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White house that the wall is not going to work and they should back off it? >> no. there is no feeling like that. i mean, i think everyone at the department of homeland security who has work eed on this issue r a long time, they understand that practically speaking it is not going to do what the president wants which is to cut down on both legal and illegal immigration. but they also understand what mike said is very true that this is not something the president is ever going to drop. it's part of his political identity. it's a big part of this campaign. build the wall. he's always saying that...

Two and a half years do you care when he complains? >> sure. i covered eight years of the obama administration. i cared every time the administration criticized our work. you want your work to be -- you know your work is accurate. you don't want people to challenge it, but the president's complaints about the accuracy of that story were about as correct as his, you know, assessment of where we worked. we are fully confident in the sources. we had multiple sources describing these conversations to us for the book, and look, i think as you pointed out, even fox news and most other news organizat...

Shoot migrants in the legs to slow them down. fox news confirmed some of it with an illustration of alligators. "the washington post" and other news outlets have confirmed this reporting which came from the book "border wars." the book comes out on tuesday. and michael shearer joins me now from washington. >> like, i think the most -- the bigger picture we reveal in the book is the really extreme ways that we all didn't know action your iceberg analogy suggests, we don't realize all the different ways and some of top advisers like stephen millinger were scheming and talking about, you know, ev...

His senior adviser who stood up an internal think tank in the west wing to come up with ideas to target legal immigration and that is what we'll see in the continued run-up to the 2020 election. so read the book when it comes out on wednesday. >> when this president is in crisis, he goes back to the playbook of immigration. and the book is "border wars" on tuesday if you want to buy. it i'll close with flash backs to washington's last impeachment drama. 21 years ago this week, october 5th, 1988 to be exact, the house judiciary voted to open impeachment of president bill clinton, the full house...

Should see. >> those phone calls. but i suspect we won't. julie. >> well, this past week we saw president trump sign a proclamation that would bar immigrants who couldn't pay for their own health care from staying in this country. this came just a few days after i reported with my colleague mike sheer about the president's more extreme ideas for preventing immigrants from coming across the southern border, everything from shooting at them to digging a water-filled trench with potentially dangerous reptiles inside. what we're seeing here is something that mike and i explore deeply in our book t...