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Church doctrine and their own life experiences? their own consciences that are leading them in a different direction. whether there's a majority of catholics in america who support gay marriage, those who call for a greater role for women in the church, who are less opposed to abortion or even contraception. how does he resolve that tension? >> well, i'm not sure you can resolve it. it's a matter of principle. all those issues weren't around 50 years ago. what has happened to our cull cha cher culture that suddenly these have become imperatives? in history, when you look at societies that come...

>> then just this week, a different tone. he said we don't have an immediate crisis in terms of debt. in fact, the next ten years it's going to be a sustainable place. congressman van hollen, why the change? >> it's not a change. they're totally consistent. right now our big problem is to sustain the economic recovery. we've seen momentum in the job market. and the last thing we want to do right now is to put the brakes on that. in fact, one-half of this year's deficit is due to unemployment, the fact that more people aren't at work. so what the president is saying is, right now, our focus sho...

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Started sliding backward and saying, well, let's don't get too carried away. but it was a very, very difficult moment for the faith, and we haven't, to your point, ana, gotten over it yet, and hopefully this pope, the new pope, will be very aggressive to see that righteousness and virtue is paramount and common denominators. >> does it overwhelm, kathleen, this issue -- when i showed the poll about the views of the church being out of touch, the ability of the church to then impact these other political debates, whether it's women in the church or abortion or contraception, which we've seen pl...