Transcripts For CSPAN3 Hearing 20240703

Good morning. I now call the committee on Small Business to order. That objection the author is authorized to share a racist for the committee at any time and i recognize myself or my Opening Statement. Welcome to todays hearing which will focus on the impact of the ncaa name, image and likeness policy across the College Athletics. I would like to thank all our witnesses here today for their time as we discussed this potential issue. For the first one to 15 years of the ncaa government of a College Sports the individual College Athletes had no legal rights turn a profit from their athletic performance was entitled to nothing gun room and board, meals and education. In 2021 after a series of court cases force the ncaa to change the policies College Athletics rod to monetize their name, image and likeness overnight without affecting their playing eligibility resulting sanctions against that university. We are still the early years of this new era. He think is important to take a look at the positive and negative consequences of the drastic change in policy. We will start the obvious good. Student athletes cannot profit during their time playing College Sports. Roughly 480,000 student athletes fewer than 2 go on to play professional sports the first full year of an il there is almost 1 billion in deals made. An il has opened fantastic new opportunities for entrepreneurs who look for different avenues department big and Small Businesses. Not only allows them to earn money allows some valuable business they can utilize after a time playing College Sports. Weatherbeaten negotiating contracts, navigating regulations are being exposed by paying taxes for the very first time all of these skills are extremely valuable as we build up a new generation of entrepreneurs. Additionally Small Businesses have been abs utilize the student athletes is a new way to market their business. We often hear about highprofile athletes with their massive deals this is not the norm. Many of the deals are made between all business in the community and athletes that do not have that National Presence for this symbolic relationship help strengthen the bonds that tie together many of the college towns. A lot of good has come from these changes for athletics is not come without some negative repercussions. Since there is no uniform set of regulations individual states and passing their own rules governing the universities. This patchwork approach is bring all colleges and students who compete in different states in awkward position choosing to comply with the state law ncaa guidelines or regulations might be conflicting from what we have two Athletic Directors here today that understand the complexity forcing the universities at their students to navigate double shine some light what will happen if we continue the overreaching set of rules and regulations that everyone follows. Additionally with so much money changing hands or has been an increased number of bad actors looking to take advantage of these high school and College Athletes. Nbc news conducted an investigation they reviewed dozens of nil contracts offered to high school athletes. They described the deals as exploitive, which commissions upwards of 40 of all complex fleas feet structures meant to confuse the athlete. In one instance the contract was put in front of the student for simply 100,000 loan i am aware of other federal government will step into stocks in the event actors i think its important to bring attention to the site of the issues they can use real damage been done to these kids on promises are being made but not capped. Without transparencies to run re deals its hard to know who is truly working the best interest of the student athlete. I played College Athletics myself and take this issue very personally. When i was in college i received 10 a month that was called laundry many. The anchoring system has changed its open the door for many positive developments for student athletes. I am passionate about keeping system functioning for generations. The students about to experience what it means to truly be a student athlete. There are many reasons for having this hearing but i want to list a few. I want to know how we can inspire student athletes to utilize the skills they learn navigating nil to start their own Small Business. I want to hear about the best practices universities are going to teach the student athletes everything they need to know to take advantage of the amazing opportunity that was not available for millions of athletes that came before them. I want to discuss the appropriate role for the ncaa moving forward. I want to know how collectives are helping student athletes and allowing the schools to compete. I want to know how nonrevenue generating sports will fare if all money gets funneled to sports that make money. I want to know if olympic and women sports are going to be negatively affected and for priy revenuesharing models are implemented i want to understand how the changes are affecting Graduation Rates of student athletes are costly changing schools in search of the largest and il deal. And i want to know how smart market schools will fare if their cost to have their players lured away by nil deals. I want to know what we can do to stop predatory agents and bad actors from taking advantage of student athletes. Finally i want to know the appropriate role the federal government should play if it all in all of this. I greatly look forward to todays discussion i hope we will bring to light the different challenges and opportunities presented by the and il. My hope all nil policy changes are beneficial for student athletes above all else. Before i yield to Ranking Member elect to submit an oped for cruz on this issue and into the record. Without objections ordered. I also asking alms consent to waive representative and seven for an opening same without objection pickwick sort of records that i yield to distinguish Ranking Member from new york for her Opening Statement pickwick thank you, mr. Chairman. The success of Americas College students has been top of mind ever since i began teaching courses at Newark College many years ago. The ncaa 2021 position to allow College Athletes to make a living off their own name image and likeness or nil was welcome news. College athletes from underserved communities even with modest deals could finally begin building savings and generational wealth. Many players had a way to cover rent and living costs. But in recent years the growth of the multi milliondollar collegiate athletic market has raised questions about the way our society creates our College Athletes. Stakeholders from across the political spectrum have voiced concerns about gender and equity, predatory practices and the patchwork of computing regulations. I am concerned with the growing trend of collectives during the largest deals to the top athletes and football in mens basketball. The collectives often closely coordinate with individual schools could undermine the gender equity progress made by title ix and allow the collectives to shortchange our women athletes. This hastily drafted it thrown College Athletes into the First Business experience. But to protect them it is critical these students be wellequipped with the resources, knowhow and a stable environment to succeed and build strong brands. Otherwise we run the risk of distracting our students from their education and endangering their financial wellbeing. Today is our chance soon about the opportunities and risk name image and likeness have created. We can understand how to best support them. I look forward to hearing the testimony and with that mr. Chairman i yield back. Thank you very much i know it recognizes representative mike carey from the great state of ohio for his remarks triggers want to thank the german think the Ranking Member forgive me this opportunity to make remarks. Nil its extremely important issue. I appreciate the Small Business committee for this very important hearing. Thank you to the witnesses for your time today. We have an impressive lineup of witnesses that includes gene smith is a good friend of mine is on a tremendous job leading the ohio state Athletic Department. For the past 18 years. As some of you know hes announced his retirement although we are sorry to see you go. I like to congratulate you on an incredible career. Being from columbus, ohio which is the home of the ohio State University, i have taken great interest in the implementation of nil in College Sports. Leading me along with my dear friend and fellow ohio Greg Landsman the student acts. In addition to earning money to help support themselves and their families, and il allow student athletes to learn about personal finance, marketing, taxes, and business in general. All of the Lessons Learned through nil will supplement their learning in the classroom and will help set them up for life after college. This is not to say there are problems with the current state of the and il. Without the proper education, guidance, there is potential for student athletes to be taken advantage of. And by no means am i saying predatory practices are commonplace in the and il. It would be disingenuous to say theyre not existent. Another problem is that numerous states have implemented conflicting and il laws therefore making the landscape for the and il hard to navigate for both the universities as well as our students. Congress needs to pass legislation that will create a federal standard for nil focus on protecting the recruitment process, increasing transparency in the marketplace and implementing Enforcement Mechanisms against those bad actors. This legislation, my legislation and Greg Landsman. This would include the prohibition of inducements a registration requirement for agents, congressional oversight the establishment of a clearinghouse for nil deals to be uploaded. I look forward to working with my colleagues on passing legislation that would create one federal standards even the Playing Field, protect our student athletes in the future of all College Athletics. I feel confident in a bipartisan way the house will be able to pass nil legislations congress. I just want to thank you for waking me on the committee today. And for holding this important hearing. Mr. Chairman, Ranking Member i yield back. Thank you congressman. I will now introduce our witnesses. Our first witness here with us today is Jeremiah Donati. He is the director of Intercollegiate Athletics at Texas Christian University located in fort worth, texas but i do have the 202223 season was a most successful and tcu won her 50 year history. The only school to make it to College Football playoffs National Title game College World series ncaa basketball tournament in the same academic year. These are the most highprofile sports tc also saw success in a number of other sports with mens tennis, equestrian, Beach Volleyball rank number one of the nation over the course of the year. Price important director of inter College Athletics at pcu, he served as the horned frog deputy Athletic Director to attend the university of puget sound energys bachelor of arts in politics and government. Attendant Whittier Law School where he earned his jurisprudence in sports and entertainment. Mr. Jeremiah donati thank you for being here with us with a four to hear from you. Next witness is mr. Gene smith from a School Called the school i dont understand that. [laughter] but emulate mr. Smith is a Senior Vice President Athletic Director at ohio State University. Mr. Smith is the eighth Athletic Director in ohio state history and it said the Third Largest tenure having served in the position since 2005 being promoted to Senior Vice President and foundation Athletic Director in may of 2016. During his time as ohio state isnt Athletic Director i was State University and eastern michigan university. Mr. Smith also serves ncaa working group comes on the board of directors the National Football foundation among others. Mr. Smith was a College Athlete himself attended the university of notre dame he received his bachelor degree in Business Administration at mr. Smith, thank you for joining us today look forward to the conversation ahead. Our next witness here with us today is mr. Jeremiah donati is Heisman Trophy when it twotime National Champion as well as a member of the College Football hall of fame. Attended the university of miami he played for the mammy hurricanes Football Team winning the National Champion ship in 1989. As well as a 1991. He then went on to win the Heisman Trophy in 1992. After time attended the university of miami he played for several teams in the nfl quoted minnesota vikings, detroit lions, seattle seahawks. Following sampling for the nfl he joined the securities as a senior Financial Advisor and is chairman ceo of touchdown radio. Graduated university of amite Business Management thank you for joining us today. We look forward to discussing this important topic with you. I not recognize Ranking Member from new york briefly introduce our last witness improved for us today for. Thank you, mr. Chairman fred like to welcome madeline salamone Vice President the college association. Is an attorney and College Athlete advocate in her College Years she played lacrosse for Duke University and her first year ranked number six nationwide by inside lacrosse. However her College Career involved many battles with injuries, resulting in three neat surgeries. These challenges gave her a deep understanding of the difficult mental and emotional issues many College Athletes endure. She also chairs Ncaa Division one athletes and committee serving on rules, legislative and leadership. Her tireless advocacy led the granting of voting power for College Athletes at all levels ncaa. As an attorney she has represented College Athletes on matters related to athletic eligibility, scholarship appeals, abuse, transfer and Mental Health issues. She holds a bachelors degree in Public Policy from Duke University and a doctorate from the university of North Carolina of law. Welcome and thank you. Thank you. We appreciate all of you being here today. So before recognizing the witnesses i would like to remind the oral testimony is restricted to five minutes in length. If you see the light turn in front of you it means youre five minutes are completed you should wrap up your time. Without a now recognize Jeremiah Donati for his fiveminute opening remarks. Chairman williams, Ranking Member and recommends the committee thank you for allowing me too be here today. Someone who is passionate about College Athletics and the opportunity to positively impact on peoples lives it is an honor to testify before you in a time of great change in our industry. Not since the creation and implementation of title ix over 50 years ago have we seen such changes of this magnitude. It is my hope and the expenses i can draw from will be helpful to collectively Seek Solutions a very complicated issues in front of us. Much larger than nil pref over 15 years of expense working in College Athletics and have been the athletics director for the past six years. I also of experience working in the Sports Agency business representing the interests of professional athletes and coaches. I believe these experiences have given me a unique perspective on many aspects of our business especially nil. The concept of lung student athletes to receive compensation for the use of nil makes great sense. After all the vast majority of College Student athletes will not play professionally and only seems fair that she built to monetize their skills and talents. In 2021 and il became permissible student athletes canals are the same rights as ordinary College Students. Overnight they become entrepreneurs and almost immediately began seeing them signing endorsement deals and products other activities soon followed. Autograph signings, personal appearances and Community Service work for example. In many cases it became apparent they were using this additional income to better support their families. This is a reality for so many of our young people i believe is often overlooked is another reason why nil has been very beneficial. But simply putting money in the pockets of student athletes is not the only value and il brings to their lives. Theres a tremendous opportunity to educate give student athletes a set of tools more valuable than any and il payments. Following nils enactment any Athletic Department including tcu and build Educational Programs focused on Financial Literacy, Contract Negotiation business formation, entrepreneurship, brand management, social media and taxation for it like others we saw this opportunity to further our mission to form a partnership between the Athletics Department and the Business World to educate student athletes on the key aspects of entrepreneurship. Illustrate our commitment we create endowed professorship in support of nil education create courses for credit, office hours as Business School faculty dedicated football suite in stadium converted data that use for the teaching and instruction of nil entrepreneurship. At tcu we currently support 22 sports in over five and 50 student athletes. To date over half of her student athletes have report and il deals. But football, best ball, baseball dominated national and il headlands ive incurred to see many other women sports participate a much higher level than anticipated. Despite the positives that have come from and il it also comes pick number of challenges from the outset the lack of uniformity have caused confusion amongst its members respective donor bases and student athletes. And il was implemented without the proper guard rails or guardr mechanisms necessary to effectively manage these changes and unfortunately the shortcomings have improved on the legal challenges facing the ncaa have made it difficult to find Sustainable Solutions. Bad actors of those who break the rules and exploit student athletes for them personal gain, page two play from third price recruiting entrance inducements are among the unintended consequences of large lot unchecked today. We now find ourselves in the wild, wild west environment across College Athletics with little accountability. Sadly there are countless stories of student athletes and the families being exploited, deceived and harms for this personal gains in the and il pursuits. Paid well and ilcollectives thae universities with efficient tool fulfill opportunities for donor support the governance and oversight of these organizations has been inconsistent and in desperate need of uniform oversight. The good news is there are solutions available. Recently we have seen progress in federal legislative bills and discussion drafts. And im not alone in my believe congress does have the power to bring uniformity, transparency and fairness to the administration of nil through enacting legislation that should include agent oversight, standardized contracts, National Clearinghouse registry, for illumination inducements and pay for play and five rule Enforcement Mechanisms. I speak from a Athletic Director collects a current model is not sustainable we all desire to see student athletes competing under the same fundamental enforceable rules. I strongly encourage this committee and other members of the house to support legislation that will help provide Sustainable Solutions to nil while preserving the opportunity for student advice to financially benefit from the skills and talents are their College Careers. Thank you for the opportunity to testify before you today ana and i am happy to answer any questions you may have. Think going out recognize mre opening remarks. Sorry. Thank you chairman williams Ranking Member and distinguished members of the committee prethank you for the opportunity to testify today. I will try not to beat be repetitiousand reduce my opes significantly as a result of what has been said. Ohio state we have 36 athletic programs in more than 1000 student athletes. We are committed to providing our athletes but they need to grow academically, athletically, socially and graduate skills that transfer to success in life. We are focused on recruitment to career. Which is evidenced by our overt 95 for graduating seniors living right into jobs, graduate school of professional sports. I significantly believe the end il is beneficial to the student athletes experience. It is been more successful than portrayed. It was intended to allow student athletes to enjoy the same privileges other students on our campuses have including the ability to monetize the personal brand for business. Nil is a great educational tool as my colleague shared with student athletes learn about a host of important entrepreneurial skills such as fiscal responsibility, and contact management, personal brand developing a marketing. I believe the Lessons Learned from nil for the strength and the Holistic Development of a young person that fills his or her toolbox for success in life are our mission ohio state is to inspire entrepreneurial and innovative thinking and assure student athletes have the resources to create, leverage, promote their personal brand. Over 420 were student athletes have at least one and il deal. They have made over 2000 and il deals among all sports with football and womens volleyball attracting the most. Not all student athletes are on full scholarships. In fact mosts studentathletes on partial scholarships. Historically many partial scholarships graduated with a debts and il opportunities offer the opportunity to possibly mitigate that debt. Nil implementation has not been without challenges as it has already been stated i will not go through my speech on that. Since institution cannot mention nil on behalf of student athletes, collectives have formed. Largely 5o1c3 with the intent of soliciting funds from passionate fans developing deals. As a result of an irs interpretation many are now shifting to a limited liability corporations. The efforts of the llcs are in direct competition with Athletic Department. While these efforts for sure are beneficial to student athletes in the short run, Athletic Directors are now find themselves making further decisions based upon declining income streams which could in turn hurt our student athletes in the future. Many states have created legislation to support the institutions and il activities. But there is no uniformity to the state laws. As you all know we do not have a federal car law was nil paved terminus opportunities for student athletes to learn and grow the resources however protections and be put in place. Like mcculloch i believe Congress Needs to enact and il legislation as soon as possible an effective bill in my opinion should include a national and il standard. Nil agent registration, there are great agents out there but theres some unscrupulous characters taken advantage of young people based standard and il contracts the difference between athletics at our level of the pro level is we recruit we do not draft greater draft makes it impossible for the bad actors to enter that space like the you in our space. And il public registry to bring transparency to the marketplace no other industry doesnt have have amarketplace you can actuay evaluate the marketplace and make good decisions as you move forward in your business. Thank you so much for the opportunity to testify, appreciate it thank you. Mr. Gino torretta for his opening remarks by. And distinguished members of the committee, thank you for the opportunity to testify today. As one is been engaged in College Athletics since 1988 as an athlete and broadcaster i am honored to provide you my insights on nil and the impact on entrepreneurial athletes. Collegiate athletics supported me unique opportunities it helped me be where i am today group in a small town in california 17 years old i decided to leave california and go to the university of miami for a chance to compete for a National Championship and earn a degree. In my five years there member of two National Championships teams after my senior season in 1992 when the maxwell trophy the walter camp player of the year toyota Leadership Award to a top six award and every award i could win or you could win as an offense of player in collegiate football placement five years the National Football league but during my time as a Miami Hurricane they had rules in place regarding transfers theres no ability to monetize name, image, likeness. With nil the creation of the transfer portal, athletes are able to work, monetize their success in their sports. Essentially allowing all athletes to create their own Small Business and capitalize on their time competing in college. This window provides athletes with a head start in earnings and savings for graduation. An entrance into their chosen professional field which for the majority will not be in professional sports. These experiences will be beneficial in their lives Going Forward. In College Athletics, one can always find examples of a player or institution not following the rules. When these rules have been broken in the past that led to an athlete losing eligibility for the school be placed on probation, fines, bands et cetera for the current and il system there is no standard set of rules. It lacks the enforcement teeth. The only place guidelines on schools and their following state laws are essentially different. Coaches in any sport cannot devise game plans with in a different set of rules. They create game plan to follow the rules one set of rules set for them to follow. Because the ncaa has failed to issue one rule to follow it is important that Congress Needs to step forward and level the Playing Field across the board with all universities amongst all sports mail, female, football, basketball, baseball, gymnastics, whatever sport it is. But its really what we are here stating the testimony and again thank you for the opportunity and i look forward to answering any questions you may have. Thank you very much much i now recognize madeline salamone for her opening remarks by. Chart williams and members of the house committee. Thank you for having me here today. Our other Vice President is also in the audience they want to recognize him as well. My times cheer of the division i Advisory Committee taught me the only time there is a real change was when ncaa felt public pressure to the truth of what took on College Sports. This is the reason i continue to advocate for athletes i have become a leading voice in ca reform in college over the years speak out publicly, consulting with leaders and lawmakers and provide to the ongoing issues in College Sports. The committee can is this to discuss image and likeness in College Sports impact on entrepreneurial athletes. My understanding is members of this committee are concerned about a number of news reports the overall impact of nil. I also address the main topic at hand for the truth of the matter is a continual discussion about nil, antitrust exemption on Employment Status of athletes are a distraction created by the ncaa and member schools exacerbated by the media constant coverage of the topic. The most important issue that must be addressed in College Sports abuse, mistreatment lack of attention to Player Health and safety at the hands of coaches and support staff. Even in the wake of recent allegations of missed treatment, demonstrate a cultural issue is in College Sports it is incredible how quickly the focus is shifted back to nil being the most important issue at hand. No matter where we land with nil who have failed College Athletes if we continue to ignore it much more important issue Player Health and wellbeing. Impacts players wives both during and after college. The primate remedy for athlete mistreatment is to have external independent oversight by individuals were not employed by the school preschools have repeatedly demonstrated they cannot be trusted to police themselves with their countless stories of individuals who havee afforded problematic coaches and staff were subsequently silenced, fired or otherwise ignored and pushed out. They usually follows a more powerful and successful coach the more peoples jobs are at risk if they speak out. The harder schools will work to silence anyone making noise. For every scandal that has been made public their countless others that remain an open secret on campuses across the country. Players need accessible help they can trust with rules clearly defined. There must be independent oversight practices, Team Meetings and medical care. Players need access individuals for whom they can seek advice and help without the fear that individual will break confidence and cause more harm. They need someone whose obligation is to them and not to the school. Someone who connects the mediator whenever necessary and advise players on the best course of action. They must have independent authority to take appropriate action with the information once they have it. Including the ability to investigate reported issues and bring issues to the attention of the administration without risking their job for those individuals need to be trained to handle confidential information and exercise discretion intact in addressing matters. I hope we get a chance to discuss is very important and tomore pressing matters of colle athlete health, safety, welfare during this hearing. Whats interesting to me about the reason we are all here today as we are discussing nil as if its a new complicated subjects. It really isnt. Nothing about this area of the law is newport only how it applies to College Athletes. It is really the right of publicity which is another way of describing a persons right to control the commercial use of their identity and image. For years the names and likenesses of professional athletes, models, actors and artists have been used to promote indoors product Just Services or raise awareness about issue. Past rules or simply preventing athletes from exercising the same rights already available to everyone else. That is something we dont talk about is the additional benefit and il actually gives beyond financial. In addition to the nearly limitless opportunities that athletes have and can now pursue nil has tremendous Educational Value as well. Ive attended Public Schools doubly applicable to the modern job market including direct sales, promotion, Contract Negotiations, Brand Development and management social media. Athletes more than ever are encouraged to think about what they want to do after their playing days are over. And to start setting themselves up for the future they want while they are in school over previous generations of athletes had nowhere near the same opportunities to gain wrote world experience or prepare for their future is current athletes. Leo under my written testimony areas the end il proofer College Athletes vertically around Education Assistance with review of contract agent regulation. But these relatively minor concerns within the overall landscape of College Sports reform. As i discussed this unfairly focus on the big picture in College Sports. We cannot allow any more athletes to be negatively impacted by issues that are so preventable with the right oversight. Schools must be required to direct spending toward resources that will address the biggest issues these students are faced with which is their mental and physical health. These issues have the potential to negatively impact the rest of their lives. Way beyond college for the influx of revenue from a College Football playoff expansion addition to revenue pouring in from Massive Media picnics. Time is up. Exit out recognize myself for five minutes. My first question will be to mr. Theres questions about these need to navigate to play by the no rules but in addition to the ncaa policies students have to abide by state law as well as rules set by their school in their conference. Some have asked a federal solution to this problem in or o simplify compliance. But i agree that a uniform standard would provide certainty so that everyone is played by the same rules, finding that appropriate solution. So my question is, what do you think the role the federal government should have in the end il space . I would say it would be to work with the ncaa. I dont think any of my colleagues or i expect the federal government to supplant the ncaa. But the nature of nil the complexities that come with its and you mention the patchwork state laws have made this unmanageable. My colleague mr. Smith and i believe the federal government can be involved in a number of ways. You mention the agent issue. I think that is an easy one to address. I think theres a need for a National Clearinghouse or transparency into these deals the federal government can be involved in. The big question regarding the ncaa is how do you enforce these rules . The federal government could play a major part there as well. Yes. I would agree with my colleague. Those are the areas the federal government can help. But the single most important element in my view is the inconsistency across the country. The ncaa even if we have the ability or the model to come up and address the other issues what is the difficult for ncaa to come up with a strategy to create a level Playing Field across this country when it comes up multiple state laws i think its 18 states that have laws that are different but we certainly need help in that particular area. The second is around agents. This refers directly with what was said but student athletes are being taken advantage of it. It is sickening to read some of the reports to allow the unscrupulous character to enter the state you referred to as bad actors and ultimately take advantage of families and young people particularly people from disadvantaged environments. That area is one i think the federal government can help in. Thank you break the first year sought nearly a billion dollars with the deals is nothing to hint at this number slung that any times in the explosion of money and lack of uniform guardrails is led to what some describe as americas new wild west we have heard that today. Unfortunately there are some bad actors exploiting the system at the expense of young athletes. Weve heard Horror Stories such as contracts given companies write using athletes name and image in perpetuity for their brand. One student athlete move from georgia to california and il promise only to be suspended by california governing bodies and suspended from playing for a year. Are there recent lawsuit filed by former university of florida athlete alleged predatory loan was disguised as an and il deal included turning over 15 of any future professional football. So mr. Smith my question to what can be done to improve and il guardrails to ensure student athletes are not being taken advantage of by these bad actors . I think again that is were allotting to come into play. Those people who take advantage of in particular the one you mention the florida student athlete who is now looking at a lawsuit he has assigned to pay 16 of his future earnings to a collective. That requires national law. That is not something the ncaa can deal with. In my view we need governmental help in that particular space. Okay thank you. Bro quick mr. Gino torretta youve got an impressive resume can you walk through your time playing football in miami when you first start when the Heisman Trophy described to us how your story might of played out differently and il . In 1989 when injury started four games in the middle of our National Championship year. The broke the School Record for passing in my second start which is still considerate qb you i think. At the end of the four games out back to the bench a new is going to sit the bench the following season. In todays day and age a transfer portal would probably have looked elsewhere. Back when i was in school you had to sit out a full season. There probably would have been inducements of nil money to come to whatever school, pick your school. My story probably does not turn out like it has today. So for the good of nil and transfer portal that spread the bad the grass is not always greener on the other side. I think in all of these questions it is going to take an adult to step forward and ill call them kids are 18 22 you are still a kid in my eyes. Whether that is congress an adult needs to step four prep guardrails to get some enforcement teeth into actual rules per quicksort thank you very much i not recognize Ranking Member for five minutes of questions. Thank you, mr. Chairman. As you wrote in your testimony many collective tend to steer and il deals primarily to mail colleagues. Could you confirm whether this District Division is proportionate amongst men and women . I would say primarily the collectives are steering money towards football athletes over every other sport. That is disproportionately mail as compared to female. I had someone explain a collective to me and the very good way it was described as a fan club. Collectives basically operate at the behest of the coaches to direct funds to specific players that identify practices happening because collectives are not regulated by title ix, correct . Imparted think the collectives came about as a result of schools not one to deal with the funds they were concerned with having to comply with title ix this is sort of a workaround. I think the relationship is so closely knit at this point the title ix should apply to collective funds. So would you agree booster collectives who coordinate closely with their schools ought to be considered extensions of their school and therefore subject to title ix regulation . Yes collectives at this point are extensions of the schools brickwork some stakeholders worry the social media influencing deals in the market for women College Athletes is incentivizing them too post subjective content. This is maybe a greater societal issue. I know there certainly athletes it is an issue with female athletes feeling pressured to post certain types of posts that might gain more attention. I think what that comes down to is a greater need for messaging around that in conversation with female athletes in particular about staying authentic. Doing things that make you feel comfortable. Not feeling pressured by an agent or anybody else. There are a lot of social media branding specialist but are encouraging athletes to do all sorts of things in social media. I think it is becoming a pressure in i think schools should step in and remind athletes they should not bill feeladded pressure to do those things. But again i think females in society and social media feel the same pressure. I do not think it is unique to female athletes at this point. That is maybe a greater debate whether we feel comfortable with the pressure on women in general too post certain post on social media effects that wither comfortable with. Race and Sexual Orientation play in these dynamics as i see it. Is there a correlation between successful female and il earners and traditional Sexual Orientation identification . I think you are asking are they feeling pressured because they see the success of other people making money and social media . Certainly. Again i will go back to i think that is a greater pressure content creators in general feel when they see things working further content creators. And i think it goes back to athletes needing to be reminded to stay true to themselves. Not to feel the pressure. To focus on their sports where they are going to feel their part of a new generation the group in the social media world. It is a reality they have a different mindset when it comes to that. That has to be taken into consideration but certainly when anybody sees what someone else doing being successful they are inclined to want to copy that brickwork thank you. You placed great emphasis in your testimony on the need to prioritize health, safety and wellbeing for College Athletes. Can you explain why this has created success of the at il anl businesses . An athlete is being abused up there mentally suffering just like any normal person in business. If youre not taking care of themselves and living a wellbalanced life and being taken care of their businesses are going to suffer they go handinhand. Based on your experience can you tell me with colleges are orputting resources into helping athletes . Of the Committee Schools are putting resources. There is a tremendous gap in the education and i will touch on my fellow panelists here. I think one of the ways we can address some of the contractual issues and the agent issues is to educate about things to look for and contracts what kind of practice is to look out for and how to guard against them. Thank you i yield back. Thank you a note recognized from the great state of pennsylvania for five minutes. I think the chairman very much. Thanks for being with us its always enjoyable to talk about football particularly in the late morning on wednesday. Its a pretty important subject weve got here. The idea of us having congressional legislation aims to be agreed upon by all. When i conclude im going to ask you who has got the plan . You clearly are all specialists in this and have great experience and tenure. But think about that a little bit. Who else do we go to for gaining, developing, creating the right plan . No one disagrees a student athlete i have always felt from days of tim tebow for instance is great in college, its great in the nfl but the idea he could not get it nike contract didnt make any sense to be my son plays one a they have a good time. But the idea they cannot use their name or say a local business or a car dealership perhaps to help promote never made any sense it was kind of a side job. This is gone further. Now we have alumni basically coming together putting millions of dollars into a pot or some schools tens of thousands were one is tens of millions. And doling them out to give the best quarterbacks, the best Team Possible with contractors that really have no regulation or jurisdiction some states are putting themselves in the middle of it. So my first question is, do you think we have got a problem just with that amount of money going for this purpose customer yet the revenues from football cannot be used from the Football Program cannot be used. With funding from generous donors the donors who just want to win Football Games perhaps but either way. Would it be going elsewhere . That is question number one is it being pulled from other funding that would build a library perhaps . Absolutely to answer your question directly. The money that is being put into and il there are donors making decisions have the best going to support the university. Whether supporting and il the student athletes are funding a building or a scholarship. We are seeing that real time. We are having to make adjustments to our budget accordingly. Of that is a big yes. Mr. Smith, sorry my class wasnt working so great, do you agree with that . I agree with that. And one thing we have to recognize is theres over 350 division i schools in this country. The diversity and how they are financed is significantly different. We have schools that are blessed to have in our country to educate our children the Athletic Departments are funded through the university general funds for student fees. They are not like ohio state. We generate 250 million externally to our Revenue Generation plan. Which covers our expenses. We contribute dollars back to the institution. So we are a different beast. Part of the reality is we are listening to comments about places that dont do it right. We educate our student athletes. We do not have the same issues relative to fundraising that my colleague mentioned our numbers are going to support us at the end of the day. So the diversity of our business is significant. So we need to recognize that and Pay Attention to that. Because in my view of the plan is represented in some of the bills have been offered in support. Theres other plans the ncaa is working on that i put in place to allow more institution involvement previously title ix question at the end of the day i am going to make sure we meet title nine the sounds of outside entity thats going to make that determination. It is a long speech to your question. But that is reality. Same question . Under the Current System the universities are getting free labor still. Because the additional cash is coming from boosters to the players and the student athletes. As their percentage of revenue but under the Current System the student athlete does not cost the university any more precooked so im out of time i like to follow up and ask what problems were created from them some on the kid tended consequences by yield back mr. Chair pre thank you. I now recognize the great state of kentucky for five minutes per. Think it mr. Chairman from kentucky we love our College Sports this is of particular interest to me. I am going to say its the first time on our committee i have seen an organization come forward before us who does not have its act together is so inept they are asking the government to take over what is going on. Senate minority leader and wrots the first person to offer this within six months was basically obsolete. We had good things in there including registry of agents which were talking what would good things in the protecting the players i very much about their safety and wellbeing. If you sign the contract as student athlete in college up was void if you want it to be a professional bird but of 17 or 18 no kid senate for contracts to go to college there one and on the basketball theyre not obligated to that. There are some good things we can do. Here is the thank ncaa is the best institution to handle this. The next best institution is us. The last institution are your state legislatures which i am a state legislator at heart i love what they do sought arms race here is by morning just like we did in kentucky when he needed a change go back to state legislature u. S. Denies its government will literally take an act of congress to change something what we let it out into the wild. Since the ncaa so inept right now this is Something Congress must legislate . Somebody needs to step forward. Apparently they are not stepping forward essentially what we all want is a level Playing Field is tcu, kentucky, texas, for the athletes and Athletic Departments are playing by the same set of rules. You line up on saturday you know this would be 11 on defense is kentucky going to play with 12 without the same set of rules is florida . That is what i think everybody wants to protect the games they all play. The ncaa is not going to step forward for that is why we are here to say it may be congress can put the emphasis on the ncaa to say here and things that need to happen, do it. I appreciate that i will take some of this silence as an answer. We do need to step forward and weve got to make sure we are protecting players we are creating a level Playing Field that is a National Standard we are missing the National Standard. I have a question for you specifically how can we use a name image and likeness lets do it right lets do it for the players us not try to come back and fix it. How do we improve Player Health and Safety Standards including years after their careers are over . I think we start with independent oversight as i mentioned in my testimony previously. And you need organization of players. They need to be able to collectively bargain vets were trying to choose a College Football player association. I think it would take care of a lot of the issues the ncaa is concerned with what comes issues of antitrust. Players get a seat at the table are able to talk about the issues most important, nobody has to guess. Legislators do not have to come and create legislation that does not quite hit on the issues that matter to players. The only way to know that its a talk the players themselves and thats the answer brickworks i appreciate that i wish we had a ton more time this is an important topic is all the things that the deal including the portal has become an extortion market how to make this so it is right question weare interested in that one thg it athletic wellbeing at the event athlete at the university is flying now to cal or stanford, how does that impact player wellbeing . What is it do for player athletes . I did not go to stanford specifically for i would not want to recruiting visit before lacrosse meant traveling so much to play anybody good at the time i was in college. It added it means for most of the sports they dont have chartered flights and flights in the middle of the nights. It is exhausting. Its going across time zones. Athletes cannot get any work done for their barely in class. It does not make any sense and the fan bases they are and all over the place. To play and have rivals that are nearby. It makes absolutely no sense of coasttocoast conferences for cracks ive got a lot more questions you guys can probably tell. We do have to step in and step up i want to make sure we get it right. Schools have found other ways to compete. While there are competitive in inequities, i am more focused on the rules by which we are playing by. If they had this model and they were paying the money how would they do it even at their level. Theres a lot of dynamics at that level that will come to play. How difficult for those that are making more money . Nobody wants to answer that one . Answer your question, they cant. If a school wanted to invest i would say i think they recognize this is a different environment so it hasnt been a challenge weve seen yet. I would also add to their needs to be a mindset shift and encourage their athletes to set up for success. Its an Educational Institution if they want to oppose they should do that but thats not the role of the college. You dont think the students would get if they were difficult to coach . And still being students. But if the coach demand is the respect of their team it doesnt matter how much and that is the deeper issue is they havent figured that out. Do you agree with of the description . They are in the 5o1c3 and switching. The activities and events and podcasts and things of that nature some of them are helping student athletes connect and doing really good work but they are largely fan clubs, yes. Thank you. I yield back. Thank you mr. Chairman and all of you for being here. The student athletes Playing Field that would be a win for this congress. It creates the structure weve been talking about in this hearing the three things that have come up the National Oversight, the National Clearinghouse making sure that folks who are part of these transactions are registered and the deals are disclosed. Of the thoughts on the bill. We hope that it gets passed and that it provides meaningful structure and transparency and those aspects. Those are some of the critical aspects and first of all thank you but those are some of the critical aspects. I think the bill has all the elements needed and i support it wholeheartedly. Transparency registration is what the world needs but i also think it needs some enforcement and whos going to do the enforcement if they are not going to step forward then congress has to step forward. I would agree i think some of the issues are the mechanisms by which they accomplish the goals. They are not bad goals necessarily its just whether its more appropriate for that to happen in collective bargaining to figure that out. Can you say more on that . Some of the issues being addressed its like everything in the kitchen sink and its what i eluded to earlier with legislators putting things they think will be a Good Practice at work that may not address the deeper issues athletes have and what they really want fixed. You talk about rightfully so the safety, health and wellbeing of athletes being critical most important and supporting efforts but to also appreciate there are these other issues. This may be a dumb question should those be taken up separately . How related are they . On the housing and a safety piece i would think something very similar. Its National Oversight. Those are deeper issues that require more attention and i think many of these have been rushed through and more thoughts needs to be given to the house. As we wrap up with a minute to go this bill would i suspect get combined with others but i hope we get to something past where weve been living in this wild west world. The National Oversight transparency and the right enforcement mechanism. Is that right . And the oversight as well. The other inducements of transferring one institution to the other i think that theyve advocated this their own. I now recognize the representative from the great state of texas. Thank you mr. Chairman and all of you for being here today. This is an important hearing and i dont know if the chairman mentioned it or not because hes always very humble about this but hes in the hall of fame and i wont tell you what year he got inducted. But hes great at telling stories about how it was being drafted into being a College Athlete and how little money they made. My grandfather class of 1937 was 21st in the draft in 1937 played for the eagles for two years, 37, 38 and 39. Cut short, dont know why. But as we talk about the subject how much could it have helped roger and how much could it have helped my grandfather into these young men and women that are going through this today and i agree with the chairman we dont Want Congress making the rules here but its clear that there needs to be some definite readjustment of how we do this because so many of these young men and women i know at 18 i wouldnt have had any ability i would like to suggest and ask the director having been in agent before and not being an Athletic Director at holistically how do you guide these young men and women . What do you automatically do but what do you think should be done systemwide to ensure these young men and women may not have any background or guidance from home or direction in their lives how to manage that money how to prepare themselves for the Football Player that somehow doesnt have a degree or much of one and no ability to make a living after that. We see it all the time. How are we going to do that with these young College Students . We have to double down on education. That is a key aspect of this unit you heard my colleague bring it up as well is the hall of fame chairman. One of the first things we lead off our semester with into the school year with his the education because we realized in these days if students feel like they are mis advised her not giving appropriate advice, they have other options which i think is a good thing. So we take it very seriously because one of the things that keeps me up at night is april 15th because that is when taxes come and do so we spend a lot of time with our young men and women to make sure theyve done the appropriate work they filed their taxes. When we were certified in washington, d. C. There were rules in place in which you could weed out the bad actors, so i think that kind of standard at the federal level would do massive good in the world right now. Director smith. The ohio State University, are you doing something similar . Yes sir. We do the same thing. A nuance to your question lets be clear we do a lot of education. But its the third party that impresses that individual. Its an own goal that isnt an uncle thats difficult for us to give to and many of the deals are cut back down so thats a challenge that we have in our space. Do you know it benefited from that kind of guidance . I think we read about it in professional baseball, basketball, football where a player has made significant amounts of money and they were not wise with it or they were taken advantage of. You can try to educate as much as possible but like said you might have somebody that is close to you and maybe a Family Member some decisions are made and you try to protect and educate as best you can but youre not going to have that in 100 of the cases to get rid of the bad actors even with registration, nfl has registration with financial lead buyers and agents and there are still issues with people that are registered so i think you can educate all you want you to do what you can you do you hope that they listen because even if you are 32yearsold in the nfl the end of make a lot of money and they dont listen. My time is expired. I yield back. Representative from the great state of maryland for five minutes. Thank you very much mr. Chairman. I appreciate the opportunity to be part of this and im glad we are dealing with this for some of us weve been dealing with it for some time. But allow me on a point of personal privilege to call the attention weve been joined by tom mcmillan who many of you will recall his great years at the university and recall the olympic team and member of this body in the 100th. Thomas, its great to see you back up on the hill. Mr. Chairman, ive been listening. I think there are two aspects that continue to come after me about what we are dealing with today. One is a police aspect of what has to be done and in other words, whos going to set the rules and enforce them. The other one is the information we heard about if i can use a better term, may be prevention. The care of the athlete and why things seem to be as bad as they are in some respects. I spent 12 years on the Johns Hopkins board of trustees. The last 30 on the board of regents at morgan State University and i can tell you from the public side colleges and universities really want guidance and information. Theres so much thats not clear in many respects. Universities and colleges approach this in a difficult manner and definitely in a different kind of looking glass. So i know that theres some apprehension about Congress Setting the law and the standard but if somebody doesnt do it it wont get it done and if it doesnt get done, things are going to happen. I appreciate the discussions here that weve had about agent registration. I think we are all kind of into nand on board with of that. I wouldnt refer to them as bad actors. The ones that are bad are more like leeches that take advantage of young kids and their families and of their uncertainties and they do it in a number of ways. On the standard contracts so whats here today is the same thing that will be there tomorrow and how we operate on the issue ten years from now. At the same for the lack of a better term find a way to role in all sorts of things by the thirdparty to kind of induce the kids to make a decision and do a handsoff to say they sign with us. In many instances they are being introduced to psion and they dont have any defense of their own. We need strong enforcement measures. If those things are the things that we can agree on maybe thats where we ought to start looking Going Forward and i think that they do have to be two different approaches here. While im at it let me also talk about these booster collectives that operate outside of title ix on the prevention side im glad you brought up this whole issue about the health and wellbeing. Everybody told them to get back out there or youre going to be okay. Following the investigation it was determined that there was a culture in the Football Program that led to this kind of tragedy. The tragedies are happening everywhere. They dont get reported the same way and those are something on the prevention side that i think we have to deal with. I introduced with the help of some of you in this room the jordan mcnair act a couple of months ago in the congress that would put in place things that are really needed requiring the use of external defibrillators on the field and requiring the use of cold Water Equipment on the field. I just cant stress enough that while the name, image and likeness are important the health of the player also is extremely important. We have a role to find a way to protect that so i would hope that we could keep both approaches. This process of amending and maneuvering and managing these bills would hopefully get to a point that we dont have to sit before this committee and witnesses and others still saying what do we do, how do we do it and when do we get it done. The representative from the great state of florida. Thank you mr. Chairman and a Small Business committee. Its a big deal to have everybody here today. I cant really see you right now because the glare from euro Championship Ring is blinding me. We won the congressional baseball game under the leadership. He presented us with our rings and i lasted two days. It was just too heavy so i salute you for all that youve done and also i want to congratulate you this is the largest Committee Attendance that weve had and we felt drawn the secretary testifying downstairs, so the interest of College Athletics is certainly great around the country. Question, the elephant in the room is not roger williams, it is the fact that theres also another big impact to College Athletics. The name, image and likeness is a big deal but also this transfer portal. Whats the greatest impact right now or is it them together . I think you had the convergence of two major changes in College Athletics where youre allowed to transfer. Where in athlete didnt have the right of a coach left to change schools or. I came from california. Maybe i didnt like it after one semester and would have gone home but i couldnt transfer somewhere else without setting out a year of my eligibility so now you have that and then theres the freedom and with vn il we talked about the inducements of money is involved and gino is a good player and hes younger. Maybe we can pay him or his people to transfer him and i think the combination of that, yes its not good. Is the transfer portal good in and of itself, sure. It would add to the inducement piece, its not good for any of us sitting up here. I was a state legislator and remembered a few years ago i got a call from the then head coach of the university of florida and said if we dont pass a name image and likeness we are going to kill florida schools because everybody will go somewhere else. Is it a fair Playing Field among states . Is there a more lucrative colleges and other states or is it about equal . Do some states give you a better chance to make more money playing college . Theres differences among conferences. They make different amount of money. Thats why we are seeing the conference realignment and weve deemed that the west coast of california, oregon and washington kind of irrelevant. Although schools are moving to the big ten. Is it true what he says does he preach the truth right now . I dont know about preaching but what he said was pretty good. I think the core issue is in the transfer those things coming together with where we are weve got to remember transferring is a good thing. A student athletes deserve the same rights as other students. Regardless the institution where a student athletes decides to transfer weve got to make sure we understand why. If they are transferring because we made a commitment we didnt live up to then we need to look at the mirror, dont point the finger at the student athlete, so thats one. The reality is the big ten in particular have done a great job over the years of creating a culture that everybody else wants to be a part of. Thats just reality. Here is a tossup question for every panelist im going to ask you to give me a number and that is your confidence on the scale one to ten, ten being confident that the ncaa can handle this without congressional action. Zero confidence and definitely you need congress to jump in. Jeremy, what to say you for that number . Somewhere between zero and ten. I would say the new president Charlie Baker we have a lot of faith in him, but he needs help and he needs this congress help. We are firmly behind him, but this is a level of complexity 34. Four. Hope is eternal. I think it depends on the issue that we are talking about so i would take issue with the framing. I should say coach, i yield back. Thank you for that and i now recognize the representative from the great state of michigan for five minutes. It is a great estate, isnt it . With all due respect to the ohioans here. Thank you all so much for coming and testifying today. This is such an important issue as we see by the crowd gathered here. I know this to be such an important issue. Im the daughter of a sports reporter, was a student athlete myself. Never in a position for any of what we are talking about here today to be relevant. But the challenges of balancing the demands of school, of young adult hood and the demands of the physical aspects of athleticism are so challenging and come together around this important issue. My first question is for you. It was incredibly gripping to hear from your testimony how prevalent psychological abuse is for female athletes and the detrimental effects it can have on Mental Health. Continuing on some of my colleagues questions about putting the health and safety of student athletes front and center, i want to talk about the Mental Health aspects. Can you talk more about what systemic changes might need to be made for student athletes to have the Mental Health support and resources that they need both in general but particularly at this changing time . We know social media plays a huge role in the Mental Health components for young people today. And also, more broadly, what Enforcement Mechanisms need to be in place so that this toxicity can be reported and tracked and monitored . Also the enforcements oversight. Schools have very good people that work there but very much care about the athletes but when it comes to stepping up for an athlete, if it puts the school at risk of being exposed for some scandal, they have to put the school first and depending who is involved that can be an issue so independent oversight as a starter i think in terms of addressing Mental Health there are so many different components. Number one theres tremendous there is tremendouspressure to. You had to social media alone that came before and that already created a different world. These are young individuals that are learning who they are and how they exist in the world and trying to figure out what they are going to do in their lives and all of that feels enormous at that age so i think that they need in addition to Mental Health resources that are independent and not reporting to coaches what is being talked about they need people that understand what its like to be an athlete at that level to kind of counsel through on the basis theres been a lot of efforts put in around Mental Health and athletes are talking about it more than ever, but i think its a little bit of a stigma where you can identify other people. To face a hurdle. If they feel like they are trying to put on an act and it takes a lot of effort to keep that to be a good teammate while youre dealing with that its so many pressures. I mentioned in my opening testimony one of the things a lot of our student athletes come from underprivileged homes and a lot of times theres pressure on them so these resources now are going home to extended families so that to me has been a win and is something ive seen now representative from the great state of minnesota. Thank you for your testimony. From your experiences, it is very compelling. Hockey is one and i was fortunate to play hockey and when the National Championship and all these years later i could say i fooled them into deciding the contract and two of the brothers i played professionally. I havent heard a lot about schooling and grades into education. Eventually, we are done so i would like to talk more on the focus what are you doing with the student athletes that come in and sometimes when they come from underprivileged homes or what have you and they are making some good money. How do you balance that with their School Education and they arent going to be there forever. Im sure you saw people waste a lot of money and all of a sudden one day its over. How do you deal with that and prepare that student athlete . You just identified the greatest challenge of being in athletics director because you do inherit young men and women who are at your university to grow. Some are all years and some arent and some find out later in life they missed an opportunity and thats why we have systems in place to bring them back for the great conclusions down the road. We only have the ability to be with them so many hours of the day. We have to make the best use of those. I will give you an answer how we educate them. We have whats referred to we are allowed to provide student athletes up to 5,980 per year and we have a condition on receiving that money that they go through this Financial Literacy education so that is the requirement if there are no ifs ands or butts if you miss one of the sessions you dont receive the check so we do try to hold them accountable and its not a perfect science because we are dealing with 18 to 22yearold sometimes 23, but its the greatest challenge. Can you give your thoughts on what would happen if some of the proposals became law and before you answer that im one that necessarily wouldnt support the government being involved in forcing you on this. I would rather have the institutions into the professionals at this table make those decisions but if need be, in congress we can help. If we put the law forward, what does it do . I never wanted to come to the federal government to ask for help. Theyve made it difficult to come up with a strategy to deal with the issues that we are dealing with today. And frankly as you heard to be able to deal with it we dont see that happening so thats why we are here. To try to get across to everyone so that we can get it passed to past thethings we talked about e to agent management and all those type of things we really need help with, so i would say that the plan is around that that a priority. We cant just put them aside im out of time but thank you witnesses for your testimony and we appreciate your athleticism. The representative from the great state of michigan. Thank you mr. Chair. And i want to thank all the witnesses for being here and for their testimony. For the first time i was able to impress my children with my new job here. I want to thank the chairman for this hearing. I grew up in a family that didnt have anything to do with business or entrepreneurship. When i got my education i worked as a chemist and i wanted to start a business. I had no concept of how to manage the branding whether it is revenues, investments. Im looking at these people that have focused so much on developing their sports skills and many of them come from families that are not in the business. How do you teach these young people so they can look after themselves and make a good, sound, financial decision and have a Strategic Plan even when you start a business. How do you bring that entrepreneurship and ability to have a plan and make sure they dont get exploited by vested interest but they are able to make good decisions for themselves . I think all of us are into education and we are probably the only one with enough Higher Education where we can actually have programs specifically for student athletes to help them with that so i will give you one example. Many of them never worked in their lives, so when we sit them down and tell them its a requirement that they write a resume it starts the wheels turning to get them thinking about what am i putting here so then you begin to process to help them understand why its important to take advantage of the internships we have available throughout the rest of your career putting them in the Work Environment so that they can see what it means to be in the Work Environment. The Lessons Learned through Athletic Competition and practice is directly transferable to the Work Environment. How do we help them on their continuum to get to that and it takes a lot of programming and doggedness to make sure you work with those student athletes. Thats the highest priority that we have to prepare themselves before they work across the stage and to get that so i could go on and on. That is what im passionate about. One of the things we did at the universities like the ohio State University and other places weve got a top Business School in the country and top Athletics Program we said lets combine resources. So, we literally brought a piece of that Business School into the Athletics Department and created professorship and brought in the School Business and got to work on these skills. This is the good side and the positives because it is as big as any payment of these are tools they can take with them forever we still have some time left and members on their way back. For those of us here would you like to ask another round of questions . You want to talk about the university of maryland . I would like to get back. Your perspective i did not expect coming into this hearing. I read the testimonies but i figured we would talk about the regular things, the guardrails and but we need to do and oversight. I would like for you to talk some more about this aspect of the athlete to being a human being and how in the process of developing good athletes we make sure we are developing good human beings. You talked a lot about that with joe and i think that his father is someone who is doing tremendous work bringing that humanity to athletes there are many people that care about them. They lose sight of that when it comes to treating it like a job and forgetting even the best care about their employees and treat them well and with respect and care about them personally. I think we need to bring more of that mindset into coaching and to the administration and getting to know the athletes and what they care about, not just what they can do on the field on and on the court wherever their performance is. These are families that worked very hard but that cant do it all and sometimes buckle under the tremendous pressure. It is a lot of pressure. I would like to add on the independent oversight, which i agree with it becomes a selfpreservation for that administrator because that administrator is working for the institution. You know that they are going to have your best interest and i can go back to broadcasting the ballgame. They had a player come across the field. Hes back out there three plays later and i can remember thinking if i was his parent i would jump over the rail because who allowed that to happen and that is what the nfl has tried to deal with on the sideline. It becomes selfpreservation. We are familiar if i might for just a minute longer. Of the mountain of power and nobody wanted to check person a b or c and everybody was intimidated until it all blew up into the question became what did you know and what did you do about it and that is what the universities and colleges are faced with. I would say however that its important for the record there are a lot of good coaches out there who also dont know where to turn. Weve definitely got to figure out this notion of intimidation out of the game because people are fearful will i be demoted and shifted somewhere else in the university. Its more challenging for us. It comes to all of us individually do you have the courage to step up. Do you have the courage instead of filming on camera to actually stop whats going on and i think thats society in general stepping up if you see something say something. We see that in the airport. This is about leadership and culture. We probably could have won the National Championship last year if we have let them continue to play. What shes talking about is 100 right and structurally you need to put people in place that are the experts to make those type of decisions. My coaches and experts i dont know if you sold recently we had a session on cnn. Fortunately, we have empowered our coach to make sure that they are very sensitive and humanistic in those situations and then determine who is the experts to help that individual and that is the coach you have to create. You have to make sure that the individuals in your organization understand your talents and skills to be an powered to give those talents and things they have talents and skills and no authority over. I agree wholeheartedly. Thank you mr. Chairman for the extra time. I appreciate it. We are winding down on our time now and this will probably be the final question. Weve heard some questions today about collective questions in a negative light and this is missing some context. To get in contact to create these partnerships. You might touch on that real quick but one of you are all of you please talk about these collectives and how they came about and how they help your teams compete and if they do. They are here because theyve allowed them to be here and i think a number of them do it the right way. Im proud to say the collective that supports does it the right way. We work with them. We have a lot of communication with of them to understand how they are trying to accomplish and support our student athletes, but we know this isnt a sham. To make sure that the activities are happening, theyve gone heavy with Community Service. The student athletes are able to have a real impact in their lives, so not every collective works that way. It goes back to having some uniformity and oversight, but i think by and large collectives have been a good thing. Thank you for bringing that back to that attention because youre right weve talked about the negative side of it but theres a lot of collectives around the country that are doing good for young people and many of them for olympic sports athletes not just football and basketball. We talked earlier about title ix. So, yes, i agree there are so many the contributors i think sometimes the Small Business gets a negative connotation because if you have a Small Business you reach out. Is there a student athlete i would like to support and i think that collectives are formed for if i didnt have a Small Business but i wanted a support, i could give money to the collective and then they could disburse it and support the athletics. So i think there are good things come about without policing of anything, there are obviously going to be bad issues. I would echo that sentiment. I think there are collectives doing good work some of them are collectives organizations. I spoke to one person who told a story about i think one of the issues is athletes go to whoever can help them with certain issues and that isnt always. Its able to help by collecting them with the social worker that can collect them with what they are dealing with and its causing them difficulty where they were asking for money when what they really needed was help in other areas they were able to provide because they listen to so there are good people in this space doing good work but those are the type of issues again that go back to why its important to have players in the room to explain that to you that its not just about money but its about how can you help with these reallife things that happen outside of sports. Thank you and i just want to say that this has been a great hearing and its good to see so many of you in the audience that were Witnesses Today that care about this. I think it also shows we can get some bipartisan stuff done. But also the importance of this College Athletics to the country. I want to thank all of you for being here today. Without objection, members have five legislative days to submit additional materials and questions for the witnesses to the chair which will be forwarded to the witnesses. I would ask the witnesses to please respond properly when that happens. If there is no further business, the committee is now adjourned. Thank you