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Going to return to what i do. what you sent me to do in washington, d.c. >> joining me now is the contributor to the grio and co-host of msnbc "the cycle" working on a new art call entitled "presumed guilty." ari, it seems to me if you're going to get caught with cocaine, it's real good to be a congressman in the united states. things turn out pretty well. >> i think things turn out a lot better for you if you are a member of congress. if you are a white american, things turn out better for you than if you're an african-american, as you alluded to on the program before. the history is importan...

As you alluded to on the program before. the history is important this member of congress voted to say that people who use cocaine should be denied benefits. he still has a lot of government benefits, as well as government power. >> there are thousands and thousands of people, men and women in america tonight doing hard time in federal prison cells over exactly what he did. >> right. and i think, you know, to quote michelle alexander, there is nothing more than the war on drugs that has contributed to systemic mass incarceration of people of color in this country. i think this is the perfect e...

And misogynist. there seemed to be something appropriate that he had to sit there and take his medicine from an african-american woman. >> it's interesting. you wrote that he's a man not worthy of our hate, but you and i both know hollywood has glamorized whitey bulger, his story. we've seen the glamourization of his life. let's play a clip. >> show me around. flip it. >> kevin, you and i both know movies last forever. think about al capone, other mobsters. how do you think whitey bulger will be remembered here? >> well, i think he'll be remembered unlike capone, unlike machine gun kelly, both...

5:20 saturday night, local time hey had them surrounded, bull horns and firearms aimed at room 227. 34-year-old fugitives charles walker and joe jenkins had no way out. >> we made announcements over our p.a. system they were surrounded. after a minute or two, both of the fugitives came out and surrendered to us. >> reporter: the clever escaped prisoners appeared in a county court. >> jenkins, joseph. >> reporter: still waiting to be handed over to prison officials. police questioned them all night. >> there's a request you be held without bond. >> reporter: authorities told us the men had help...

Been on television interviews and might testify to that. is that enough, is that critical enough, richard, quickly before i get avery's take? >> yeah, no, i don't think it is critical. i think there's a huge gap here, fred, and i think the fact they're going to bring in jail house rats who shared prison cells with him to say he told us he used bad words to reference her. >> they're not bringing in just jail house rats. >> that's who they're bringing in, that's the evidence, yes. >> here is the evidence. the evidence is that in many first degree murder cases it is circumstantial evidence. it do...