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Consequences for russia if it invades ukraine, and in some cases for what it has already done. so what i would say is what we are devising, building upon the legislation that both senator risch wrote independently and i wrote, which i call the mother of all sanctions, is to include a variety of elements, massive sanctions against the most significant banks, crippling to their economy, meaningful in terms of consequences to their accounts and pensions, more lethal assistance to ukraine, the ability to deal with russia's sovereign debt, to look at sectoral elements of russia's economy which is l...

Terms of consequences to their accounts and pensions, more lethal assistance to ukraine, the ability to deal with russia's sovereign debt, to look at sectoral elements of russia's economy which is largely an extracting economy on energy, to sanction its sovereign debt. these are sanctions beyond any that we have ever levied before, and i think that sends a very clear message. >> senator risch, how do you get from the 1 yard line into the end zone, to keep the metaphor that the chairman just talked about? specifically, if i may, given the fact that you and other republicans, you want the sancti...

Tomorrow that we're going to be moving forward, and i know bob shares that hope, also. >> what are you going to do about the timing of the sanctions? will you say that they will not go into effect until after an invasion if that happens? or will you do it preemptively? >> that's a work in progress. but i can describe where we've come together on that, and i think it's a combination of both. bob, would you agree with that? >> i agree with senator risch. look, there are some sanctions that really could take place up front because of what russia has already done, cyberattacks on ukraine, false fl...

A difficult position. clearly he must be preparing for the possibility of invasion or reinvasion since russia did that already and in the past with crimea and with regular forces in eastern ukraine. at the same time he wants to create a semblance of calm as relates to his economy which is a challenge for him as well. so i understand that. there's a reason president biden has sent more aid to ukraine, military aid, lethal aid since 2014, $650 million. it's because you have 130,000 russian troops there surrounding three different parts of russia's borders, and you have to take seriously that the...

Opposition to his thoughts this time. >> let's talk about what you just mentioned, senator risch, chairman menendez, you're working together. the two of you are leading a broader discussion, bipartisan discussion to put together legislation to sanction russia. the ukrainians have written the two of you and the broader group specifically asking for help. so how close are you to a deal on this legislation? >> well, senator risch and i have been working with our staffs and colleagues, a bipartisan coalition both on the foreign relations committee and members off of the committee in an intensive e...