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Pings or the small short ones that are five minutes and seven minutes and say let's focus on just the ones that we know are within the broadcast area of that box, now, the only one that's really credible as far as that to get distinguishing information is the two-hour ping they got at first. that would indicate that tpl had been towed through the broadcast range of where the pinger is. >> that gives the you the best idea? >> absolutely. >> you are buying the prime minister's confidence? >> if we didn't have the two-hour ping i would be less confident because you don't know if you're just getti...

That when this ping starts radiating out it hits the temperature layer and then it can come back down. so you've got these things. so now you're dragging your pinger through here, the tpl, and from here to here, maybe seven minutes. from here to here, maybe it's five minutes. >> i see. >> okay. >> okay. >> so you may not necessarily be -- i got a lot of lines going up there. >> you do. you're going crazy. i don't know what to do with you. let me ask you about, how does the fifth ping, the fifth ping that they do say was a false start. how does that play into this? >> okay. >> is that a huge se...

Area because any chance of hearing the ping, you want it to be as pristine and quiet so nothing interferes with that. >> the fact that they heard a fifth ping, a false alarm, the fact that they haven't heard any since the first four, that would reinforce the notion that the batteries are most likely dead? >> it's also important that the false positive, the sonobuoy may have had a hit, that's fairly common in sonar work. you look at the accumulation of evidence and how things line up. they are doing it in the right way. >> your assessment is that by next monday, tuesday, wednesday, they send th...

Couple hundred square miles. pretty miraculous. but that being said it is very important to shrink this down as much as possible because the bluefin-21 sonar is very slow, deliberate and methodical in searching. whereas the tpl, you simply drag it through the water and it listens to any signal that it might receive. the bluefin-21 is a side scanner and actually paints the picture of the bottom of the ocean so it is much more slow and deliberate and can't cover as much area. so even right now as small as we've gotten in this area it still is really not small enough to deploy the bluefin yet. we...

>> probably what happened there was the frequency or signal characteristics didn't look like the simple aviation pinger. i wouldn't want to judge them. but think about what they are built for. they are built to detect submarines which are running quietly. they are 1,000 feet and well be low the noise that is coming from the surface of the ocean. they are very, very sensitive. it is probably discounting that detection. in spite of what you have just said. will they deploy those fairly soon? >> they haven't had a tpl signal in four days now.