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So, look, i think it's -- in some ways it's important for barb and me both to say that what we're doing is based on what's publicly available. there could be other information that prosecutors are privy too t. but just what's publicly available, this looks like compelling proof, proof beyond a reasonable doubt. >> i want to talk about the lead story in today's papers about the attorney general going back to 2016 and now positioning this or classifying this as a criminal inquiry as to what might have take he place. could you say a little bit about ha this means th ha this means and that it's no...

What do you make of the fact that this is a 35-person list of witnesses who can presumably testify to manafort's crimes? >> so, 35 names are all the people that the government might call as witnesses, they have to put them on the list that they want to. usually like it's pared down to who actually gets called. some will likely be custodians of records who testify briefly to authenticate documents. this is very much a document case about bank fraud and tax returns. the star witness here will no doubt be rick gates. i'm sure all eyes will be on him. it will be a packed courtroom when he testifie...

Call as witnesses, they have to put them on the list that they want to. usually like it's pared down to who gets called. some will likely be custodians of records who testify briefly to authenticate documents. this is a document case about bank fraud and tax returns. the star witness here will no doubt be rick gates. i'm sure allies will be on him. it will be a packed courtroom when he testifies because he is the one who can kerkt the dots. once they get all those records into evidence, he can explain what the motives were and what makes this case criminal. >> matt miller, we didn't have the m...