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Hearing about these desperate civilian evacuations, and ukraine is refusing to surrender. it is similar to mariupol earlier in the war. how did ukraine avoid a second version of that? >> likely the less important soldier go first, drone operators things that can possibly cover the withdrawal. some residents will still choose not to go, but the ukraine military will have to make tough decisions. i think they'll be able to recover this retreat to get our defensive positions, but there's certain civilians that will likely stay. >> major mike lyons, thank you very much. ja morant is away from hi...

Thousands of trapped oresidents. that's the situation in bakhmut. russian forces are on the verge of capturing that sit, but officials suggest bakhmut means nor symbolically for russia than strategically. mike lyons is here to break it down for us. major lyons, if bakhmut doesn't have such strategic value, why all these months of bloody, you know, brutal in some ways almost trench war fare going on for all these months. >> it does have some symbolic value, but the strategic value is ukraine military has used it to grind down russian forces. let mess show you something on the map here. russia i...

Eastern ukraine, but ukraine will try to make that as much of a symbolic victory as they can rather than a strategic victory. if russia were to push them out ukraine would digs in just to the west of the city and at this point in this very bloody fighting they are trying to weaken the russian forces as much as possible so that even if they did take the city, that there wouldn't be in any kind of condition to press forward after that. but the fight is still very much ongoing, russians trying to stand their ground. jim and erica? >> alex marquardt, thanks so much. joining us now to discuss ret...

To nato to be everybody but russia in europe because that creates the same problem we had during the first world war and that's what russia -- one of russia's sticking points to be, but now the situation has changed on the ground, i think that both of them need to go in at the same time, the alliance has got to be strong. and then eventually now i could even see go five years down the road, once there is a peace settlement that ukraine does get more security assurances from nato eventually and maybe eventually ten years is in the alliance itself. >> major mike lyons, thanks so much. >> thanks....

Sending fighter jets to iran. that relationship between iran and russia e o oh iran has been sending kamikaze drones and ammunition here to the russians in ukraine, that relationship deepening in a fast and disturbing way, director burns rp said. >> alex marquardt, thank you very much, in dnipro. let me bring in retired u.s. army major mike lyons. so good to see you t. cia director saying putin is pursuing military aid from china and possibly even iran. what's your point of view here? >> well, he needs two things. he needs ammunition. shells coming from china would go a long way with russia. t...