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Toward it and to kind of get to a position where if you win the next election you'll have something to talk about without going to this precipice of shutting down government. >> and i don't know that a lot of people would be opposed entirely to that sort -- because it seems like an overton window kind of approach to me. let's propose just burning it down, so to speak, not literally, and then if we can't get that what best tactic helps us to at least move the ball a little further down the field to our advantage? >> you've seen the house under speaker boehner vote 40 times to defund or delay ob...

A position where if you win the next election you'll have something to talk about without going to this precipice of shutting down government. >> and i don't know that a lot of people would be opposed entirely to that sort -- because it seems like an overton window kind of approach to me. let's propose just burning it down, so to speak, not literally, and then if we can't get that what best tactic helps us to at least move the ball a little further down the field to our advantage? >> you've seen the house under speaker boehner vote 40 times to defund or delay obama care. the commitment is ther...