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Ceiling as it is, there's no money to pay the tax refund. >> right. as you pointed outer, this debt ceiling issue, $16.4 trillion that you're going to exceed, and they'll use, quote, extraordinary measures or tools they have available to -- >> greta: let's face it. if you don't have any more money, you have no more money -- you can't even borrow, have no more credit, that means you're cooking the books somehow. >> exactly. republicans have said, we're willing to work with you on the fiscal cliff issues, on the debt ceiling, all those things, but we have to do something about what's causing the...

Of view this meeting was a disaster, an opportunity to try to draw the sting out of the opposition that had been expressed by senator mccain and the others. obviously went in the opposite direction, when you have all three of the senators who participated in the meeting coming out after and saying they have more questions now than they did before. this was a bad meeting. no doubt about it. and i think part of the problem here is the -- is the continued focus by the white house, by susan rice, by people looking at it on these so-called talking points that somebody provided to her. i'll just put...

View, this is a disaster, an opportunity to try to draw the sting out of the opposition that had been expressed by senator mccain and the others. obviously went in the opposite direction, when have you all three senator who is participated in the meeting, coming out after saying they have more questions now than they did before. this was a bad meeting, no doubt about it. i think part of the problem here is the continued focus by the white house, by susan rice, by people looking at it, on these so-called talk points that somebody provided to her. i will just put it this way, based on my own exp...