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Quality and had internal discussions about it, they tried to unwind what piece of the transaction they still owned in some of these entities, and there are e-mails and suggestions that employees were kind of applauded if they were able to get it off their books. now, the bottom line is, every single day, an investment bank has to sometimes take transactions that they don't want to have on their books. the question is, was some of that misleading? but let's not forget, the credit rating agencies should be held accountable and the smoking gun of those e-mails is incredible. >> you know, sunny, i...

Were selling was junk and that's why they shorted against it, they bet against pinpoiit. and that is information that the investors should have known. at least, that's what the s.e.c. is alleging. so absolutely, they were misleading, they misled investors, they misled their clients and i think they're going to be held accountable. i'm really interested in what blankfein is going see tomorrow in front of this committee, because i don't think he can be transparent at all, because there's a pending case, pending litigation. and i would be surprised if he didn't get sort of the enron, very chilly ...

So it was that simultaneous transaction, which is what a lot of people are calling into question, and whether or not, in fact, they were betting against the ultimate buyer of this structured product. >> that's a very good description. >> complicated. >> the best i've heard. but, sunny, you're a former prosecutor, you've worked on security cases like this. now these e-mails have surfaced. that's new, as joe johns pointed out, in which goldman executives essentially acknowledged betting against the real estate bubble. i mean, is that illegal? is it amoral? how damaging is this? >> well, it certa...