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Backtracking and i agree there will be indictments. i think the real challenge will be when those indictments come down, is donald trump going to protect his son-in-law and others around him with a pardon or are we going to have to rely on the attorney general of new york, eric schneiderman, to pursue the truth in justice. >> okay, thank you both so much. appreciate it. still ahead, one of the former journalists to speak with christopher steele joins me next. what steele told him about the accuracy of the dossier on president trump. of diabetic nerve pain these feet... liked to style my dog as...

Stayed in trump tower. but also kremlin espionage, which is my thing. i spent four years in moscow and i kind of fell into the mincer, if you like. i had kgb spies following me around the streets of moscow and a series of break-ins where i was living with my wife and two small kids. we had video bugs in our bedroom. i was eventually kicked out of russia in 2011. but i think it gave me insight as how the kremlin sees the world. they see it as cold war 2.0. so it's another cold war. america may have won the last one, but this time russia is going to win and it's going to use aggressive tactics t...

Trump and russia. it was already a huge scandal. this was december, 2016. i heard that steele had expertise so i went to see him. actually if i'm honest, he was very tight lipped. he didn't say huge amounts. he gave us a few hints. we bounced some stuff off him and then we left. while i knew about the dossier, i haven't seen it. when buzzfeed published, i thought that guy. >> did you bring that up? did you talk with him about the dossier when you met? >> the thing about chris is he's very kind of discreet. he doesn't like the limelight. he doesn't even enjoy hanging out with journalists. that'...

New details about the controversial russia dossier and the former british spy behind it. in a new book, a journalist describes meeting ex-spy christopher steele just weeks before that dossier became public and that journalist says steele gave him clues about where to take his research into possible collusion. joining me now is luke harding, foreign correspondent for "the guardi guardian" and author of "collusi "collusion, secret meetings, dirty money and how rush oo helped donald trump win." congratulations on that. this book looks at many figure, key figures in the russia probe but i want to ...

That stuff is dynamite now because it corroborates classified intelligence and classified intelligence also verifies what steele says. it's going to be fascinating hearing from him. >> he is -- you know, what did mccain say? the shoes to drop. he's a big shoe if he ever drops. >> big shoe. >> malcolm and david, thank you both. >> thank you. we have a programming note here. tomorrow night on "the last word with lawrence o'donnell" the author will be here to interview christopher steele and broke some of the stories. i will be watching. i hope you will be. should be interesting. up next, pre...