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Request for impeachment because they believe the process isn't fair, well, mueller similarly benefits from the sunshine effect of the public watching the president trying to dodge an interview that no one else in the public life would be able to dodge. >> harry, the other piece is giuliani claiming this is all some kind of trap. take a listen. >> i think what we have to get clear is the fact that a lot of people interpret it this way, well, if he's telling the truth, why wouldn't he just go in and testify? hey, welcome to the real world. the fact is he is telling the truth. we're walking him i...

Back and forth, then mueller in many ways benefits by the public nature of this narrative. if giuliani is building a public narrative so people won't come forth and delusion their representatives on the hill with request for impeachment because they believe the process isn't fair, well, mueller similarly benefits from the sunshine effect of the public watching the president trying to dodge an interview that no one else in the public life would be able to dodge. >> harry, the other piece is giuliani claiming this is all some kind of trap. take a listen. >> i think what we have to get clear is t...

Fair, well, mueller similarly benefits from the sunshine effect of the public watching the president trying to dodge an interview that no one else in the public life would be able to dodge. >> harry, the other piece is giuliani claiming this is all some kind of trap. take a listen. >> i think what we have to get clear is the fact that a lot of people interpret it this way, well, if he's telling the truth, why wouldn't he just go in and testify? hey, welcome to the real world. the fact is he is telling the truth. we're walking him into a possible perjury trap. not because he isn't telling the t...