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And then in this particular instance, i think we could have reacted much better and faster to this. it is simply because the anarchy, as how we have come to define it, came in the guerrilla form. you know, it didn't simply erupt because there was an act of spontaneity, people are angry, they are burning things. it was organised, well—orchestrated by people who had their weapons of destruction, petrol bombs or whatever they had... right. ..to target, to target certain attorneys... i understand you want to talk about the orchestrators, or as you've called them in the past, the terrorists. i un...

You know, jumping into the bandwagon of looting. because of their vulnerability, which in the main majority are just innocent stand—byers who justjoined the hype, but the orchestrators of this, from the calls, the mobilisation on social networks, it had all the characteristics of an attempt on undermining the democratic state and mobilising for its overthrow. in essence, you seem to be saying, pretty much as your president said, that this was some sort of well—planned, organised insurrection. you're pretty much calling it an attempted coup d'etat. the insurrection is an ultimate end of.......

Were attempting to do this and they did notjoin. on their own, they will overthrow this government if they want, but they didn't. and that's how the plotters and the orchestrators were defeated. they were defeated by the power of the people, and later on, complemented by a decisive action by the state deployment in the affected areas. we have to mention former presidentjacob zuma at this point. he, of course, has in the past been one of the most important operators within the anc intelligence operations. he has, thanks, of course, also to his role as president, very strong connections througho...

And they did notjoin. on their own, they will overthrow this government if they want, but they didn't. and that's how the plotters and the orchestrators were defeated. they were defeated by the power of the people, and later on, complemented by a decisive action by the state deployment in the affected areas. we have to mention former presidentjacob zuma at this point. he, of course, has in the past been one of the most important operators within the anc intelligence operations. he has, thanks, of course, also to his role as president, very strong connections throughout the security and intelli...

And then in this particular instance, i think we could have reacted much better and faster to this. it is simply because the anarchy, as how we have come to define it, came in the guerrilla form. you know, it didn't simply erupt because there was an act of spontaneity, people are angry, they are burning things. it was organised, well—orchestrated by people who had their weapons of destruction, petrol bombs or whatever they had... right. ..to target, to target certain attorneys... i understand you want to talk about the orchestrators, or as you've called them in the past, the terrorists. i un...