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Dpos but did so totally different. >> which is my point, austin. they bungled it. they rushed it through. and that's why you are seeing the president come out and delay certain pieces of it. some suggested maybe before the cake is brought out of the oven check the recipe and postpone babying the whole thing. can you name me any democrat who is running on his or her support for obama care as the primary platform which they would like to be elected. they are not running to it, they are running from it. >> it is a fair point. i am the policy guy. i am not watching the races. i know there are many...

Dpos but did so totally different. >> which is my point, austin. they bungled it. they rushed it through. and that's why you are seeing the president come out and delay certain pieces of it. some suggested maybe before the cake is brought out of the oven check the recipe and postpone babying the whole thing. can you name me any democrat who is running on his or her support for obama care as the primary platform which they would like to be elected. they are not running to it, they are running from it. >> it is a fair point. i am the policy guy. i am not watching the races. i know there are many...

Director grilled in congressional testimony about why they haven't talked to any of the victims. why haven't they interviewed any of the people and groups who have been targeted? we're going to look into it. not sure. we just confirmed moments ago as of this afternoon investigators still have not spoken to any of the victims. their question in the slow role in this investigation, this as there are new revelations today the top political aide to the i irs, doug shulman is listed in the white house visitor log more than 310 times. 310 times and over 100 doug shulman went himself. joining me now ...

Questioned why he went to the white house over 100 times and now find his deputy listed on the log over 300 times. that guy is not a tax guy, lars, he's not a tax expert. he's a political aide, a policy guy. the question is does this tie the irs to the white house more intimately than we knew and is it going to raise even more questions about who ultimately is responsible for this? >> of course, it is. megyn, that's a great grab on fox part to find out those 300 visits. you're right. the white house visitor's log doesn't necessarily indicate he went there. there's smoke here and i have a feeli...

Staff going there over 300 times, perhaps, who is not attacks expert? he's a political aide? >> because whenever a member of the senate or house or anybody else goes to the white house unless it's a secure briefing or any member of the administration, chances are their chief of staff probably goes with him. that's how it's done. >> he has maybe twice the number of visits as doug shulman. >> or he's the one working on behalf of his boss. i don't know the answer to that. i know there's no evidence whatsoever the white house is involved in this and nobody can produce that. >> what you said is abs...