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Having litigated in the wake of the war on terror, when you think about how our society deals with what we have now? >> we think about it all the time. and there are times of panic where all of a sudden, everybody needs a solution to a problem. now, here's the reality. if you have a problem of mass shooting, the solution is restricting gun use. if you have a problem of white supremacist, the solution is to keep the president from inciting it, right? but the solution is not and really can never be to give law enforcement more tools around -- >> but that's what they want! i've seen them all over...

Succumbing to the paranoia that will produce bad policy. here to talk about that is mark fullman, vince warren, the executive director of the center for constitutional rights. is that a thing that you think about from your perch? having litigated in the wake of the war on terror, when you think about how our society deals with what we have now? >> we think about it all the time. and there are times of panic where all of a sudden, everybody needs a solution to a problem. now, here's the reality. if you have a problem of mass shooting, the solution is restricting gun use. if you have a problem o...

Conflate is we don't want to conflate the nomenclature of domestic terrorism and say, wow, we actually need to create a whole new paradigm for the law enforcement tools that we have. the law enforcement tool really isn't the question. the question is around the political will and our values. >> so i want that make sure i understand. the tool kit is there. the legal authority is there. the things that are needed to address this, to perhaps make sure that you can find folks that may be on the verge of this or planning this, you're saying that they're there legally and in the hands of law enforce...

Giving them more tools, 9/11 being one of them. >> mark, what do you think about the way to think about the phenomenon of spree shooting that we have seen, that is clearly now such a macabre, grotesque part of just like american society and consciousness. >> yeah, well, i think, look, this is a complex problem, chris. and it requires a lot of different policy ideas towards a solution. and i think the good news here is that there are policy ideas and tools that can be used effectively to try to prevent these attacks. there's a field called behavioral threat assessment that's growing and getting...

White supremacy and law enforcement, we have to understand that who things. one is that you can't actually have white supremacy without the military, without law enforcement. two, you can't have white supremacy without laws that enforce these types of things. so what we don't want to conflate is we don't want to conflate the nomenclature of domestic terrorism and say, wow, we actually need to create a whole new paradigm for the law enforcement tools that we have. the law enforcement tool really isn't the question. the question is around the political will and our values. >> so i want that make...