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Circumstantial evidence case. they have them on record lying, obfuscating. he has admitted to being a drug addict, to being a thief, a crook, a con man, anything down the line. but had the prosecution proven he killed these individuals, and the defense strategy was simple he to poke holes in it. ask the jury, have they proven to you that the defendant in this case was the person who committed these murders? i'm not sure the prosecution has squared that circle, and it's also a sloppy cross-examination. the prosecutor was looking for a kill shot, that aha, perry mason, matlock moment, and they c...

Who say are you kidding me? what they had to explain was the timeline. now, certainly the time line with respect to the data that the police have used in their investigation, the cell phone data had him there, the data with regard to the car, and of course his voice being heard in that tape, so he now had to explain why on earth am i here? so it was a necessary decision i think to do it. the issue is, will it be effective? that's what we're getting at. what we're seeing is the prosecution, right, trying to set up this notion that he is a con man. he is a liar. he is a thief. he cannot be trust...

To that, and at the shamelessness, the self effacing nature of his current role, the hair dye running down his face, not getting paid by trump, basically a two bit con man, speaks to his inherent character. the weakness of his character. and this piece in 1988 recognizes that giuliani is so in need of a patron, a father figure to a point time. he never really ends -- aside from his mayorship, he doesn't really run for higher office because he needs to be appointed. and he is so much that person in the shadow of donald trump. >> and what you saw in that piece, and 89 i think, which is again abo...

Became in the 21st century is this guy just looking to make a buck anyway he can, really. and to have expensive scotch is and go to the cigar bar and have pretty babes on his arm. that's what he became. and it's like a bad fictional curve. >> it's a tragedy, a fiction. to that, and at the shamelessness, the self effacing nature of his current role, the hair dye running down his face, not getting paid by trump, basically a two bit con man, speaks to his inherent character. the weakness of his character. and this piece in 1988 recognizes that giuliani is so in need of a patron, a father figure t...

That was honestly -- >> that was a little much. >> it was a little much. but i think what makes it almost easier for him to get away with it, it is so cartoonish lee evil. i think it's easy for us to sit and laugh about it, and not talk about the fact that we have a con man, a clear, obvious conman, in congress. that's part of the problem. >> the scary thing to me, again, forget the politics the political side of this, because it's obvious that they should've thrown about already. but they're not gonna do that apparently. the crazy thing to me, just watching this, this guy seems like he's enjo...