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Too late, sweetheart. >> reporter: dr. foot says that mr. breen is a perfect example of a patient who needed an urgent appointment with a primary care doctor, and instead he was put on a waiting list. >> if you died waiting for your appointment? >> they could just remove you from that list and there was no record that you ever came to the v.a. for care. >> pretty convenient. >> pretty sad. cnn has obtained e-mails showing top management, including the phoenix v.a. director knew about the actual wait times and knew about the off the books list and defended the use to her staff, which makes this...

For health of the v.a. was not being told the truth about the secret list. were you made aware of the unofficial list in any part of your look back? >> mr. chairman, i was not. >> reporter: congress has now ordered all records in phoenix, secret or not, be preserved. that would include the record of a 71-year-old navy veteran named thomas breen. >> this is unbelievable, drew, incredible reporting. this waiting list for care, secret or not, must still exist which means vets must still be waiting to see a doctor. what is the v.a. doing about it? >> anderson, later, they sent us yet another state...

Hospital in phoenix, arizona to hide as many as 1600 veterans. waiting many months just to get a doctor's appointment. cnn has learned at least 40 veterans left waiting for care, many who are on that secret list are now dead. and what is worse? according to multiple sources, the management's plan included shredding the evidence to hide the fact there was a waiting list at all. >> we've heard as many as 40 veterans here in arizona in the phoenix area could have died waiting for care. >> that is correct. the number is actually higher. >> reporter: dr. sam foot just retired after spending 24 year...

Stunning. >> this was all planned and it was planned by the very highest authorities here in phoenix. >> correct, this was a plan that involved the director, the associate director, the assistant director, the chief of nursing along with the medical chief of staff. in collaboration with the chief of has. >> basically, you have medical directors cooking the books? >> correct. >> reporter: the phoenix's off the books waiting list has gotten the attention of the house veteran affairs committee, the chief has been investigating delays in care at veteran hospitals across the country. in a hearing t...

Writes. "and we are open to any collaborative discussion that assists in our goal to continually improve patient care." sam foot says that response is stunning. >> this was all planned and it was planned by the very highest authorities here in phoenix. >> correct, this was a plan that involved the director, the associate director, the assistant director, the chief of nursing along with the medical chief of staff. in collaboration with the chief of has. >> basically, you have medical directors cooking the books? >> correct. >> reporter: the phoenix v.a.'s off-the-backs waiting list has gotten t...