Transcripts For CNBC Fast Money 20240712

May including everything from Student Loans to car payments to mortgages, the number more than triple that of april its the latest sign Unemployment Benefits and stimulus checks arent enough to fully cover the expenses what happens to the consumer and the economy and the stock market its not good its something weve alluded to for a while. Go and look at wells fargos First Quarter they reported in the middle of april. They took a 14 billion loan loss provision which was up 413 year over year by the way, when they report i think in the middle of july, that number is probably going to go up again and further anecd e anecdotal proof that wells fargo is trading below tangible book value. The banks have been trying to tell the story, but the Broader Market has sort of been impervious to it until recently. Well see. Again, ill say i am not all that optimistic about where the consumer is 69 months from now. Clearly i hope im wrong but behind closed doors, a lot of companies are saying weve learned to do more with less, lets continue this moving forward. Stimulus wont last forever deferments and forbearance dont last forever what happens then . They get extended remember, were in an Election Year ugly, but its not going to end any time soon. This close to alltime highs, youve got to still be buying the market i dont think its about a program right now. I dont think its about the economy. I think you hit it last time i was on the show. Its about bridging that gap between now and when things normalize. If you can say that the fed is going to outweigh it, the stimulus is going to outweigh it, politicians are going to outweigh it and were getting closer to a therapy or a vaccine, buy the margin. Karen, what do you think . The banks obviously will see the first immediate buyin whether or not the consumer is going to pay once the deferment or forbearance period expires what do you think is going to happen well, i think we are going to see once this round expires, i agree with steve i think that bridge will get extended further some people are just not going to be able to make those payments regardless of how far the bridge goes. For a while i thought there was a disconnect between the rebound in the stock market more broadly and the rebound in the banks, which has been much more muted i think those two will need to converge at some point, whether thats the market goes down and the banks go down lei do think that a lot o the Student Loans are government backed, Mortgage Loans are government backed. I think there is somewhat of a net there, not that it wouldnt be really ugly in the interim. But i also think the banks came into this really well capitalized and i think we are going to see big provisions. We saw one the First Quarter well see more but i think thats why the stocks are here, because the anticipation of big provision. So i think that some really bad Economic Data is priced in already. Tim to the banks, not necessarily to the market. Jobless claims this morning didnt give you a lot of relief. Its kind of on again off again in terms of the macro. Its hard to disagree with everyones assessment that this is a bridge to the other side and that the consumer on the other side is probably going to be, look, we went into this at peak employment and we went into this at a place where consumers had started to see some wage growth and that was very encouraging. If you look at the stocks that have rallied in the market, yes, banks have not taken part and have underperformed meaningfully i also just think that consumers or creditors or debtors can be opportunistic in this environment. I think anyone who has the ability to withhold payment will withhold payment People Holding onto their money as long as possible is also a function of all the forbearance and all the relief thats come in here. Im not sure were getting a real read on where the consumer is able to pay these loans or whether theyre putting them off because they can i think you have to be careful on that side of this trade in the same way were talking about the consumer who in many cases is making more money with unemployment than with their regular salary there are a lot of things going on right now which distort the picture. Ppp prevents businesses from right sizing their business at least for right now. We have the stimulus checks which are sort of inflating what consumers have in terms of Discretionary Income you have forbearance and deferrals which allow consumers to not pay certain loans and maybe have a little bit more discretionary to do other things does that bridge bring us to the other side to figure out what some of those consumers will never be able to pay yeah. I think the people that came into this strong will leave strong i think theres been an overlay that if you turn on the news or listen to these programs, youre incentivized not to pay. Youre incentivized to hold onto your money i think people are i dont want to say synthetically holding onto the money that dont need to, but there are people that can make these payments that arent, there are people staying on unemployment that shouldnt and i think theyre stronger than we think they are and they will be stronger on the other side. Some subset of people without there wont be able to pay artificially right now theyre okay and they can open up their pocketbooks and retail sales can jump but when these programs end, thats over. Thats over and it has to end. Listen, full disclosure, i mean, again i think people who watch the show and i know you get tired of hearing me say it and ill say it again for the 100th time, in my opinion some of the biggest villains amongst many of the century are going to be central bankers. Go back to that Jerome Powell 60 minutes where he was asked where does this money come from and he essentially said created out of thin air that infuriates people part of this is at the foot of the fed. W pay say why should i pay my bills when they can just create money out of thin air . I dont think thats discussed enough if it happens again in terms of another round, its just going to get worse that cycle, that circle will become something you cant extricate yourself from, in my opinion. I agree with guy. Were equally frustrated as peers on what the fed has done in overstaying their welcome in the context of this question, isnt the fed going to nationalize their debts as well . I mean, are people not paying Student Loans because they think at some point the government is actually going to take them on i hate this. Thats part of Central Banks overstaying their whaelcome and nationalizing the consumer Balance Sheet. I think were going to see a lot more of that in the fall. Karen the fed is funding that debt that the treasury will need to take on. I agree with steven that its an Election Year and i think the possibility of us not getting any more sort of candy is very low. I dont want to bet against the fed even though i think th market is high given where this economy is loan defaults creating more turmoil in the economy you said this is not a good reflection of where we are. I do think the data is a step in the right direction its more of a temporary improvement. Consumers were facing an extreme amount of pentup demand so you saw a bing in may after an equally downsized april. Look where we are in the longer term consumption is still down 8 from prepandemic levels in january. On the waiver side, yes, we did add surprisingly 2 million jobs in the latest report in net were still at a loss of about 20 million to get to a longer term sustainable pathway to recovery, its going to be slow and bumpy and quite a ways before we can talk about a sustainable improvement. As an economist, lindsey, what point in time do you think youll get the data points that reflect the true state of the consumer and the economy is it a month, three months, two quarters i do think the data right now reflects the true state of the consumer, but its very volatile the consumer is in a very volatile state, dramatically shifting their spending patterns month to month it reflects the chaotic nature of the consumer at this point. I think what youre getting is when do we see more stable data points to get a better sense of the underlying trend i dont think were going to get that to closer to the end of the year or 2021 and we start to see some stability in the economy and we start to get some stability in terms of the labor market as businesses reopen back to a more normal level of capacity in the marketplace. Right now were talking about some businesses reopening, some waiting until the restrictions change to a 100 capacity. Theres still a lot of volatility in terms of how business is going to function in the marketplace. I dont think were going to see that true level of calming trend until sometime at the end of the year or next. In terms of loans, im curious as to how you take a look at this figure of 100 million loans that arent being paid in the latest month and also what the ripple effects of that are what was interesting in this wall street journal article is that they noted that in doing a credit score, missed payments are noted and are factored in but not loans in deferral of some sort. So a bank or a lender could look at the state of a consumer and may not be getting the full picture. I ask this knowing you are a former mortgage analyst. I think theres two diverging things in terms of the Consumer Sector on one hand there are millions of americans skipping payments particularly Student Loans, auto loans. This reflects both increasingly favorable terms in terms of the debt holders its also reflecting reduced financial conditions in terms of the individual and the household. The pandemic has brought millions of businesses and workers displaced. On the other hand, were also seeing americans pay down debt at this point, particularly Credit Card Debt this is more a reflection of reduced expenditures because we have been in lockdown for the past several months. But were seeing favorable Unemployment Benefits, stimulus checks, other Government Programs some americans have benefitted from that and theyre taking that opportunity to pay down debt levels. Were seeing two very different themes when it comes to the debt market some may emerge from the pandemic in stronger financial footing while others may face increased financial ruin. Thank you karen, especially the banks are preparing for the stress test next week how do you view how theyre going to do in these tests and whether or not there might be extra stresses put on them in this process this time around . Well, i think the stress tests were obviously put in place post 2008 crisis for terrible scenarios and we actually are in one. However, sort of ironic is ever the stress test were to give banks a little more room and be a little easier graders, that would be now because they really want those banks to keep functioning. I dont know we talked yesterday about the idea of jp morgan having a dividend cut priced into their options. I really dont think so. I think were going to see goodmagoo good marks across the board in this stress test i hope it helping bank equity. Tesla upping its price shares. Its interesting to see stocks trade up in todays session the chinese equivalent traded at an alltime high on record volume guy . Tesla befuddles me and i understand it but a lot of people get it and i dont. What i have seen for the past month or so is the comments going pack back to the presiden interview in january where he brought up elon musk ever since that point the stock has only gone higher in further proof in terms of how impervious the stock is, 700 at the end of may elon musk said the stock was too expensive. Now were 43 or so higher grasso, is this one of these trades where we hop on board and enjoy the ride yeah. You have to hop on board and enjoy the ride im a little concerned over the nosebleed territory, but you could have said that all the way from the price where they raised money at 767 or there abouts the stock, its ability to work off overbrought on an rsi is phenomenal if i look at the chart now, it was overbought at 1,025, traded down to 990 and worked off the overbought status. Its no longer overbought. Remember, they had a head start. We are talking about all these names prepandemic we talked about all the competition, ford, gm, bmw but all of those Car Companies took a stutter step. Tesla has been keeping at it while the other ones are making face masks and inhalers. What you have now is tesla spread the gap between them and tesla. I think you kind of ride this one out, look for support in the name its obviously around the 20day moving average is 900. So you have a lot of room between here and then but thats your exit strategy in tesla, keep playing higher and play it for a 900 exit on the way down. We are just Getting Started here on fast money. Well hear from the ceo of ripp ripple first, Kim Kardashian and harley quinn, what do they have in common need better sleep . Try natures bounty sleep3, a unique trilayer supplement that calms you, helps you fall asleep faster and stay asleep longer great sleep comes naturally with sleep3. Only from natures bounty. Can i find an Investment Firm with a truly longterm view thats been through multiple market cycles for over 85 years . With capital group, i can. Talk to your financial professional or consultant for investment risks and information. Talk to your financial professional or consultant i geh. Common bird. E. Ooh look over here something much better. There it is. Peacock, included with xfinity x1. Remarkable. Fascinating. Very. It streams tons of your favorite shows and movies, plus the latest in sports news and. Huh run the newest streaming app has landed on xfinity x1. Now thats. Simple. Easy. Awesome. Xfinity x1 just got even better with peacock premium included at no additional cost. No strings attached. Just say peacock into your voice remote to start watching today. Spotify soaring today to a new alltime high following a report that spotify has signed an exclusive deal with Kim Kardashian west for a podcast exploring her work with wrongful conditions dc comics stock has gained more than 70 prn this quarter big things happening at spot apparently grass owe, wh grasso whats your take . Its nosebleed territory. The viewer can do whatever they want because the exit is up to the customer when you look at podcasts, the headwind that spotify had was amazon because if amazon got in here, it was going to kill everybody else in the space. That doesnt seem to be happening. When you look on a chart, were not out of gas just yet but it speaks to the positioning here that no one thought it would rip this high this fast. I saw unusual option activity about a week ago thats why i bought it im staying long just a little bit longer. Guy, quickly on spot, your thoughts great call by steve if he says take the money and run, you have to listen to him check out shares of kroger falling into the red today shares of the grocery chain are up more than 50 from march lows karen, what do you make of this move i think thats the part that being up so much from the bottom is really, you know, i think theres some disappointment theyre not giving more guidance on the rest of the year. I dont know how anyone can give guidance, actually remember back a year or two ago when the amazon threat seemed to be an insurmountable obstacle. The business is doing a good job but that business has such thin margins that its not for me i dont own it. Take a look at u. S. Steel falling double digits after the company warned of Second Quarter losses the company raising 429 million for a common stock offering. The story there is a company that has enormous both gdp sensitivity but a levered Balance Sheet going into covid19 that was part of a threeyear trend really and a trend that some of this was trade war and the irony was we were protecting Steel Companies and throwing tariffs u. S. Steel went from 45 down to 5 theyre not unlike so other companies we spent time talking about in the last month that if they can raise money here, they will its about having liquidity. I believe in the trade to be clear, this is a stock that i think has a lot of kind of default dynamics priced into it and i dont even think theyre close to that. They raised money defensively but its not a trade for the feint of heart theyre not going to have the financial distress that the Balance Sheet is priced in. I agree with tim. He nailed it i was going to mention prior to all the talk about trade wars and what have you, u. S. Steel was a 43 stock headed probably to 50 all the steel stocks were crushing it. Now you see where they are a year and a half, two years later. Its fascinating quickly about kroger and i hear what karens saying, its actually a very good quarter margins were much better operating income was 950 up to 1. 4 billion now the only reason the stock is lower is because they didnt want to give guidance. I think you buy kroger on this we weakness at leaf blowers. You should be mad your neighbor always wants to hang out. And you should be mad your smart fridge is unnecessarily complicated. Make ice. Making ice. But youre not mad because you have e trade which isnt complicated. Their tools make trading quicker and simpler so you can take on the markets with confidence. Dont get mad get e trade and start Trading Commission free today. Dont get mad get e trade and start trading as business moves forward, were all changing the way things get done. Like how we redefine collaboration. How we come up with new ways to serve our customers. And deliver our products. But no matter how things change, one thing never will you can rely on the people and the network of at t. To help keep your business connected. Cool . Drop the taco. Get in the car. Does this sentra feel like a compromise to you . Wait, what. . The handling is good, right . No compromise there. Nope watch this. Umm. Bbrie. Brie brie rear automatic braking. So if this Nissan Sentra isnt gonna compromise, why should you . Youre right atta girl. The allnew Nissan Sentra. With more standard safety features than any other car in its class. Welcome back to fast money. We are learning new details tonight after a 20yearold robinhood trader took his own life kate this is an awful situation. Alex kerns telling his parents in a suicide note that he had lost hundreds of thousands of dollars on the trading app robinhood. The College Sophomore was studying management and had a growing interest in markets. Alex had racked up a negative 730,000 cash balance. But his cousin says alex may have misinterpreted what he owed it could have been reflecting the other side of an options trade that had not yet settled this tragedy underlines the risks of complicated derivatives especially from the flood of new Retail Investors were seeing this year. H has robinhood said anything about this death they have reached out to the family and they are looking into the way that they offer options trading. We dont know what that looks like yet and they wouldnt tell us any of the details about the account. But they could end up changing the way they actually do options. Like we mentioned, others in the industry have similar obligations of putting out a questionnaire or some sort of requirement and survey of what type of trader the person is and their account balance and other things like sophistication before they approve the trader for doing options. Kate, thank you kate rooney. Kerns was just one of 10 million robinhood users. That number continues to fwr sss retail trading picks up. A site called robintrack uses information from the platform to track the latest trends among its users. Its become a key resource to Money Managers and traders alike. Joining me is the founder of robintrack thanks for having me. This was your side project in college. Im wondering how you got in idea. Im a robinhood user myself i noticed they didnt give context. All we saw was the current number i saw a couple of other tracking websites in the past i saw the opportunity to do it i was just curious for the most part and robintrack was the result. I for one check robintrack almost every day to get a handle on whats going on in the retail trader brain im wondering how youve seen traffic pick up throughout this pandemic. Theres been a dramatic increase in traffic, multiple hundreds of percent of increase. Theres been a lot of people trying to get a better idea of what retail traders are up to. Casey, its tim seymour thank you for joining us im curious in term of some of the trends in terms of time of day, in terms of frequency, number of times per day and how some of this has changed since the crisis tell us what you see. So robintrack collects t s s popularity of every stock on the brokerage every hour and the number of unique accounts that hold the shares. Ive seen a lot of changes happen dramatically after earnings events or changes in price. It would be interesting to know what time of day Retail Investors, are they jumping in right at the open or when you see the most momentum in the market its very important to trading and how you want to be tactical on your own. Theres often a lot of activity right at the open and right before close that being said, the things that drive changes like news events or social media trends, yeah, it can vary a lot casey, a lot of institutions and hedge funds have expressed interest in using this data. Do you get a sense of how theyre using it and are you worried theyre using it at the expense of a retail trader that perhaps they are riding momentum and selling and letting the retail trader hang on . A lot of these big institutions get this data through other means. They get overflow directly from the brokerages the thing about robinhood is that it gives a broader access to it. Theres a lot of people collecting data or using the Data Download at the bottom of the website. At the same time a lot of these different firms and brokerages or institutions would have this data some other way. The fact that robintrack provides this is a net positive for theretail traders and noninstitutional investors. You think investors can use the data in order to trade better for themselves just knowing where the momentum is . Are you feeling in any way way concerned, the fact dwthat you an experienced trader yourself and having the sense to know that tracking this data is important, but there are a lot of newer traders in the market now. A lot of the biggest changes that you track happen in five letter stocks. Thats true so robintrack is just a tool its data. We can use data for constructive purposes you can use it to push a bias of your own in my opinion, having more data is almost always a good thing. Its just another tool in the arsenal of traders trying to get a better handle on things. Its up to them how they use it. Its a valuable thing to see how the other retail traders are acting last question to you before we let you go. Are you making money off of this im making money off advertising on the site, but i will never and have never charged money for access to data i provide all the data i collect freely and still continue to do so in the future. Casey, great to speak with you. Thank you. Thanks for having me. We talked about the arrival of the retail trader and the importance of the retail trader. I think there are a lot of different views on the impact of the retail trader on the market. We talked about the fact that dont underestimate the notion that with sports not around people are going from their sports gambling to the market. I think like him, hate him, dave po portenoy introduced a lot of people to the market, for better or worse the story that kate spoke about is a tragedy think about the number she mentioned. His account, youre talking about three quarters of a Million Dollar s on one side, potentially the offset in options on the other side. This is a young person how does this happen in the first place . Its something that tim mentioned the other day. Its one thing to have 5,000 in your account and if you lose it, you lose it, you live to fight another day. Its another thing to have 5,000 in your account and have the ability to margin it up. That could be catastrophic thats what were talking about here people should understand the difference between the two. Coming up, mall operator Simon Property may be having a little buyers remorse over its deal with taubman centers. And the changing car market inmeca ari when fast money returns. Res bounty sleep3, a unique trilayer supplement res bounty sleep3, that calms you, helps you fall asleep faster and stay asleep longer great sleep comes naturally with sleep3. Only from natures bounty. The mall deal drama heating up taubman isnt taking the deal with Simon Properties lying down, saying simon knew there was a pandemic in february so it cant have buyers remorse now simon says the pandemic has depd disproportionately affected things and it can pull the plug. Three points you want to make in defense of this deal, karen . The main one is that simon has the overwhelmingly better argument given the strength of the merger agreement, right . One of their arguments which was that they allege that simon in march knew of what their budget would be for 2020. Another one is that simon cherry picked competitors to compare simon to that really shouldnt have been competitors like a walmart or home depot. Theyre not in the luxury mall space pap the third one is taubman is saying they havent shown any reason that weve hurt our longterm ability to make money, they havent shown that so the most important thing is that theres no question simon has a very bad case of buyers remorse because this is one of the worst timed deals that i remember for i dont know how long its obviously february was not the right time to sign a huge mall deal with a gigantic price. No wonder they have buyers remorse. I still ultimately think that a deal will get done maybe its a cut deal or maybe its possibly even the original deal well see. Well get something from the court no later than august 24th but maybe sooner. Basically you think tough luck, Simon Property, that all your arguments are pretty flimsy. Yeah, tough luck. In the history of malls, february 9th to sign a deal just before the precipice of a pandemic where this is a carveout in the takeout agreement around pandemics its remarkable, tim if you look at other mall operators its a difficult time. Ill let the merger folks, this deals been pretty interesting simon obviously had a 65 move on speculation they might be able to break the deal, now some of that is coming off. For people that are assessing this big trend here, think about the Housing Market and the Home Builders and that trade in 2008 and 2009 it was obvious what was going on in the Housing Market and you still had plenty of opportunities to make a call im not saying rush out and go short mall operatorsand commercial realit estate. The commercial real estate environment has a terrible setup. A lot of these names have suffered enormous pain and drawdowns. If you think about the change in consumer profile, look at all the ecommerce data were getting. Mastercard just said were up 93 in ecommerce. People are not going out to the malls. Theres still more to do. Guy, quickly what would your verdict be if you were in that courtroom . I mean, it seems pretty ironclad i think some of the lawyers have wrote up these documents on the show before, if im not mistaken but i dont litigate for a career, so i will hold off on judgment what i will say is this, im sort of with tim on this whole thing. Not only was the timing bad, the setup going into this was horrible as well six months ago before anybody even heard of covid the environment wasnt all that great. If you look more and this is sort of circumstance spepect toe led the show, mall of america is behind on their payments im hard pressed to understand how this rectifies itself and we get back to any semblance of a year ago i just dont see it happening. The stock is going to be hard pressed to go higher. Coming up, ripple making its debut. Brad garlinghouse makes his return to reveal how ripple is shaking up the payment space plus, twists and turns in the auto market. When the world gets complicated, a lot goes through your mind. With fidelity wealth management, your dedicated adviser can give you straightforward advice and tailored recommendations. Thats the clarity you get with fidelity wealth management. We have a market flash on marathon petroleum. Its about 3 in after hours volume this is on dow jones headlines saying that marathon petroleum, the refiner, is looking to proceed with potential buyers of its speedway gas station units they are trying to sell it it could hold a valuation of 1 1519 billion in the precovid estimates. It looks like its restarting things trying to get this speedway unit sold or spun off to shareholders or the public in some way, shape or form. Thats why its up about 3. 5 , 616,000 shares in after hours volumes. We do see the pop here, 4 now. Steve grasso,what do you make of this news as don said, theres a bunch of things that go into the calculus here. Energy is somewhat uninvestable. But when this thing pops, its almost a triple off the low that weve recently seen and the stock is still down 36 . That should tell you us. Cnbc is out with our disrupter 50, a list of 50 companies shaking up the industry and reforming the way they operate ripple making its debut on the drug disrupter 50 list brad, welcome to fast money. Thank you for having me despite the weird times. Very strange times indeed on this day youre also making an announcement yourself in terms of your backing of pay id. Can you explain what this is and why this sort of simplifies how crypto had transferred money in the past absolutely. At its core ripple has been all about enabling what we call an internet of value. Lets make all of these Different Networks that dont talk to each other interoperable. Weve all had the experience where you ask a friend, i need to pay you, are you on venmo when i ask for a phone number i dont say are you on at t or verizon. I just get the phone number. The idea on pay id is to be able to send somebody money as easily as sending an email i dont ask them are you on google or yahoo, i just send anne mail. If youre an account holder there and i send you money, it should be as easy as typing brad dollar sign garlinghouse whether its going to a bank orbit coo or bitcoin, all of this naming structure can be simplified and interoperable. I want to understand what and who this disrupts. What do you see as the main user of this technology is it consumer to consumer Money Transfer or ultimately could it be a company paying another company for, i dont know, buying a unit of theirs or inventory. How big could this be . Let me start by saying that the word disruption, i actually dont look at this, were thrilled and honored to be on the disrupter list disrupt can be a word thats overused in Silicon Valley to some degree its not about move fast and break stuff, its about building, its about partnering and enabling. When i think about pay id doing and what ripple is doing overall, how we partner with the industry and make it more efficient, how to make it better for consumers and Small Businesses what were seeing with pay id is not that its going to disrupt a bank, its going to make them more efficient its going to make it easier for consumers for Small Businesses if it can reduce the friction of payments, we actually can unlock a lot of things we dont think about, micro payments, science fiction, blade runner kind of examples if the friction of payment goes to zero, its going to bring people into the Financial Community that are under banked or unbanked. Great to see you. Matt garlinghouse you can find the full disrupter 50 list at cnbc. Com. Karen, a lot of ripples customers are in fact banks. He makes a good point in removing that friction of transaction. Right well, that makes sense this is more evolution than disruption im wondering on a related night about in this postcovid world, people are probably going to want to use physical cash a lot less and have touchless interactions i wonder if that will improve the adoption more quickly of some of these other payments. Coming up, how the auto markets could be revving up for a big breakout welcome back to fast money. Today cnbc is launching america at home a brand new series that takes a look at the way American Life and businesses have changed during the coronavirus pandemic, the ways we live and work, how we communicate with friends and family, how we travel. Even the way we stay put has changed dramatically more on how that is impacting the auto industry. A lot of people thought that once we had people sheltering in place, there would be terrible auto sales jd power tracks retail sales on a weekly basis look what it was on march 29th, down 59 you know where it was for the week thaeen ended on sunday the down just 4 despite of the fact that were seeing lower percentages at the dealership theres Strong Demand for pickups and suvs but are more people coming in because theyve decided im not taking Mass Transportation, im not going to car share anymore, im going to buy a new vehicle toyota did say there are reports from some of their dealers that they are seeing more firsttime buyers or people who didnt have a vehicle and are now getting back into the market you are seeing the impact of people saying ive got to find some other means for getting around the average price for a used vehicle 21,752 cost to costs automotive 40 million used vehicles were sold last year that was a record. Two you want to watch Sonic Automotive which came out with an update talking about improving sales in the month of june and car max reporting its earnings tomorrow morning. Well see what carmax has to say about rotating into used vehicles and sheltering in place and not using Mass Transportation or car sharing, whatever it might be. As people may know, phil, i dont really drive i live in new york city. But a used vehicle priced on average at 21,000 or more seems kind of high im wondering at what point do consumers say instead of paying 21,000 for used, im going to pay an extra 5 grand for a new car . Youd be paying a lot more than that. The average price for a new vehicle, and this has been driven up because of pickup trucks and large suvs, the average price for a new week youre getting up in the range of 36,000 that 21,000 actually is a loan gap between new and used it keeps expanding a little bit. But that is the difference if youre saying im going to pay a little bit more for a new vehicle. Youre actually paying quite a bit more. Dont at me im out of touch on this front i will admit it, i dont know anything about vehicles. Guy, i feel like i should go to somehow. There are a number of directions i can take this conversation, none of which are good i will say this, fascinating. They closed at 98 today. Go back and look, the prior alltime high was 101 back in february i think you wait and see what they say its breaking out to the upside and its not an expensive stock. I think carmax is fascinating. The stock has doubled since march lows mike, kh mike, what do you see . Bullish bets outpace bearish ones by 21. Its implying a 6 move. A lot of that activity was concentrated in the 100 calls that expire tomorrow theres obviously bets on earnings buyers are betting that the earnings will provide good news and youre going to see further upside. Time for the final trade tim . Used cars and fixing up your house. Look, the diy trades, the home improvement, lowes is one of the great stores of the last five years theres no reason its going to stop now karen its too little too late for hertz but used car prices are good for them. Thats not my final trade. Its that the consumer is still there. Tjx is where to go for a bargain. Spotify, the june 30 calls expire tomorrow. I think youre going to see a magnet for that price and maybe you pop through it spotify. Guy if anybody has a 67 black gto convertible, let me know, at me. Kroger, i think the weakness is wrong. I think kroger goes higher from here. Thanks for watching fast. See you back my mission is simple to make you money. Im here to level the Playing Field for all investors. Theres always a bull market somewhere and i promise to help you find it. Mad money starts now hey, im cramer. Welcome to mad money. Welcome to cramerica other people want to make friends. Im just trying to make you some money. My job is not just to entertain but to educate and teach, put it in context call me 1800743cnbc or tweet me jimcramer maybe this market got a new brand of mouthwash, because it keeps gettin