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President zelenskyy has exhibited epic courage and he heroism. it's not clear that the russians will get the upper hand in this. >> and ben rhodes, let's talk about chemical weapons. you had to deal with that in the obama administration with syria's help, the use of those awful weapons. and the president said he thinking the threat is increasing, that there is a real threat, increasing threat, apparently of chemical weapons. what should the u.s. and nato do? >> well, first of all, i think it speaks to what general allen was saying very well, putin is bodled in a dangerous way, but a putin who ...

I have no doubt we are entering the end game because the middle game, the attempt to take ground to make major advances has deteriorated into a stalemate. russia cannot win. cannot achieve its objectives and it's looking now for a way to scale back to more moderate positions while still maximizing its leverage at the bargaining table. they are at the negotiating table. russia will keep killing people. the ukrainians will fight back viciously so, yeah, the russians will pull back, retreat, give a space but they'll keep fighting and so will the ukrainians. neither one can win. there will have to...

There's definitely something about leadership and the importance of leadership, because if you ask people to do difficult things, and often things where they could lose their life, you're hardly likely to do it if you're not positive in your approach. but of course you have to be realistic and pragmatic. i'm fundamentally not political in my approach. behind closed doors, i'm very clear with policy makers about we can and cannot achieve. in public, i don't necessarily reveal my advice, because it's not my position. i'm going to try to be positive when it's appropriate to be. you said it's too ...

Achieving and for climbing that social and economic ladder. they have pulled the rug out of under these kids by doing this it's very sad and very tragic. and to be completely honest, we need to be holding them accountable for the things that they're doing now that are going to create generations of children who cannot achieve what is possible for them because of these decisions. >> lawrence: let's unpack what whitney just said, maj, this is obvious now at this point that these kids aren't going to be able to make it in the real world with this. this is just unacceptable. so, when these kids ge...

Elizabeth: that's my last question we only have 30 seconds left, but i'm curious that what can diplomacy achieve that harsher sanctions cannot achieve. >> it takes two to tango. north koreans have to launch a negotiation and they are sending mixed messages. they do other things that make this more difficult. if there are negotiations, you will get a freeze on the testing, which would be good here you are talking to each other which is important. the real dangerous miscalculation of misperception and that's what no one wants. whether they get an agreement or not can be helpful. hold your friend...