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>> katie: the last time i candidate challenged the parties presidential incumbent was in 1992. president bush would go on to lose his reelection to bill clinton. what do you think? >> chris: usually it's really bad to get a primary when you are a sitting president. ronald reagan was able to find ted kennedy's speeches. difference between ted kennedy and patrick buchanan is you can feel it in your bones when you hear these guys talk, in new hampshire, john kasich telling everyone he was the prince of light, that title has been taken. you don't look like jesus to me, john. i see jeff flake up ...

Leakers. and doing it in such a colorful and sort of -- i guess you could say transparent manner. one thing you have to say as a journalist, i think it's great that these guys talk, and they talk in a sort of frank manner. >> sure. >> you know, i talked to him this afternoon before the piece posted because i wanted to make sure he knew that, you know, this was coming out. and wanted to see if there was anything he wanted to say. and, you know, it was -- it wasn't the easiest conversation i've ever had. i don't think he's happy about it. but he agreed with me that the conversation was fair game...

Known him, how can you look at him any other way but a racist at this point? how do you -- how do we get him off the hook and say, well, is there any other way to slice and dice it at this point? >> about two years ago on "politics nation," i kept hitting him on the racial implications of the birther issue, which he was championing. and he and i talked, because i agreed, disagreed, marched on him and have disagreed, but he and i talked. i met with him. and he said, you can't call me a racist, and i said, the birther issue is rooted in racism. and he argued about it. now he's done from birther ...

First, jenna. >> well, the campaign very quickly reacted though and acknowledged that this was a controversy that he did have. they brushed it off as being locker room banter and he sort of apologized for it, saying that he apologized if anyone was offended by it. but there are already a lot of people on twitter saying, he should denounce these comments. he should say that he should have not said these things about women. >> jenna, i want to ask you, with as a woman, just -- take your reporter hat off. as a woman, can you excuse that and say, well, guys talk -- i don't know if you're a mom or ...

Florida, sears about pennsylvania, serious about ohio, serious about nevada. colorado and virginia, they think, are in the bag. >> so ken, really quick, with the trump campaign pulling ads from where they're pulling ads, does that say to you they're giving up on those states? and how could that possibly make sense, if true? >> now you're asking me to make sense of trump campaign decisions. if i was trying to make sense of decisions, what the thinking would be is, north carolina, ohio, they have to win those anyways. pennsylvania is the pivot point. that's maybe where ads matter at the margin, ...