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Pro quo allegation? >> well, we have not gotten to the bottom of that from a direct evidence standpoint. >> how about tieing aid to investigations. >> that's correct too. >> how about political motives inbo asking for investigations? >> um, the facts surrounding that are ambiguous. >> in a nonlegalistic world, when we talk about nonspeculation we use words like gossip, rumors and innuendos, right? >> and isn't it true that the only direct evidence that we have is ukraine received aid without giving anything in return. no problem with the phone call in the relationship with and that the preside...

Anti-corruption platform, but he was an untried politician with a relationship to a controversial ukrainian oligarch. when vice president pence met with president zelensky in -- i'm -sorry, when vice presiden pence met with president zelensky ine war saw on septemr 1, he stressed to him the need for reform and reiterated the president's concern about burden sharing, especially young european allies. in late august and early accept afterly his party took control the ukrainian parliament, they passed reforms to fight corruption. these included removing par rimtrim limitary immunity. imagine if m...

Security assistance hold was related to the president's concerns about burdensharing with europe. is that consistent with the evidence that you allt uncover? >> so, it's a good question because mr. sandy did say that. but notably mr. sandy said that he only heard that in early september, that that reason was never provided to him or anybody else before early september for the b first two months of the hold. and of course it was given at that point as the gig was up, so togi speak. >> so that was after everything came out to light? >> it was -- he wasn't sure of the timing, but he was ultimatel...

Talking about burden sharing and wanting thet europeans to do more. but -- >> yeah. senator johnson was -- and president trump were pretty candid and they believed that allies like germany were laughing at us because we were so willing to spend the aid. >> right. now i would like -- you know, there's been a lot of allegations that president zelenskyal is not being candid about feeling pressure from president trump. and isn't it true that he stated over and over publicly that he felt no pressure from president trump? is that true? >> yeah. he said it consistently. he said it in the united natio...

Very brain-dead, that is insulting to a lot of different forces and we can't go around making statements like that about nato. very disrespectful. >> nato's secretary general pushing back on the statement arguing the alliance is stronger than ever thanks to donald trump's efforts to get european allies to pay their fair share. >> we are making progress on the burden sharing and your leadership on defense spending is having an impact. the fact is we are doing more together now than for many decades. >> you can see the impact in the numbers. in 2014 only three nato countries will build a pledge ...