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Two of the latest in this russia investigation as we wait for these two court filings from special counsel robert mueller and his team, we're getting a new information on paul manafort today. mueller's team believes manafort is lying about president trump. this is according to the president's attorne, rudy giuliani. he said investigators told manafort they do not believe that the president didn't know about the 2016 trump tower meeting. so with me now to discuss, former white house general counsel under present, nelson cunningham. welcome back. >> pleasure. >> on this latest piece of news, doe...

>> nelson, at one point does trump's ignorance not work as a defense? >> that is a great question. first of all, it's remarkable that rex tillerson has kept his mouth shut since being shown the door in march. he was not treated very well by this white house, by this president. this was quite a coming out last night in houston, at a dinner where presumably an awful lot of prominent republicans in texas were there. tillerson might have viewed this for his moment to start coming out with his version of his time in the white house and not painting a very flattering picture of the president. thank ...

Professional prosecutors who are on mueller's team could go straight to that prosecutor and pick up right where they left off. >> lastly, before we let you go, let's just say mueller was dismissed, could a deputy prosecutor in that office -- could another prosecutor as a whistle proceeder go to congress and say, this is what we got in. >> yes, they could. mueller's people are famously operated under strict ethical guidelines. they've kept their mouths shut. they have not leaked. it would be a new thing to leak to congress or the press, anything that is happening with them. those would be extra...

Investigation may have been shaped by chit i whitaker. that will come when he is ready to close up shop. the person he'll tell is the attorney general himself. joining us now is nelson cunningham, a former prosecutor. also a veteran of the clinton house and biden staffer on senate judiciary. it's a pleasure to have you here. >> it's a pleasure to be here. >> the fact is that donald trump's main beef with his former attorney general, of course, was that jeff sessions recuse himself, presumably stopping him from impeding the mueller probe. now president trump has his rory cohn, presumably, his m...

Meaning, we do not know if he has any conflict of interest. we also don't know what's going on behind closed doors with regards to whitaker's oversight of the mueller investigation. if matt whitaker were hindering the inquiry right now as we speak, would we even know? that is the subject of the latest op-ed of a former prosecutor in the southern district of new york. in it, he writes, there is no real time mechanism of disclosure of interaction between whitaker and mueller. yes, some day under the regulations, we may learn details with whitaker and any effort to interfere, some day, mueller wi...