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Went up. that won't solve the problem. >> laura: joining us is economist ben stein and from new york david call handle a senior fellow of a progressive group. let's start with you, ben, you and i have been around and around on this issue before on taxes and what the wealthy should pay. but obama, i think, is trying to shift the debate. and maybe is he being somewhat successful now, right? not talking about what he accomplished in two and a half years. is he talking about what the republics are doing on capitol hill or median income is not going up. is this a successful tragedy for growing us o...

Educated as they could. you are cannot blame it into the rich. they are not going into middle class people's homes at night and taking their money. they are not doing it. >> laura: i'm not trying to pick on david here. these are facts that the robert woods foundation not a political organization studied just one example in wisconsin. see zee seen a precipitous decline under people covered in employer covered health insurance. those are small businesses. we are talking about hurting the middle class while one policy that was really pushed by president obama which, of course is health care refor...