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If he is a business guy, why have birther talk that sounds intellectually crazy. >> there are so many issues involving washington, but not about obama. they're about congress. i don't know, i -- >> don't shrink from my question, why is trump throughout selling birtherism if he is going to deal with other smart business guys who make deals with him? >> look, i think he is off the reservation with that. he makes sense when he comes on on tuesday mornings, but the academictives i talk to are far more concerned -- >> you're dodging -- you're concerned with not mentioning this guys name, right? i'l...

We have chuck todd and john heilmann. he wrote the cover story on the obama campaign strategy, that's what we were going to talk about but we have to talk about this. bring us back for this. those covering him in 2004 in those small rooms in iowa and in new hampshire, he was a force to be reckoned with. it was emotional, populism like never heard before, and now here he is facing 30 years he was facing today and he is still free. >> let's not forget if bob had gotten his way in 2000, it would have been gore verses edwards. he was one of the short listers

Trial? >> no, and i think the reminder is just how hard criminalizing campaign finance and these laws. that's the real world listen here. john edwards does not have a political career. the fact that he's desperate to get into public life still and from what i understand what he is saying, that's what he wants. he ought to go. >> he reminds me of a trial you read about around the world these kinds of trials they hold when you lose, the guys who win president you up for trial, it's just really tawdry, the whole thing. i never like the smell of this case. thank you chuck todd and john heilmann. m...

That's the real world listen here. john edwards does not have a political career. the fact that he's desperate to get into public life still and from what i understand what he is saying, that's what he wants. he ought to go. >> he reminds me of a trial you read about around the world these kinds of trials they hold when you lose, the guys who win president you up for trial, it's just really tawdry, the whole thing. i never like the smell of this case. thank you chuck todd and john heilmann. more on the trial as we continue to program. and why do voters, here the jurors, push back when there is...

Let's go to two of our big heavy weights. we have chuck todd and john heilmann. he wrote the cover story on the obama campaign strategy, that's what we were going to talk about but we have to talk about this. bring us back for this. those covering him in 2004 in those small rooms in iowa and in new hampshire, he was a force to be reckoned with. it was emotional, populism like never heard before, and now here he is facing 30 years he was facing today and he is still free. >> let's not forget if bob had gotten his way in 2000, it would have been gore verses edwards. he was one of the short liste...