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And it seems that this would fall in the fashion of the two previous generations of leaders there in north korea, making the threat but then pulling back at the last hospital. what could -- or what do you think would north korea be willing to give up or to relinquish in order to end this? i mean they also have to win something. what's on the table? >> well, the north koreans want these propaganda broadcasts ended. they're extremely sensitive about anything that disparages their leader kim jong-un which is the central feature of these south akorean broadcasts. and at the same time the south co ...

For it. north korea takes on the world. welcome, welcome, gordon, thanks for being with me. >> thanks so much. >> what do you make of the latest incident. >> what we have is a cycle of escalation which has continued pretty deep into this series of events because you have the land mine explosions that brian todd talked about, the south korean propaganda broadcasts. north korea's counter broadcasts and now this exchange of fire. this could be serious largely because kim jong-un is in a precarious position. he needs a good incident to bolster his position at home and this is the perfect opportuni...