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It can avoid defensive systems and so on. i think in the context of ukraine, i'm afraid it isjust another russian weapon. it may indicate that they want to try it out in battle conditions. it's a relatively new weapon. it may be simply that they are running out of stocks of other kinds of missiles, but i don't think it actually alters the basic facts on the ground, which is the extraordinary willingness of the russians to bombard civilian areas indiscriminately, as well as obviously trying to take out key infrastructure targets. jonathan, what kind of risk of miscalculation is there with a hyp...

Hay out of it, you know, really exploit it to his benefit. i think it's a good thing to have those debates raging right now on the right, it's a healthy thing. howard: leslie, the journalist consensus is that vladimir putin is committing war crimes every single day and may not stop with ukraine. so they say, well, we can't needlessly to to voc putin, you made reference to the no-fly zone, but he's indiscriminately slaughtering civilians every day. >> nuclear weapons, making this into a third world war. look, he is just miles from the polish border. they are a nato nation. they're a nay -- ther...

But is now msnbc anchor, debuting here on msnbc. the name is simone, and that is simone sanders. thank you all very much for coming to "the sunday show." let's just go around the table here, sort of react to what we just heard from those two brothers, the mayor of kyiv and his brother, famous professional boxer and the resolve of the ukrainian people. kurt, i don't think, i don't think putin was thinking that this was the kind of reaction he'd be getting from the people of ukraine. >> no, it's very clear that he thought this would be a walk in the park. that within 72 hours he would own ukrain...

Also incredibly physically demanding and mentally draining. i'm starting to think they won't even be able to encircle kyiv. again, that blow struck against an armored regiment. the russian in that clip that you played earlier is also reporting that the regimental commander was killed. that's an strard blow. you add that to the other casualties. the other losses of armor and personnel and so forth. you just can't keep sustaining that kind of loss. the column from the east in particular, where this was ambushed is so long and so vulnerable given the logistical lines required for that that there ...

The centerpiece of any negotiations. would it be israel or finland or maybe china? although like you, i've used that as a long shot. i always thought that turkey would be a clear player, that president erdogan would be the middle person. we now see him stepping into the space. the more potential partners we bring together, i think the more we're advancing in the next steps of reaching resolution. but i also don't think -- this isn't imminent. we're still, i would argue, weeks away, at best. >> of course, a final thought by me, it could be a subterfuge by putin to give the appearance, he's ente...