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Involved in that and tried to stop the investigation by offering pardons, you show the american people the precedent with regard to nixon, you show them what the constitution says, then you begin to persuade the majority, the overwhelming majority to support. >> there is a link, i think, to what neera tanden mentioned, the introduction of sweeping reform legislation, public financing, automatic voter registration, ethics rules. people see this all as a response to the attack on our democracy. again, it's part of building a public case that has a broad consensus -- >> about democratic integrity...

Stop the investigation by offering pardons, you show the american people the precedent with regard to nex nixon, you show them what the constitution says, then you begin to persuade the majority, the overwhelming majority to support. >> there is a link, i think, to what neera tanneden mentioned, the introduction of sweeping reform legislation, public financing, automatic voter registration, ethics rules. people see this all as a response to the attack on our democracy. again, it's part of building a public case that has a broad consensus -- >> about democratic integrity, about fighting corrupt...

The president sort of the foisted this upon us by putting this individual in for the sole purpose of shutting this investigation down. >> larry nad ler will come in and head the committee. they're going to invite whitaker to testify. if he accident, they'll subpoena him. we don't know how he'll respond to that. signing the letter, asking that the ethics adviser, whether he's been consulted on this, whether with he's advised whitaker and what they've said. they've not had a response yet. does that stuff matter? >> i mean, you know, a lot of things seem to not matter in this administration becau...

Something statutory deferral, not immunity, important to establish immunity from deferral. but timing of when a particular litigation will occur. i wouldn't call that above the call, i would call that a timing question. >> senator: okay, that would be a long time if a president was serving for four years or eight years, given and again, i'm reading the words, we should not burden sitting president with civil suits, criminal investigation or criminal prosecution, so it feels to me that was your view when you wrote that. >> judge kavanaugh: well, it was an idea for congress to consider along wit...

Impeachment proceedings, correct? >> yes, that's correct. and also, think about -- that's correct, and think about also the fact that, you know, he would be testifying as well and providing information about other people. so, you know, we're very focused right now on the president being the person that is the target of this -- not using target in the legal sense, but the point person for these interviews, but there is a lot in those questions that relate to other people as well. so immunity doesn't take him off the hook on impeachment, and he also doesn't have the right to invoke the fifth ame...