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>> no question. the significance of michael cohen's testimony here, so no cooperation agreement, but the fact is we know that he has spent many hours with the special counsel. we know in the public statements that michael cohen has said publically, he has told friends that he wants to reclaim his name and be on the right side of history here. having michael cohen who was so deeply involved with this president through his business dealings, personal dealings, women, payoffs, et cetera, but also dealings with russia, significance for the president? >> well, you know, this is the person who knows...

Potential culpability? >> they are still questions with respect to her involvement with bill clinton getting on the plane on the conversation they have and just the general impartiality. why would hillary clinton fund this and what was the department of justice knowledge about it what was their involvement? with a partisan or were they neutral in their approach and enforcing the law? there still a lot of open questions. the mueller investigation through the email scandal are all intertwined because of this dirty dossier that was funded by the clinton campaign. >> arthel: meanwhile, former fbi ...

What he said last thursday about his financial problems and his wife's potential culpability. >> whatever she did on that will be looked at too i'm sure. i didn't do it. i didn't spend any money illegally. >> that didn't go too well. today, he came out and tried to fix it. he said leave my wife out of of it. it's me they are after they are not after my wife. they want to take me down. >> your heart breaks for a family in a situation like this. politics is rough stuff when you bring in prosecution and program corruption charges, my gosh, there's kids involved. there's family involved here. i wo...

Extraordinary act. it would be interpreted widely and quite question possibly as indicating guilty. second, the refusal of the president to cooperate itself is an astonishing admission of potential culpability. let's be very clear. if the president refuses to be interviewed, i think that robert mueller has no choice but to subpoena him. and at that point, he would quite applausely take the fifth amendment. >> finally since i have you here, i want to ask about an exchange you had a trump appointee to sit on the federal appellate court, wendi vitter. she refused to tell you, i'll play you the ta...

Extraordinary act. it would be interpreted widely and quite question possibly as indicating guilty. second, the refusal of the president to cooperate itself is an astonishing admission of potential culpability. let's be very clear. if the president refuses to be interviewed, i think that robert mueller has no choice but to subpoena him. and at that point, he would quite applausely take the fifth amendment. >> finally since i have you here, i want to ask about an exchange you had a trump appointee to sit on the federal appellate court, wendi vitter. she refused to tell you, i'll play you the ta...