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Temperature down a little bit and look at another industry like advertising. they have what's called the general market. then they have over here the multicultural. gays, black, lesbians and asians. what's happening now is the new general market. that new general market is made up of the gays, blacks, latinos and asians, and a chunk of whites. the market is the new consumer. >> you're saying this is very structurally the way advertising thinks about it? >> the manifest to that is it happens in tv film and theater as well, too. we see the general market, the old general market is what's being c...

Fox's empire. now the biggest phenomenon on tv. all those shows and a whole lot of others including scandal, have created an appetite in hollywood to cast more nonwhite actors in the pilot season. according to deadline a new approach comes with pitfalls. pilot 2015 the year of ethnic casting, about time, or too much of a good thing. describes the plight of all the poor, underworked white people in hollywood. are this is from the article. as is the case with any sea change, the pendulum might have swung a bit too far in the opposite direction. instead of opening the field for actors of any race...

Actors in this year's pilot season. according to deadline, a new approach comes with pitfalls. the article's headline says it all, pilots 2015: the year of ethnic casting about time or too much of a good thing. describes the plight of all the poor, underworked white people in hollywood. i'm only slightly exaggerating. this is from the article. as is the case with any sea change, the pendulum might have swung a bit too far in the opposite direction. instead of opening the field for actors of any race to compete for any role in the color-blind manner, there are a significant number of parts desi...

That didn't have a more diverse cast. i think it will continue to benefit going forward because it changed their thinking a little bit. still i have to get back to the idea, all the people making those decisions are the same people, they're all white. >> so that is this new general market. but the thing that hasn't changed is this. we've seen this, you know, rise and growth in the new general market, and yet what we haven't seen is the leadership, and the people who make those decisions. that hasn't changed. >> you saw that when chris rock was doing all those interviews around his movie. he sa...

Artistic director of the classical theater of harlem. great to have you both. gavin, you bro a great piece in 2012 the logic behind hollywood's resistance to black entertainment. which was a sort of i think a different cultural moment then. but why has it been difficult at other periods for films that are about folks that aren't white to get made or tv shows? >> that's really simple. people have a tendency to want to make film product about things that they really understand, and that they connect to. unfortunately, and wrongly, the people who run major entertainment companies, in the big medi...