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Going down. it's the same thing with donald trump. i don't think that he is seriously going to be shlepping through new hampshire and iowa going door to door, going to town hall meetings, doing all the things that you would actually have to do to win the republican primary. >> what was interesting, i brought up the bankruptcy, and he said they weren't bankruptcies, they're chapter 11s, which is -- >> reorganization. >> a reorganization. >> where you cut down on some of your debt and stuff like that. he was very sensitive to that. do you think he's going to be able to handle the business scruti...

Country many times have filed chapter 11s on various companies in order to reduce debt and do things that frankly should be done and i have done it very few times out of hundreds and hundreds of transactions, very few times. but i've done an unbelievable job by using the laws of the nation on companies, some of which i just own pieces of. so don't tell me i filed bankruptcy. i never filed bankruptcy. >> fair enough. chapter 11, i hear you. >> no, but you just said, you filed bankruptcy -- i am doing what kacarl icahn has done, i'm doing what numerous other guys , i won't mention names, you fil...