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Security secretary kirstjen nielsen because he feels she's not tough enough. >> thanks so much. tom nichols, thanks for being with us. i need to clear one thing up. jay caruso sent me a message and said that you hate led zeppelin. we just want to mark that down as a lie here and give you a chance to defend yourself. >> i've been outed on national television about led zeppelin. i have to admit it, i've never been a led zeppelin fan. >> oh, gosh. >> i know. it was nice being with you. >> tom, i was willing to -- >> i guess it's over. >> i was willing to stand up for you on the boston debut, but ...

♪ it's more that n a feeling ♪ welcome back to "morning joe." it's wednesday, november 21st. with us now, the inspiration behind the boston pump, professor and author of the book "the death of expertise," his expertise is the rock band, boston, especially the debut album. we bring you tom nichols. also, jonathan la mere. executive producer of "the cirrus," john heilemann. a rock snob who will take issue of any praising of boston. also, the president of the council on foreign relations, richard haas. former deputy national security adviser to president obama, ben rhodes. and nbc news capi...

She does five-hour boston rock blocks on her show. tom, i have a tweet from yesterday, where we thought we were going to be talking about a lot of the news of the day. instead, you said in your tweet you were going to be coming on here to, and i quote you, to reaffirm the awesomeness that is boston's first album in the face of repeated slurs against its greatness. we have rock snob heilemann standing by. you go first on the awesomeness of boston. >> my views are my own, and not the views of the navy or the government, except when it comes to the first boston album, which no rational person cou...

>> tell the students, hate america. what say you? >> did i trash the first boston album at some point that i've forgotten about? >> no. you're just a snob. >> i see. >> rock snobs hate boston. >> oh, not me. "more than a feeling," baby. >> okay. >> i think joe was setting us up, john. >> okay. well, this is crossfire, but this is not. i was expecting a fight here. >> i'm sorry. >> joe, i don't get crosswise with the naval war college. i just don't. >> you shouldn't. so, john, this is going to be a very sharp turn, but it seems to me, we saw yesterday in donald trump -- and it is hard to really...