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From the director joining our conversation here tonight, jeremy bash is back with us. former chief of staff to both the director of the cia and secretary of defense during the obama years. and mike crowley is back with us. senior correspondent for politico. let's hear the particular piece of sound at the top. >> there are americans, well meaning thoughtful people who think wikileaks might just be a journalistic outfit. can you. >> to me it cross as line. it's about intelligence porn, pushing out information without regard to interest without regard to the first amendment values that normally u...

Let's hear the particular piece of sound at the top. >> there are americans, well meaning thoughtful people who think wikileaks might just be a journalistic outfit. can you. >> to me it cross as line. it's about intelligence porn, pushing out information without regard to interest without regard to the first amendment values that normally underlie press reporting and simply become as conduit just to push out information to damage the united states. >> and with that intelligence porn was born as an expression entering our language. our goal here in this segment is to get to intelligence general...

Instead it becomes intelligence porn, frankly, just pushing out information about sources and methods without regard to interest, without regard to the first amendment values that normally underlie press reporting and simply becomes a conduit for the russian intelligence services or some other adversary of the united states just to push out damage the united states. i realize reasonable people struggle to draw a line and there is so far to the side of that line that there's nothing that smells journalist about some of this conduct. >> so if you could map that continuum, there are clearly membe...

Just becomes about intelligence. just pushing out information about sources and methods without regard to interest, without regard to the first amendment values that normally underlie press reporting and typically becomes a conduit for the russian intelligence to cause damage to the united states. i realize people struggle to draw a line, but certainly there's conduct that is so far to the side of that line that we agree is nothing that even smells journalist about this conduct. >> if you could map that continuum, there are clearly members of the ic who at different points in the past have lea...

Intelligence porn, frankly. just pushing out information about sources and methods without regard to interest, without regard to the first amendment values that normally underlie press reporting, and simply becomes a conduit for the russians or other adversary of the united states to push out information to damage the united states. i realize regional people struggle to draw a line, but there is contact so far to the side of the line, that nothing even smells journalist about some of this conduct. >> so if you could map that continuum, there are clearly members of the ic that have, at differen...