Satellites or venezuela or china that were responsible for fictional fraud. and so that is how prosecutors are trying to draw the picture that even if trump is claiming, it to this day, that there was a fraud that he knew better, that he was absolutely lying when he was concocting these claims. >> caitlin, the former president has been some earned to the court in washington for his -- thursday, to have any sense of how that will play out? what you will be doing in the meantime and will he actually go? >> i think that is the big question that we have not got answered yet, whether he is actually...