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The government. here's why. to acquit you need 12 jurors to agree on acquittal. you need 12 to agree on convicts. in this kind of case unlikely you're going to get 12 people to agree on acquit. what you worry about is one or two sort of lone wolfers who doesn't want to go along with the program. you have a hung jury. if they're celebrating birthdays, talking about personal stuff, they're bonding, that's a good thing going into deliberations when that time comes. >> rick stengel, i said i'd get to you. i want to talk to you about this rather than the thing before because you'll have interesting...

To remember part of this whole manturian, he's outside of moscow being pet by vladimir putin every day. this idea of what maybe mueller is trying to get at eventually is manafort obviously had very direct connections with the kremlin. he was working for all the proxies for the kremlin. not just for one or two years, but for ten, 15 years. and he was working against this thing that we are all for, which is ukraine being more western rather than eastern. henry kissinger famously said, ukraine -- russia with ukraine is a european power. russia without ukraine is an asian power. putin wants to be ...

Jong-un, duterte. these guys seem to, if not have an actual affinity for thugs, dictators and strong men, they certainly don't have an aversion to thugs, dictators and strong men. they don't vana version from making money from thugs, dictators and strong men. are these guys just peas in a pod here, is that the difference between manafort and donald trump? >> basically until we find out something more concrete. it seems to me dispositionally, both of them are not constrained by any ethical kind of commitments outside of the pursuit of their own interest. and, and what follows from that is that ...