Conflict so can he ever imagine his country as a safe and fully functioning democracy. Has certainly welcome to convince our thanks to you said a year ago that we have control you the government of National Court have control of the state institutions and our opponents understand the game is over that didnt happen that you can look to soon well i think fair to say that it was not an easy challenge that we faced since we came and we came to tripoli where we were actually with the no force to manage what is there we have to work things from scratch but these were grand statements that you made absolutely. They have control of the state institutions and their opponents understand the game is over they havent understood that at all its true but we were talking basically about tripoli in particular capital and institutions in tripoli thats what we were looking for because thats the key for the stability of libya the centralization order of the way that libya working and with all situations more centralized in tripoli once you have control over that things are much more easier to manage within the country but is false optimism the best thing that you can offer to the libyans that they deserve a more honest assessment of what is going on you know but we were fair and we are fair until now i mean you can see how things are being are shaping much better and this is coming back to tripoli the United Nations is coming back next month this is good science to show that we did manage to do the United Nations just heard a fruitless months of talks with the various factions involved in the fighting and divisions inside libya so the point where nothing was agreed at the end of this month and no timeframe was set to resume the talks either so things arent Getting Better or in fact the chief prosecutor the i. C. C. Said earlier this year the International Criminal court the situation is both dire and unacceptable reports indicate that the country is at risk of returning to widespread conflict thats exactly the reason why the Prime Minister has launched his roadmap around june july to propose the best way forward with all of these challenges we were thinking that a certain point that these amendments to the political agreement will take place many were high i mean had hopes for that but we predicted that it would not be possible so thats why we are calling for elections next year and its not that its going to be maybe the easy way you forward but its best way we think tonight institutions that are divided all around the country its something that we inherited by coming from the l p a that was signed in spirit so we are doing here is hes agreement yes correct but just a month ago we had the u. N. Envoy thats a solemn a saying youre talking about institutions. Libya has sleeping institutions that need to be workin divided institutions that need to be united and hijacked institutions that need to be rebuilt so you know were near either waking up these institutions or controlling the money you correct because we are a divided country and thats why we need to united and says six years this is six years and no progress no discernible process progress has been made thats absolutely correct the so joint responsibility whether its from the libyans which are you priority and the International Community that left just libya after twenty eleven i mean they were fully engaged in the conflict in twenty eleven and then all of a sudden just left of their hands and think thought things were going to go normal d. Z. To blame somebody else and thats why i said its a joint responsibility but its a fact the weapons that have been coming in all the time Un Sanctions Committee and the reports are reporting these weapons are coming into illegal forces and nobody even stepped forward against that we are the legitimate government we didnt manage to even are actually so you know this is jim mcgovern the new recognized outside the country as the legitimate government through very much the disputed government inside the country because this is an agreement that was not respected i mean again this is the problem when you have a one a year and a half or a year and a half agreement that has been between libyans which was signs curate. Putting that sumption that these Political Parties will sit together and to unite the institutions and try to build a common view a voter for libya and then we end up with the way we ended up with not respecting it with regional players also being about as the problem youre not part of the solution or you know but perhaps its time after all this time to step aside and let somebody else have a go because youre not being successful in uniting the country in taking over the institutions in bringing law and order in doing something about the terrible state of the economy none of that is improving under your government is it you have to look into carefully to libyan political agreement what it says it says that the responsibility on the ground you know about that but this is the reality on the ground never mind what it says on a piece of paper when there is a United Government in the country and there is a way to we have to have the proper methods taken into consideration these things can be resolved when you have to so have a strong government you have three got to go to parliament but this is not the problem of the current because you have no members of a president ial council as well who feuding constantly looks he doesnt like the house of representatives the Libyan Investment Authority absolutely all of that is disputed but this happened before we even came in well thats the challenge and we thats why theyre having now and you havent done anything about take me take take the National Oil Commission yes for instance the chairman who has stated on the record that he doesnt regard your government as legitimate now thats not true that he has no knowledge and you that your National Government of record had attempted to take over the organizations most important functions but was blocked by a court in benghazi and he said we intend to remain neutral until there is a single legitimate government we can submit to let me clarify that and hes saying that there is and he can find you know but you have to you have to know the reality of this. The National Oil Commission has or has certain responsibilities that its inherited to fill in the gap that there was no oil ministry. Now while ministry is something that is under the Government Institution or as other the management of the government this is something that they took on to of years past when there was no ministry when we came in we only asked to take as a government these responsibilities they cannot put to the policies of libya towards the Oil Companies and how to deal with it but they dont trust you as a government they dont regard you as a legitimate government and this is the guardian of the most important resources that libya has yet but the us and theyre saying theyre waiting already wellings of the urge to mcgovern i dont yet have all the wealth of the oil is coming through there are the government and we are distributing it in the country if that was true we wouldnt have been able to do that International Community in june he wrote this in june no thats not the way he said it thats not the context thats the quote im taking the quote and if that was the case how come then all the revenue is coming through there g. N. A. T. Sure through our government how come that were able to sell all the oil revenue if that was the truth thats not thats thats not in the context of how francis arrives blames the un for not on freezing the countrys assets in particular the seven wealth fund some sixty seven billion dollars well look he told the u. N. Libya needed the assets to sustain it and thats what he said at the u. N. Libyan frozen assets we did not call for and freezing it because we know that its not a time for that we called for unfreezing the management of the frozen assets its totally different were losing one billion dollars a year because were not able to manage it not to unfreeze it we know were not in a steady state to unfreeze these assets and thats what we called for in the u. N. And the u. N. Sanctions committee its not money thats going to sustain libya business as usual its a unity of purpose compromise democracy correct things that you dont have and these are the main problems to why you dont have an economy at the moment thats properly funded where do you buy that country that has divided institutions. Over and institutions are divided when you call when you talk about two Central Banks divided its not the responsibility of the government to unite the central bank its a sovereign thing that is related to the house of representatives and the state council according to the libyan political agreement this is the legislative body that is responsible of the sovereign situ but it doesnt help when the Prime Minister keeps promising more than he can actually deliver it as what in september he told the un that all libyan parties were ready to deal with the challenges facing the country thats simply not true is it ready to deal with it doesnt mean that its resolving it thats why were having we just three weeks fighting earlier in october around a loyal and gas installation west of tripoli absolutely we have the airport closed absolutely second third week in october any country with conflict with the airport when there is spread of weapons all around the country thats the challenge were facing were doing dear the our programs in order to resolve this but we cannot do it with one hand six years and theres still. The airport we were in six years youre not saying you owe us is where we are and this was the genesis of the overthrow of going to their advantage we did by coming in and this time inc is to save libya a real civil war if you look of the amount of weapons spread out in all cities in libya and you see the number of conflicts that happened around whether we talk about tripoli and all other cities were actually saved libya a lot doesnt mean we resolve the problems but its like staying on the balance of edge you know its very hard to maintain your balance on a rope when youre walking on it but its still challenging you know worsening cash crisis absolutely market currency exchanges smuggling Power Outages not some of the violence as we were talking about but youre not doing anything about these things you know but youre claiming were not doing you can seem very complacent about no no no and because we know where the responsibility to hold our government has other institutions and all the world that are responsible certain things we dont put the monetary policies that will solve the problem of the black market thats the central bank wrong we dont have an oversight. I understand there was a point of having a government than the government thats the point you cannot for work alone youre not supposed to be youre supposed to be holding these institutions to account we dont government has overall you know executive power i want to say you have control of the state institution not the sovereign situation being that you havent no sovereign institutions in the world have thirty thats the separation of powers we cannot interfere in that part we can put policies for economy but we cant interfere for example on how to we can give advice on how to change the issue of the Exchange Rate for example or the development of the dinner but we cannot apply it if the central bank and other authorities that are sovereign are not actually accepting it while you make these arguments people in libya losing hope on the published polls by the libya herald october the eighteenth showed a massive ninety one percent of people accusing the government of failing to deliver on the aims of the revolution ninety two percent believing that corruption is actually worse now than it was i agree with these figures and this is unheard from the past seven years so if youre talking to me about of the story and telling me the story about seven years i would fully agree with you and this is the post conflict as in every countrys when there was a centralized dictatorship centralized on a person and without proper institution and collapse all of a sudden with weapons spread around this is the time a typical result you get you know thats why weve been going into talks the Political Awareness of the people is minimum because they never got a chance to even be vocal about what they wanted to express themselves this is a new to phase in libya youre not offering people anything that they can believe in we have more people apparently supporting gadhafi son safe al islam ten percent that have faith in a consensus government seven percent so theres a huge lack of faith in your guys misandrous fair and it was twenty years of ruling with one party so definitely he will have this number of supporters if not even more that were maybe you should let him rule thats. Not to point to thats why we want elections and when we have elections and Fair Elections let People Choose who they want this is the first person and the only person who called for free elections was present and sorrows and even as early as march if we want to stay in power we wouldnt have called for this but you see that so many others are opposing it because they know theyre going to lose their chair but we dont were not looking that way were not thinking that way what chance is there of having elections when you cant even agree on drafting a constitution thats why im telling you if you talk to me as a government thats something were not involved in if you dont as a libyan i would tell you that our constitution has been offered there is a dispute in the courts and terms of the mechanism that it was rolled out it has been going on for three years you know. The Constitutional Assembly on the day when they actually were just crazy thats exactly the problem with this isnt responsible for providing because you are seen on the east were not controlling the east that was on the eastern side this is other people thats the division of libya you have to look at the geography and general after who controls the east thats the fact you had negotiations with them only sporadic negotiations with them but they havent did they havent brought any progress there thats why they have a joint statement in paris and some clue where they both called for elections the problem is that i was really into have to change his mind didnt he reuters quoted him as saying any cease fire was limited he had no interest in elections and mr government of National Accord which is represented was in the grip of terrorists so so much for the agreement that you got in paris now i think that the way to put it is that there is a problem of trust all around and with special figures as well but what is good is that if you look at the people not the politicians they all want a new stage and a new start. Which is something around elections and new parliament and a new executive body that is separate from the legislative the problem that happened in libya the biggest mistake since twenty eleven all the bodies that came in whether its the Transitional Council whether its called the General Assembly what is called the house of representatives and mix the executive power with the legislative so the president of the house is the president has executive or a power as well which messed up on libya how can you possibly have elections when you havent got security you need security is a prerequisite your duty you dont have an oversight body for elections you dont have an entity thats going to provide people with the security for knowing that these would be Fair Elections that you know how it thats a good point the security today is not worse than what it was in twenty fourteen where we had elections what were saying is that the u. N. And the International Community this is our advice should bring back of the momentum and have these political talks rather than talking about amendments to diverted towards a vocal see for these elections and having the stability to reach a Credible Elections you really think that whichever side loses these elections is going to accept it because everywhere you look there is a failure by libyans to see beyond their own factional interests is that its something that we have to go through theres no guarantee thats true an inability to think of the good of the nation rather than the good of themselves Boris JohnsonBritish Foreign secretary who visited recently summed it up today when he said politicians in libya need to suppress their own selfish interests and compromise for the good of the country but theyre nowhere near doing that theres no country that came out of dictatorship for forty or more years never had the chance for a proper democracy and you expect it to come in day and night and understand what even democracy means you know certainly did in egypt they certainly did in Eastern Europe when they emerge from the east bloc it wasnt something easy as well they had their conflicts and they had their problems they werent fighting really airport six years after the revolution thats not our oil werent there are a. Conflicts all around the world if you go to latin america if you go to africa these are countries that went through these similar phases you libya is a unique case as well the way it was ruled is very unique everyone knows that what im trying to say that in order to achieve a democracy you need more democracy you cannot say that because im not sure about the security situation we dont fix it and we dont have elections thats not the way we tried for two years you have because it has elections and then you have fighting a bird really where does that get you thats the point the dynamics now are different the armed groups and those militias are exhausted its a different even regional players have their different styles probably theyve been fighting around the airport this month i dont want this is the point you have exhausted all you have to understand what part of this was what type of conflict this was there are a lot of problems this is a criminal act that was around the airport for you to know and you can check that out it was not a political driven armed group this is something that was cleaning up criminals we have that all around im not denying the fact that we have a challenge we have arms in every single home with this is a problem perhaps misalliance is mean perhaps democracy just isnt for you. But citizen feel perhaps name me one country that ended up with democracy in new york part of the world that did not go in a civil war this is something that is the result with the rest of the arab world what happened to the arab spring we have strongmen absolutely no these countries status of their it it isnt this whats going to happen in libya as well but this is the point after thats what i was saying after two a dictatorship for multiverse decades this is what you get as a result because its a sudden collapse and people are not used to it but theyre not enough people here at least on the surface it doesnt seem as though there are enough people here to put aside their own interests and worry about the common good isnt that the problem that is one of the problems is not only one the negative interference from regional players and International Players and the competition by these countries in libya as a proxy to their own issues is a dramatic issue that is causing us a lot of trouble if they just lift their hands from libya and let us deal with it we werent even in a better isnt that just looking around for someone else to blame tell me where the weapons come from do you think these are the weapons of gadhafi no thats a serious issue certainly apart from your own internal politics and internal squabbles and violence there are huge concerns about your treatment of migrants libya in february e. U. Leaders agreed to a controversial plan that stem the flow of migrants from from libya but weve seen them subject since then to massive abuse and your coast guard actually sometimes shoots at them i mean what what kind of treatment is this what kind of humanity is this in libya first of all youre putting issues that are not necessarily the full facts i will tell you for example when the all the europe is talking about fighting or combating illegal migration where theyre coming out of their countries and their ultimate. Target is to reach europe not libya were just a passage and were a country of conflict. Were a country were divided we have limited resources how do you expect us to deal with this flood where even europe is not able to manage it if theyre not youre saying that it has you dont have sufficient resources you coast guards around you no thats not true thats not actually a few gee thats not true thats not true well this is from the high commissioner for human rights know last month zaid. We never he never said that we were shooting he said you have a coast guard that sometimes rescue migrants this is exactly you have a coast guard that sometimes rescues migrants in distress but sometimes chooses not to like the musicians on shore coast guards also sometimes beat rob and even shoot the migrants they intercept this is a direct quote from him. Let me tell you the facts are you saying he knows nothing no i did soon as i was i said if we dont shoot migrants what were doing is trying to apply our sovereign rules and regulations and by saving their lives and bringing them back this is an International Agreement this is an e. U. Libya agreement weisel for years there was just a few operations do it then why are there now are this why dont they let the migrants flow go to it to italy and to europe themselves so its not part of the agreement to beat them up and nobodys in a detention nobody said well do that makes also front year says the detention of migrants is rotten to the core a thriving enterprise of kidnapping torture and extortion migrants are locked up women and girls are being beaten and raped by the guards men are being beaten up there are definite this is under your care you know this could not let me put it this way there are definitely some certain occasions where some things like this could happen again they did happen that people dont make the story i did i said it could happen but its not the norm its not a look at the numbers look at the numbers in front of the challenges that we have look at then when you talk about two hundred thousand migrants coming into libya and nobodys looking about protecting our south and border theyre only looking at the shores of libya thats where there is international sponsibility should come in that when theyre not giving us enough resources where were divided we have frozen assets we dont have the funds even to build in Detention Centers that we can work i understand these are just that excuse the abuse that is nobody im just telling you that the more numbers you have using what you have in this information as an excuse im giving you why they are beaten up and im giving you the facts that were cause a lot of problems that we dont have the resources even to manage these Detention Centers all around libya was a lack of humanity that this there is shows no straight this is something that proves that we are in a serious trouble that we need a lot of support to fix the conflict in libya how is it that you people can treat migrants this way people. Treated with such incredible cruelty people have nothing. Of feeling war trying to get somewhere else and youre beaten up and raped in your Detention Centers its not something that is common dont show it as if its something all around it is cases there are cases which we dont accept thats true but look at the Bigger Picture look how many lives we saved look how many this is recognised even with the same resources you have and you dont think this is damaging to your rep it is a country and its something that we dont accept and we have libyans i dont see why the ballot is its not only accept it what are you doing thats the issue we have our minister of interior working on it we have our Civil Society working and supporting it we are all International Organizations to work and support in these Detention Centers. Are there supervising thats the best we can do now and were doing our best in it but what im telling you its a massive thing that even European Countries who are well studied states could not fix i want to ask you why are they not focusing of the root cause of this migrants youre looking at the outcome definitely a problem human rights abuses is something we dont accept but how do we resolve that only by the final stage where they reach libya or we look at how why did they come from the first place there its something that is related to our economy in their countries where europeans going to you know just tell me its someone elses fault im saying its a coup not accepting this level of response no i think its a collective responsible you are accepting responsibility i am not how it is we should as a government respond thats why were fixing it but what im saying is that its a collective responsibility you just dont look at one part of the story you have to look at it all over youre talking about a country with three governments as you said with arms all around with terrorism all around with that we were fighting all this on behalf of the world we have migrants all over we have organized crime this is something that not just a government can easily handle by its own even for united it needs support from the old. Six years subsequent to revolution six years on can you really honestly imagine anything approaching a functioning democracy and absolutely because. What if the steps of history says that the more you go on doesnt say that about libya history doesnt say that about libya so theres no way id rather the arab world does it no i mean there are countries in the arab world that went in a better phase than us because they had institutions to start with tunisia and egypt as an example even though they went through the arab spring but they were managed to stand on their feet and they didnt have an Armed Conflict tunisia is the last country that has a shred of democracy in the arab world thats what im trying to say im talking about the amount of conflict and and crisis that were facing look at the look at the nature of the way these countries were ruled we look at yemen look at iraq you look at syria you look at lieberman email your home in libya how many more years going to here is this going to go on this chaos no violence no other how much how long i dont think its going to take long but im talking about i mean i think i five to ten years in order us to have a steady state and a stable state to be realistic. Something its good to have your culture thank you very much thank you very different. So much. Some of the worlds finest florists are competing in court and in the spanish citys famous patios they let the flowers do the talking. Join us as we accompany floral artists around the International Flower festival. In paradise plants. In thirty minutes. And then fresh because i mean speak your language talk about them. For content in dari pashto. Prospects for returning our web special refugio journeys like germany and the prospects for those returning home. Join the discussion on t w dot com and on facebook. Prospects. For returning. To w maybe for mine. You dont expect the visitors hey its the anastasia isnt silly this is not every day you boys in the house night news on w kim and vegas house of music stores up close and personal and unplugged. Night groups starting november third on d w week. But im wondering if you know i mean in your monotonous he. Goes over my dance for sending. Us all up without it but i. Want to get. It on wood. This you know i mean in your mind noticing going. On a moment to notice. What im focused on him is here but im with what him like and i said i know what its a time of. This you know i mean in your mind not a single i knew him when you die i dont want to. Me nobody and unanimous. The show could go because i see it yes its a. Question on. What ive only said but i thought going on with her being funded. By mackenzie it gets us into sassy. This is d. W. News live from bali and confusion in catalonia the regions president had been expected to call for ice not december election about an announcement expected in the last i was supposed to late on that suspended so where does this leave the regions deadlocked with spain over independence one life to bosler all