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If they saw fit to use a taser, i think they would have used it unless no one was armed with a taser and then you could ask for support people to come in. he took a real big risk going in there. if he's supposed to act in a support role, he took a big risk getting in the midst of this thing unfold. >> it speaks to the issue of how much training was there and was there enough. that's a whole separate conversation because there is a complicated paper trail in dispute and a lot to discuss on that. tom, great to see you. thank you so much. >> any time. >> ahead for us "at this hour," an emotional ...

Heat of the moment? you know, he would lean on -- it was heat of the moment. i was trying to do what i could. we were trying to take this guy out. we didn't know he was unarmed is what he says. in the heat of the moment, as a reserve deputy is it their job to wait to get the instruction from other officers? >> again, you had had on duty active full-fledged police officers there that were in the midst of this struggle. they had him on the ground. the guy is struggling as a lot of perpetrators do when they don't want to be arrested especially for a gun charge. he was going to give the cops a har...

Deputies use to clear a scene. whatever. i've been involved in several hundred of these. i do cleanup when they're done. i take notes. i take photographs. and that's my job. >> he says he was the last car. he was way back. he was waiting to go snap photos and this whole mess came to him, which is why he had to use the taser. wasn't expecting to be there. he was. is that plausible to you? >> well, it seems as if his role as a deputy was a cleanup role. he would come in and be the cleanup guy and take photos and clean up the scene. there was clearly active scene where you have active police offi...

Manslaughter. and all you have to prove for second-degree manslaughter is that someone else similarly situated would have acted differently, would have used different care ordinary care. and i think it goes to sort of the larger question here. if you're gonna have someone pretending to be a police officer under the color of law, allowed to have a gun, they have to have the appropriate training. these deputies don't have the same training that dan bongino has. you just heard him talk about his type of training. this deputy didn't have that kind of training. should he have been in that position?...

Part in the sting operation in the first place. a lot of accusations going back and forth. ed lavandera is live in tulsa where this happened. harris' attorney is saying that bates bought himself the chance to play cop through campaign donations and through other financial support for the sheriff's office. we just saw him turning himself in. what are you hearing on the ground? >> reporter: as we saw just a few minutes ago, robert bates did arrive here at the sheriff's office in tulsa to turn himself in. they're in the process of doing that as we speak. he's being charged with second-degree mans...