment hearing in the house and in my mind the president has committed impeachable offenses. People arent going to take the thuggery of this president much longer. You are not a dictator. Yes, these are the folks demanding a shut down. Theyre calling for impeachment, they think racist rodeo clowns are heroes. But who put these wacky ideas in their heads . This is an artist, a very brave artist believe it or not, rodeo clowns. Today i declare myself officially a rodeo clown. The undeniable Global Warming is undeniably caused by human beings. It is a hoax. All of that. I dont know how else to say it. You know what these would be in past years . And i dont mean to be controversial, these would be impeachable offenses. Yep. The right wing media calls the shots. So if you want to know whos really to blame for this shutdown, its the real bosses of the gop. I dont think they should give in at all. And if that means theyre going to sit this out for o month or two months or however a long the president wants to be arrogant and not talk to anybody, sit it out. The republicans never say no. They whole party ought to be saying no to everything in obamas agenda. Bring it on. Bring it on. Shut it down. Im all for it. Sound familiar . Joining me now are former democratic congressman from virginia tom periillo hes now at the center for American Progress action fund. And msnbc contributor goldie taylor. Thank you both for coming on the show tonight. Thank you. Thank you for having us. Congressman, let me start with you. You served with some of these congressmen. Are they just parodying whatever the right wingers say . You have a range of Public Servants in the house and republican sides who take their job very seriously. And i think these new devastating poll numbers about the shutdown help empower the moderate and reasonable voices left in the Republican Party. Because it shows that those voices in the right wing media and the more extreme side of their caucus were simply wrong this was a good idea. Its been terrible for them politically, and also terrible for the economy and particularly the families caught in the middle. So there are good people in the kau kiss, they just havent had the guts to step up particularly on the house side. I think the new polling numbers and others should empower them to step up more and show some courage. I want to go back to the polling, but let me ask you this, goldie. Tomorrow the right wing value voter summit kicks off. Look who the opening speakers are. The people who spearheaded the shutdown. Mike lee, ted cruz, rand paul, Michele Bachmann. And would you look at who theyre sharing the stage with . The other main speakers. Glenn beck, mark levin, jim demint the new honcho of the Heritage Foundation and founder of the far right wacky website. Thats the site that called the president a kenyan. It is. With these kinds of values, you got to wonder who these people really are. It seems to me that bullies really control the campfire here. And what has to happen is that some of these people have got to be dismissed from the circle. There is a silent majority, i believe, of moderate republicans around this country. They typically identify themselves as independents. Until that group of people comes together and coalesces as a group and decides to primary some of these Tea Party Republicans, that decides if they want to purge their party of some of these very extremist voices, then were going to have some of the same old rhetoric time and time again and were going to lose this inherent strength o after strong, twoparty system. Congressman, the polls you referred to the polls, this new poll out is absolutely devastating. Do you think the polls and the impact of the polls is something that moderate republicans can finally find if not the guts as people looking at whats going on in the country, at least the political courage for their own stand on the good of their party to stand up and say look at these polls. We cant let this go any further. I think you saw a bit of a breaking point today not with just the moderate voices but some of the more machiavellian voices in the Republican Party understanding this was a path to a losing place for them. You saw that in the offer of at least moving the debt limit. I think you see the president saying weve got to get the government open. Its important for the economy. Its the right thing to do. So i think you saw such a change of tone including how people like mr. Cantor spoke after the meeting, which was much more saying hey, maybe were on the path to a deal here. And again, we got to remember theres a very human cost, theres a macroeconomic cost here behind the politics. But unfortunately, politics is driving things up there and the fact that the ted cruz approach is costing the Republican Party so dearly is probably whats empowering, again, those who want to get this thing done with and move forward. Goldie, we heard all of this after last years election about rebranding and changing the party. Theyre down to 24 in favorability. 24 . What happened to the rebranding . I think they believed if you did not change some of these guiding, socalled principles then you could reach these people that are nontraditional republican voters. That if you didnt change the guiding principles, you can still reach them with the conservative values. That turnd out not to be true. They doubled down. They put in the middle of the table were going with our values and some of these exclusionary practices. The American People are speaking and theyre calling this kind of thing, shutting down the government, refusing to raise the debt limit, snatching food away from children by cutting s. N. A. P. Theyre calling that dead wrong. Thats why youre seeing some of the kind of rebuke that the Republican Party is getting today. Congressman, but theres no two ways about it. These guys are crumbling on the right. Theyre coming back in now certainly nowhere near as much as they need to in terms of reopening the government. But theyre coming in talking about extending the debt limit. They are making moves two days ago they said they would never make. What will make them finally come to their senses . Well, i think you see this certainly in how the congressional debate is playing out. I think its probably costing them the governors race in the commonwealth of virginia where mccauliffe is in a strong position and Ken Cuccinelli represents that more extreme wing of the party. But you also have to remember that we are actually talking right now about a budget resolution at the level of 988 which is the republican level. So at the same time that theres lots to be excited about in the future if you look at the opinions of millennials in the way this conversation is going. On the other hand, we are still discussing not just budget control act but sequester of funding. These have real impacts on the economy. Certainly i think the republicans are seeing it is going against them. But we have policy issues with real implications for families that arent yet going in the direction many want. Im going to have to leave it there. Thank you both. Former congressman perriell own goldie taylor. The white house said they had a good meeting today but they will keep talking. Well be right back. Tonight another key result from our brand new nbc poll showing the gop plan to derail obama care has totally backfired. The poll shows that approval of president obamas Health Care Law has gone up 7 since the republicans shut down the government. The republicans thought a shutdown would cripple obama care. Instead, its crippling their own party. And Health Care Coverage for millions of americans is just getting started. To treat my low testosterone, my doctor and i went with axiron, the only underarm low t treatment. Axiron can restore t levels to normal in about 2 weeks in most men. Axiron is not for use in women or anyone younger than 18 or men with prostate or breast cancer. Women, especially those who are or who may become pregnant and children should avoid contact where axiron is applied as unexpected signs of puberty in children or changes in body hair or increased acne in women may occur. Report these symptoms to your doctor. Tell your doctor about all medical conditions and medications. 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