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A standing declassification order was just bonkers. john bolton, which worked -- trump then changed the story, saying that he could just mentally declassify things, like it's a jedi mind trick. the only person that has said he had a declassification order was a loyalist to donald trump. patel was brought before the grand jury, and recorded those reports. we don't know what he said after he was given immunity after the fifth amendment. we shall see, but as far as whether this declassification order exists, of course not. the fact that mark meadows told the feds it didn't is just one more piece ...

Nothing approaching that trump had that standing order that i could snap. nothing approached that. i can't imagine anyone that worked at the white house after me would have shrugged their shoulders and allowed that to go forward. kelly making the point that we understood the rules ask we were not casual about them. therefore, the process should have been followed. >> have you ever heard of the declassification order? they have never heard it. clearly, they have never seen it, it likely doesn't exist. it really undercuts so many of the public explanations and public defenses that the trump team...

Declassified. i declassified everything. >> he thought it into declassification. what do you make of that? >> yeah, i'm sorry, that's not how it works. and this is not me saying it. there were three different cases that came out during the trump years, one of which i lost in which trump made these verbal orders of i'm declassifying x, y, z, every single time it got pulled back. the justice department pulled it back saying it wasn't an actual declassification order. the courts rejected it each time saying there has to be a process followed, the simple verbal assertion isn't enough. thinking it ...

They're going to the judge and saying hold off on that part of it and let's get to some other part. but i think what we learned from today's hearing is how little hand they have. they have to drop the classification thing. and i think they know it because they're throwing everything else at it. they're attacking the national archives referencing a 20-year-old scandal involving sandy burger. they know it's inevitable they're not going to get to the classification stuff. they're even asking, weirdly, to declassify the papers so that they can know what's in them, which is an admission that they'r...

Records belong to him. they were these protracted negotiations to even get these documents back. you know, is it just the fact that these documents were gathered and were in possession of outside a secure facility? or does intent have to be proved? >> well, intent matters to prosecutors a whole lot. and, shawn's right. see, although the statutes involved here, and there are three of them do not require the documents to be classified, some proctors want to show that they were classified. they want to show that trump's so-called declassification order was bogus. because these cases generally are...