Ating and exposing the israeli regimes global war against solidarity with the illegally occupied people of palestine. In this weeks show well be asking why the archbishop of canterbury seems to be in thrall to zionist extremists. The church of england used to be referred to as the British Conservative Party at prayer. But Justin Welbys leadership of the church has gone even further. Hes positioned it as an adjunct to the genocidal zionist regime. Welby is effectively putting the church at the service of benjamin netanyahu. As latif abuchakra will explain in this report. The archbishop of canterbury, justin welby recently cancelled plans to meet lutheran pastor munder ishak from the illegally occupied west bank town of bethlehem. He reportedly said he could not meet him if he shared a platform with the former labor leader Jeremy Corbin a propalestinian rally. Ishak, the pastor of the Christmas Evangelical Lutheran Church in bethlehem. In his christmas sermon said that if jesus christ was born today, it would have been under the rubble. Recordings of this speech and nativity display were seen all over the world on social and conventional media. Is hark said, its shameful, its not my type of christianity not to be willing to meet another pastor because you do not want to explain why you met him. The archbishop is said to have been concerned about the alleged huge increase in antisemitism since october. In the uk, reportedly, fearing it would have caused huge problems for the Jewish Community if the two mat. Mention of corbin and the alleged rise of antisemitism are clues that welby is paroting zionist talking points. It comes as little surprised then, to learn, he is involved with lobby group with Close Relationships with the zionist regime itself. He is president of the council of christians and jews, an organization set up in the 1940s. According to its own reports, the Council Takes people tours of occupied palestine to illegal israeli settlements and meeting with Israeli Government officials. The group has been a zionist front since the 1980s, at least. It was then that veteran a zionist activist sir sigmond sternberg, who died in 2016, got involved. Starnberg was also involved in creating the three faiths forum in 1997 in order to include muslims in interfaith dialogue. In reality, this. Was about penetrating muslim communities and turning them away from criticism of zionism. As the official biographer of the ccj, and the cofounder of the three faiths forum, reverend marcus baby brook, candidly admitted. With the growing importance of the muslim community, the festering wounds in israel and palestine and the growth of extremism. Muslim, jewish and christian dialogue has a special importance. Today, the ccj also works with the united jewish israel. Which also involves itself taking students on trips to illegal israeli settlements as a part of the racist socalled birthright program. The head of Israel Engagement at the ujia, robin moss, described the ccj as carrying out pioneering work. The director of the wellbe group was until recently Elizabeth Harris swazenko who worked for the Israeli Government funded abraham initiatives at the same time. Abraham initiatives claim to exist to increase synergy between uk and israeli bodies and agencies. Justin welby is, in other words, deeply embedded in the promotion of the genocidal ideology of zionism. Joining me in the studio as usual is our resident expert david miller. Davids an of academic and a former professor at Bristol University and is now a nonresident Senior Research fellow at the center of islam and Global Affairs at istanbul zium. University, hes also a codirector of the lobby and watch dog spinwatch and is a leading british scholarly critic of israel, and im pleased to welcome back the reverend dr. Stephen seiser again as our guest contributor today. Type stephen is a longstanding human rights campaigner and an outspoken supporter of the palestinian people. Hes been targeted by the israel lobby who raiged vicious and vicuperative campaign against him over many years. Indeed, the archbishop of cantery, whos one of the subjects of todays show, even joined in the attacks with an entirely unwarranted and gratuitous statement about reverend ceiser. Steven is member of various propalestinian groups and hes the founder and director of the peacemaker trust. Hes also written several books in including in the footsteps of jesus and the apostles, christian zionism, roadmap to armagedden, and zions christian soldiers. Welcome to the show. Stephen, you wrote a phd thesis and indeed a book on christian zionism. I mean, i wonder whether you could explain what it is, and why it existed before the creation of the jewish zianist movement . Indeed, thank you for inviting me on the show. Christian zionism as a movement. Preceded jewish zionis about at least 50 years. It was actually 1799 when napoleon became the first world ruler who promised the jews a homeland because he wanted um the jewish bankers for example to support his campaign, his colonial experiments and and help him defeat the british. He was unable to do that, but his um failed attempt uh caught the attention of political and religious leaders. In britain who between them began to speculate about britains role uh in bringing the jews back to the land of palestine in fulfillment of prophecy and and and this coincided with britains strategic interest in controlling the bridge between its colonies and africa, asia and and so on, so it preceded jewish sionism and it underrough. Jewish zionism, the early christian zionists, um, people like lord schaffsby, and and others, william heshler and others, facilitated the early zionists like theodore hutzsel to get hearing among political and religious leaders right across europe, so in a sense um netanyahu was not wrong when he said recently um that zionism would not have existed without. Christianiness uh support, yeah, well david, i mean, the uh, council of christians and jews appears to be just a zianist supporting interfith organization, doesnt it . Well, yes it is, and weve of course, previously discussed zionist role in into faith organizations, this is an organization thats been there since the 1940s, and as you saw in the the film there, one of the things thats interesting about it is that it was reinvigorated in the. Nates by guy called sir Sigmund Sternberg who is key science lobbyist, creator of number of different science lobby groups and he also of course set up the uh the three faiths forum and the forum for the discussion of israel and palestine which we might talk about more later so this is lobby group but it you poses as being an organization which brings together christians and jews to think about how they might have a cooperation etc but of course the real agenda is to make sure uh that they push back again. Antiisonism and criticism of israel, well steven, the the lutheran pastor from bethlehem was responsible for that famous scene of jesus in the rubble at christmas last year, wasnt he . I wonder whether you could tell us about the Christian Churches in palestine and their relationship with the occupation, the Christian Churches have been in palestine from 2000 years ago, the early follows of jesus were jew. And they welcomed in gentile believers and follows of jesus, so the church has been there, initially persecuted by the romans and by the jewish leaders, but then under constantine 325, the roman empire gets converted to christianity nominally, and so you find churches in gaza, in jerusalem, bethlehem, all of the important sites associated with the life of jesus, um, trace that origin. To to uh churches that have existed there for at least 15 1600 years and they survived the um the crusades and the uh the islamic rule as much as the ottoman so theyve been there a very long time they are indigenous they are palestinians and and they have had a strategic role in being a bridge between jews and muslims for centuries yes. Well david, the um the uh uh council for um christians and jews has been involved in setting up um other apparent zianist fronts hasnt it . I mean like the what is it the the three faith . Forum and the uh forum for discussion of israel and palestine, yes, so the three faith forums now called the faith and belief forum, its we set up in order to bring muslims into the the interfaith conversation, but of course the the founder of as we saw in the film there, its pretty clear that uh, it was about tackling the growth of extremism, by which of course they mean muslim extremism, so its about tackling muslims being involved in criticizing israel and criticizing British Foreign policy, thats perfectly clear what what its about, same with the forum. Discussion of israel and palestine is there to have dialogue and mutual understanding, by which of course it means a systematically undermining the idea that is racism, which of course, as everybody now knows it is, so that thats the function these organizations, he was also involved in a number of other uh zionist related organizations which is purely zionist organizations, so this is a series of uh organizations that were set up in order to undermine the possibility of criticism of israel, as of course with all science organizations, well st i mean, whats your view on the on the council of christians and jews then . Well, really, they are the council of christians for jews, you never hear them criticize israel, but they are um, they exist to monitor and criticize christians who advocate for justice and peace for palestinians. Its ironic that even the board of deputies was antisign till the 1940s, but today along with the council of christians for jews and many other organizations which on the surface ostensibly claim they exist to further good relationships between jews and christians. In reality, as david has said, their agenda is to be apologists for zionism and the expansion of israels control of the palestinian territories. Well david, i mean a refer to. This character sir sigmund uh sternberg in her report, didnt she . I mean, just say a bit more about him, will you . So, i mean, hes one of these characters who who performs a role in the british elite, so jewish zianist uh guy whos a kind of a policy entrepreneur and a and kind of cultural entrepreneur, and they they create all these different organizations, weve mentioned some of the the ones theyve created of course already, and and part of the this this agenda, especially the inter faith agenda is. Just about pursuing zinanism, its also about becoming part of the british establishment, so for example the the faith and belief forum is funded by the british government, by the british state, as as are many other into faith and prozionist organizations, i think people would be surprised to hear that, millions of millions of pounds over the last 10 or so years have gone to zionist organizations under the guise of doing counter extremism work or interfaith work or or trying to get people to get on more and of course what that means, what thats code for, is trying to undermine the role of muslims and indeed other pro palestine campaigners in criticizing British Foreign policy, and being antiwar and indeed of of insisting on solidarity with the palestinians. Yes, indeed and i guess sort of drawing veil over or or creating excuse for you, israeli oppression of the palestinian people, it says well of course that i mean thats the the agenda, but i think whats most interesting about it is the role of the. State in directly contributing to science organizations, which i think people wouldnt really understand if they didnt know, no, indeed. Well, well come back to the discussion after our second report that looks at the failure of the Antiwar Movement and the Palestine Solidarity Campaign to properly scrutinize the impact of the zionist lobby in britain and america. The conduct of justin welby is obviously explained best in terms of his connections to designist movement, but some key elements in Antiwar Movement and the Palestine Solidarity Movement want us to turn our attention away from the zionists currently committing the worst genocide since that of the nazis. Instead, we should look at u. S. Imperialism or the british establishment. The result of this, whatever the intentions, will be demobilization, demoralization, and defeat. For these forces, the most important analytical tool for understanding palestine is not zionism. But imperialism. Welby, says kevin ovendon, in response to post on x by the rapper loki, is toy, a former oil industry executive, a rightwinger in theology and politics. According to ovendon, i think youre making a mistake by trying to advance these conjectures. Wellby is a tool the british establishment, not of tel aviv, and those are not the same things. Wellbys motivations are read off from a theoretical proposition. That the tail does not wag the dog. If the evidence contradicts this, it becomes conjecture. In very telling comment, oven then even dismisses the evidence cited by loki. As primitive a substitution for analysis. Analysis here takes on the magisterial garb of the civilized intellectual, looking down on the uncooth, primitive evidencebased activist. This is done, let us be clear, on the basis of prior theory alone, and it will no longer do. But if theories are not open to empirical critique or refutation, their ability to understand the world declines precipitously, and what. What are the strategic implications of this theoreticism for the movement . Presumably that we campaign against the conservative party and oil industry and imperialism, and we ignore designs . Certainly much of the leadership of stopped the war uses the term zionism now and again, but it has been actively discouraged by them, and they certainly dont analyze the dynamics of the zianist movement in the uk and the us, and its manifestly hugely. Damaging penetration of british and american political life, they prefer to see the power of the israel lobby as a myth. Yes, we must intensify pressure on the us and the uk government, and useful research is being done on spy flights, training of israel military, israeli arms firms and more, but in order to be effective, we also need to strike at the heart of the Zionist Movement, its supply lines, its financial and ideological. Support mechanisms, we need to cut off its life support given by the Zionist Movement and its agents, assets and front groups. This is why we need to talk about zionism, disrupt it now and move to a thorough process of designization as soon as possible. David, there seems to be a marked reluctance in in sections of the left to use the z word ie zionism. Mean, whats thats all about you think . Well, if you recall uh during the corbin leadership, there was a moment where John Landsman who was sort of seen as an antizionist in the in the past, at least the leader of momentum of course hes since of course joined the jlm which makes him a jewish labor, yeah, and he was saying we shouldnt use zionism, its a complicated word, people dont understand it, its used badly, its means that you you sometimes trip over into antisemitism by mistake, and and and that thats that was something that that that section of the. Left uh was promoting the idea that we shouldnt talk abonism, but you wouldnt really necessarily expect other sections of the left associated with stop the war or with the Palestine Solidarity Campaign to do the same, but actually they have the same position, actually you can mention you shouldnt talk about it too much, you shouldnt certainly say that scientism has power or any significant power or or you shouldnt really even investigatesm directly as a subject of inquiry, thats um common to many of the leaders of stop the war coming from revolutionary socialist backgrounds not from the labor left but from from much further to left and so that thats a real problem on the left instead what they do is they say oh this is this is to do with imperialism yeah and and and you say how do you know and they say well that thats thats obviously thats the case the tail doesnt like the dog us imperialism is in charge there cannot be any power for this which is of any significance turn your gaze away and of course that means that they dont have any analysis theres no analysis ofism its raw and instead what they say is its a myth and thats not good enough, yes, i mean even the chakrabati Shami Chakrabati review that Jeremy Corbin uh set up talked about sort of avoiding that term, didnt it . Thats right, well, shami of course is is a bit of liberal, but these are people who are who are avoid revolutionary socialists and come from revolutionary socialist tradition, nevertheless they themselves talk about talking a different person, yeah well, well stephen, um, i wonder whether you could uh tell us about the british christian zienist group known as the christian. Friends of israel then . Yes, cfi is one of number of christian organizations who believe that the bible mandates the return of the jews to the land, therefore the land is there, jerusalem is the capital, and the temple is going to be rebuilt, and so they in a sense are part of the zionist, they are in fact part of the zionist lobby attempting to influence christians, to support israel and and designs. Agenda um, they have in a sense substituted jesus, israel for jesus, um, and because of their theological convictions, they actively lobby politicians, Church Leaders on behalf of israel, supporting the settlement program, the alia returning jews to the land, campaigning for the embassies to be moved to jerusalem, um, challenging attempts to to introduce two state. Solution, demonizing the palestinians, theyre really at the forefront along with bridges for peace, the International Christian embassy, christians united for israel, there are a coalition of. Organizations, which means that zionism today is primarily a christian heresy, nine out of 10 zionists are christians, they are naive, they are ignorant of what the bible actually says, but they are causing immense damage to not only the indigenous church, but our hopes for justice and peace and reconciliation in palestine. Yeah, so david, mean this this reluctance to discuss zionism, mean . i mean that leads to an avoidance doesnt it of of looking at the at the activities of of zinis . I mean, i mean youre talking your previous sentence there about this over concentration on the crimes of imperialism, do you think that explains it or is there Something Else going on . I think thats right, i mean if you look at the um the analysis that that that comes out from from many people uh from the leadership of stop the war, its always about saying look imperialisms the way you have to look and they say you know they the. The the main enemies at home and of course thats a brilliant uh dictim for uh for for understanding what people in britain can do about things and yeah the main enemy is at home and of course that means our government and our government is complicit and we should be uh holding it to account but the the other part of the enemy thats a home which theres never mentioned is is of course zonism the Zionist Movement is in this country its directly supporting uh genocide by sending funds to the idf and by promoting ideologically the the. Whole genocide and and theres no discussion of that, of course, if we if we are to defeat zionism and to defeat the genocide, we have to directly take on the zionists in addition to directly taking on the british government, and thats a real problem, i think for the left, for for the strategy of of the antiw, and it means that what happens is you get diluted and diluted into simply calling for sease fire rather than focusing on the real problem uh which we face, which is a which is the the genocide. Do you think its a fear of being . Labeled an antisemite it is, but theres something deeper than that, i think, and that, and that is that actually, that for the for the whole of the last 75 years really, theres been significant zionist influence on the antiracist movement, the antifascist movement, and indeed the Antiwar Movement, and that thats been the the influence, which is which has meant that they take positions where they they start to worry about, if you say what, im not sure were going with that, and that is a mistake, and and we need to be exposing that mistake and moving past it. Yeah, well um, stephen, i wonder whether you might say what you think about Justin Welbys association with the council of christians and jews, i mean is a relevant issue do you think in this controversy . It is, im im deeply saden by the archbishops uh track record with with regard to israel and zionism. There was a time when he thought he had jewish roots that his father was jewish, so um, perhaps that was part of the. Romantic notion that somehow he was linked to the jewish people, um, the clearly the board of deputies and the chief rabbi have nurtured close relationship with him and put pressure on him, um, the adoption of the ihra definition of antisemitism by the archbishops and bishops without any consultation at general synod was clearly imposed on the church, and and thats why weve seen a conflation between, antisianism and antisemitism and the dilution of of antisemitism, which is racism, and it must be opposed, but criticizing israel for racism and apartite is not antisemitic. His track record is is lamentable, youll be well aware of his intervention a week before the last general election when he sided with the chief rabbi condemning Jeremy Corbin, that was conduct unbecoming clergyman should stay out of party politics, um, you every general election, local election, i used to urge my congregation to vote, but i never told them what to vote, and i never told them what i voted, but um, justin welby intervened, that was appalling, and then more recently hes refused to meet with jeff halper from the Israeli Committee against house demolitions, clearly the wrong kind of jew, and then he wouldnt be with monther isaac. The palestinian, the wrong kind of christian. Hes clearly coming under lot of influence from design lobby, and he seems to be content with being part of that lobby. He refuses to use the word apartite, genocide, ethnic cleansing, and therefore he is complicit with the appalling events weve seen in gaza recently. Yeah, its a very sad state of affairs for the most senior uh churchman. In the church of england, the established church to be taking the positions that he has, but thank you stephen, for your contributions, im afraid we are out of time again today, so let me thank, the reverend dr. Stephen seiser for joining us today and of course our resident expert professor david miller. Palestine classified, well be back next week with more forensic investigations and analysis. And in the meantime, please share todays program on your social media platforms to help us continue growing our audience and countering the disinformation turned out by the corporate media. And remember you can follow the show on facebook, twitter and telegram where we post regular clips and updates. So until next time, this is quist williamson, saying bye for now. The 12th round of the parliamentary elections were held in iran, have winds of change already started blowing . Will the country have new parliament with new configuration and new priorities . These and more on this edition of iran today. Last year irans president ibrahim raisi visited three african countries, kenya, uganda and zimbabwe. President raisi witnessed the signing of bilateral cooperation agreements in economic, scientific and educational sectors among others and in this regard iran has granted full scholarships to ugadan students to study in iranian universities. The headlines, dozens more palestinians fall victim to ongoing israely strikes on gaza, raising the total deathth of the aggression to nearly 31,00. China says the deadly israely onslot on gaza is a tragedy from humankind and a disgrace for civilization, calling for an. Immediate ceasefire and the us military confirms a missile attack a commercial ship in the gulf of the aiden as the emmy Army Continues to target israeli bound vessels