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Demonstrate, which is that he wants to say that he's innocent. he has to also make the people who were part of his kind of grander scheme, also innocent. the deterrent won't work if the ultimate outcome is that you see that you can get away with it on the right side of the strongest man. >> that is exactly right. precisely the kind of existential stakes here. which interestingly, really run through that sentencing document by the department of justice. danya, they're really quite pointed about what we are dealing with here. basically, the question of are we going to allow political violence li...

Most of the times he gets into trouble and there's a civil matter. sometimes it can bee1 settled a he decides to fight it and hg3 wastes a huge amount of time when it should have just been settled. but these are marching towards trial. the e. jean carroll case is coming up. he inçó october is facing a hug huge case with the new york attorney general. potentially $250 million. that's what they're seeking. i don't sense that thereok is a move to settle that. and that will be hugely damaging toe1 him if it goes against him. and that's over the valuation -- where he's inflatingok assets, he want...

Right now is fighting what's called the covering force battle happen. they're doing is sending out small units well ahead of the main body of forces they have. we know there's about 60,000 troops, three divisions that they have in reserve there, in eastern part of ukraine. and they're sending out these small units to probe and find weaknesses in the ukraine military and force the ukraine military to use resources against them. i think this is all part of a grander scheme. there's no question russia has the initiative right now in that region. and this is a part of an offense that's likely star...

Seriously right now because especially because he's' nor mussily respected within the department. >> let me talk more about the dispute. i guess on the conservative side, you had a riot. let's look at the riot, right? then weissmann goes on to talk about a multipronged conspiracy, what prosecutors term a hub and spoke conspiracy in which the ellipse speech and the january 6th attack were one spoke of a grander scheme. he said if you look at it in that context, it strengthens, as you say, any future cases. who do you think is right here, harry? >> i haven't been inside the department, but i'm l...

It's the most serious one the doj can bring. >> doj also brought the same charges against the oath keepers. in the indictment yesterday it noted there's a meeting between the proud boys leader and the head of the oath keepers in a d.c. parking garage on january 5th. during this encounter, a participant rerchsz referenced the capital. that's detail. is it meaning ful that you have two groups facing seditious conspiracy? >> i think it is, and i want to know more about the background of the meeting you referenced. it's important because it isn't just the oath keepers and proud boys separately get...