A relative nobody fairly quickly i believe that the authors of the sort of area cordoned off now are an Airline People to go about their daily business. Indeed the area behind me is a cordoned off thats where that attack gets a place of course this is the iconic. Building which was also holds the k. G. B. Tearing at some good times and this is where that tactic plays now this is the only area thats blocked off but at the moment right after thats active place that this entire place was blocked for ball for traffic for the best friends and the entrances to the petrol stations are workloads as well but at the moment as you can see traffic the transportation has set backs normal natural stations are open. Back to their. Normal normal things. Well still a lot of people here filming with their cell phone and so trying to find out what happened but something has to be said about where that attack took place this is the heart off the russian capital russia if you will like to the right of me is said joy store one of the oldest the oldest toy store in russia the biggest one as well the kremlin is sell only about 5600 meters away a russian state duma russias parliament is also just a stones throw away russias president ial Administration Building is also right over there there are plenty all for a boutique sands at a restaurant sorry here and speak other store sue the famous sat me close to a street which was very popular during the people world cup in the summer of 2018 is also right here so a very busy area indeed self had the assailants been a successful in his endeavors there would have been a lot more casualties but as we do know right now one f. S. B. An officer had been killed as a result of that attack and Russian Health ministry reported that 75 people are being treated with the various state injuries and now moscow hospitals until one f. S. B. Officer is currently on the operating table and medics are trying to save his life thats actually placed to just pass or 6 pm here most cosigned and this is the end all for the office lady and all the office hours. Also people to go to Stores People sick so are restaurants of course this is. A Holiday Season people are trying to buy presents for the new years for christmas and the holidays so that they could. A lot more casualties than there were initially and people were some people were sitting in restaurants when they heard the shots lawyers some people were in the stores and initially nobody expects this to happen in the center of a major capital to people initially on the stamp or was happening some were actually. Asking each other what were those sounds that they were hearing and of course later it dawned on them what did take place all russias. Police russias National Guard and even Traffic Police were all instrumental in making sure that said there were no more casualties and they cleared the streets and made sure that nobody else that got hurt its course we suppose spoke to some of the people that were initial eyewitnesses in this incident this is what they told us. Ok for them not be able to listen to the many thanks to report from our correspondent rym on crossing. The killer said to him a cohesive russia analyst and author joins us now get into. Its hard to establish you know for certain what the motivation was impossible at this point the motivation of the attack and weve listened to some counterterrorism experts conflicting opinion some say this would be terrorism its an iconic building the f. S. B. Is politically motivated as of said you know could just be disgruntled former employee someone for whatever reason wanting to direct their assault upon. An established sort of icon of the government what was your 1st reaction to the news 1st reaction was that the timing is very significant tomorrow is the day of the game thats dzhokhar and chicago were set up in just about 117 by. Linen to counter all of the bolshevik activities and then the k. G. B. Was one of the following institutions and today is the f. S. B. And the word libya everyone remembers this word libya from the stalin era and so on and you find it in fiction and also in. The histories and so on and its a very iconic place now i think because this person apparently could make a k 47 and he could have gone into jets he really could have run into any restaurant shortages really people as you like but that was not his objective because he found that in america quite quite often a single gunman suddenly. There was this picture you got to do it because really shoulders of many people as possible this did not happen this person identified the Security Services the f. S. B. Which is obsessed successful decision to the k. G. B. He was average obviously extremely a tiger by something that happened probably to his family. Or to somebody as friends or somebody else could be interesting to discover whether he was nuts aggression or whether he was one of the other wrestlers in russia. And then try to work back is the lone wolf thats the problem is the fear of the Security Services here in london if its an attack is he a little more fizzy acting resume or easy a member of a group so therefore you may have an attack somewhere else maybe another tack to morrow and so on and these people are willing to sacrifice their lives because nobody in his right mind can take in a k 47. I tend to get into the lubyanka and start firing at the guards hes bound to be killed he knew that his ruling to sacrifice life therefore is that a group israel is. A certain Destiny Group which believes that its worth sacrificing one of the number to make this really a public event. Is a scandal and makes this world news and if youd like proof that oppression put in good real Good Business strong as he thinks he is in store because he was at a dinner celebrating on the eve of the day of the chicken Security Services in the kremlin so the timing for me is somebody who either was a former member. Of the f. S. B. The k. G. B. Or somebody who was associated with it or somebody who had an animus against it a pop culture member of his family or if hes not a street russian remember this is the group who suffered. And he may on his own maybe along wolf result he decided to take revenge and he knew he was going to be killed so he didnt want to kill russians he didnt want to kill tourists he just wanted to kill those associated with the Security Services now the f. S. B. And if he killed one blue he would then say that ive achieved my objective because i would be killed as well so its extremely difficult to understand the mentality of that tell a person whos willing to do what age was it says the youngest has been indoctrinated has been misled and so on. And has been brainwashed if you like. And especially because none ethnic russians believe most significant is anonymous against the authorities must go and against the Security Services. Who we see unfortunately we now know hes dead so the free country questions will they have to find others and i did state that because he makes sure he has no documentation on him so they can only do that so the only go by foot. Figure principal photographs from direct that control identified really quite a difficult job a little work backwards. What do we do or who did the associated with do we knew him in fact is somebody who is not known to the authorities not called police not known to Security Services and he is usually most effective because hes on no really out of the blue that is not expected and therefore is not suspected. And the key thing now for the authorities is to work out screwed as well as to work out whether its a low roof a mission only which is which began today on the eve of the day of the chika Security Services that it will be another attack say tomorrow which is the day celebrating the Security Services or afterwards is there a group who are willing 2nd resolution these are the terrible questions which the. Authorities have to think through the only way to do that is by tracing his. Background talking to people who knew him. Did what there was in the street missed me anyway did he have any animist against the f. S. B. Or granta was really a blanket a symbol of hate the symbol of oppression the sing the hope of terrorism for him. Was his family did his family suffer in the past and so on all these questions have to be asked and explored and then you get together the type of psychological profile of this person. To use and try to work out. As much as you can about it. You then come to the clues. May come to conclusion youre not certain because its very dangerous to come to a conclusion or say thats an untruth. Because there are so many people out there now some people have access to weapons its very easy to crack our weapons and they can pick up one. And you go on the rampage and if you look at america where you could see to be cursed was individuals who suddenly because theyve been downgraded to all the good bad marks in school girls have mocked him and so on to pick up a gun and start killing people and that seems to be a worldwide phenomenon now one of the reasons for that is always in Television Everyone sees now here when she uses a tack. Say to himself i would like to do that because i would then be famous because some killers. Terrorist they want to become famous and the world press will make them Famous Television will make them famous and therefore they go for that but its very difficult if a person is a normal rational balanced individual he wouldnt act like this but its very difficult to judge how a person then goes from that which you always like that. Did someone then. Introduce him to some radical ideas or did he did he actually job so theres a whole host of these questions which the authorities will have to deal with in the coming weeks and months Daniel Hawkins in the studio here alongside me. A number of quite comprehensive theories there are a lot of questions to be answered by the investigators as they carry out their investigation there in terms of that the this part of global attacks that weve seen from the studio and beyond a number of them the particular London Bridge 2 attacks there the bombing is it a case that these sorts of attacks these whatever they may be people with a lone wolf isis inspired people who just want to want to see the world as was said in the movie famously is it just that we have a more of an awareness that thats taking place because of the media because of social media because everybody has smartphones or are we seeing an increasing number. These attacks theyre all getting increasingly harder to prevent despite the police having more resources and more technology. Technically impossible to prevent them all theres no such thing as too closely curiously thats a myth and all they can do is to get as near as possible to told security but the interesting thing is that now when theres a shooting and what is our liaison with the British Press when i heard it outside is his hotel in buenos aires recently that got great publicity how many people will now go to borders out is because of that. The same thing happens in brazil thats pretty Dangerous Things that happens in a drug store and in mexico then you have the cartels the drug cartels from the murders and saw assassinations and its part of the temperature of life at present but one shouldnt say that this is new because if you could like the 1918 century need to look at russia it was normal for the radicals to go around with bombs and kill people. Alexander the 2nd was assassinated so therefore russia has had a long history in 14 great assassinations and violent acts because there were was a minority. Who believe that is only way to that they could come to power that they could they they said the people were oppressed and so while there for they would root they would in fact kill eliminate those who were pressuring them the leadership and we always believed that if the learned the czar or the kaiser somebody that that would change everything because it didnt it made the police more wary and the they came down harder on the terrorists on the political opponents and so on so if you like what is going on no in fact a continuation of what happened in the past and the further back you go in history the more assassinations the murders you find. And the Police Forces now. Its more sophisticated the more information and the more wary of people. And you have checks and so on but again i would stress that you could get the person you are to god is normal if there is such a thing as a normal person a normal person suddenly changes and becomes a radical and believes that he or she should go out and kill somebody. Has an animus against the Security Service perhaps the state hates the state. Hates the people in it somethings happened to them in the past or the family and its very very difficult to identify and isolate the type of person because of what it does psychology and psychology is in many ways still a developing discipline you cant really if you ask questions such as why did he do this theres no definite answer to that in psychology that would give you a whole range of long since would you do psychology will study psychology you study a whole range of possibilities. And the difficulty today is that no british nobody unfortunately the world is safe from the ball thats what the average person would say you can travel to any country you can even go to Australia New Zealand and you can end up by buying big killed murdered by a radical or some type of radical so you cant even say that any country is perfectly safe and the amazing thing is that more more people are willing to travel now to say right ill take that risk it is a risk. Im going to live with that risk and im not going to allow them to win i must not allow the radicals world we dont wounds to scare me to death so i dont do what i want to do and live a normal life and thats the best way i suppose to counter these people say im not afraid if you cocreating killed one or 2 people but unlikely to be scared and you would be dead. Were going to. A normal life because a normal life is now quite difficult as such so many security checks if you go through an airport you go through similar security checks thats becoming weve got no 1203030 years ago. If you go to dial 10 downing street i can remember going up to the number of 10 number 10 downing street and standing in front of it and getting a photograph taken nowadays you cant get anywhere near it so the world has changed and security is now much stricter but unfortunately there will be incidents like this because. No one understands even psychiatrist little bit its time the human mind and youre going to have a lot of theories about motivation and so on and counterterrorism some they do their best because very often theyre guessing. And. When they get information they have the problem of how do you judge whether this is accurate or not this is another problem because if you are a terrorist or youre planning something you provide a fake information. And get people to take you to give wrong information so so you have this problem. And you say to the authorities. We wish you the best of luck among going to commiserate with the families of those who have died and hope that it doesnt happen again but unfortunately be no it will happen again somewhere maybe in russia may be in china maybe somewhere else youve got it now reported in practically every country in the world so therefore its is it is it copycat its a scene on television to somebody say that maybe a disturbed person may be a rational person i could i could do that and ive become famous and im still not become a big night or a big woman so because all through International Television which goes everywhere radio because everywhere especially television because it shows images. A lot bigger when. Oh right. I would like i could think of doing that because i hate hate america right if you dont. You know i would like to do something to her actually from school so unfortunately live in that type of world no we can do is to do a normal normal life if possible and say were not going to allow these people to disturb our lives and we live in a democracy and we allow freedom of speech and they can get a view but if we move them from their view to action then we will intervene and deal with and to do martin good to speak to this evening my guest Martin Mccauley author russia thank you. But its done hawkins in the studio lets just remind the viewers if you just. It was a shooting incident outside the f. S. B. Headquarters in central moscow at around 6 pm local time so just in the 7 hours ago the salient points now looking at what one shooter has been killed one victim killed and several injuries what else as for your Health Ministry as we said confirmed 5 casualties one of them still in Critical Condition one of them tragically killed the f. S. B. Officer likely pushed back the attacker from entering or further into the building the road traffic officer as well caught in the gunfire and the others have been taken to local hospital martin there commenting obviously on well the complexities of this must occasion of all of what grows reasons this could be and there could be so many out there weve speculated on terrorism because of the target because the timing but he quite rightly said at this stage until it is officially confirmed it really could be anything. Obviously in those early minutes the 1st moments be attack we can hear the shooting there the terror experienced by people obviously by witness accounts maybe an accurate maybe exaggerated we spoke to some eyewitnesses on the ground to see what they saw and heard. What they went through in those opening minutes. When im with you were sitting in a basement were watching now when a guy came in who just been outside and he told us there was a shooting out and also an injured pass and he told us the injured party had been dragged into a cafe well we dont know the details we were busy walk on august 20th what do you know the deal yeah it was scary to. Suppose that about an hour and a half ago there were shots being fired and people came running down the street i was it worth of the time soon all the area was cardinal some people say they saw people burning in cross the street from the quay feast it was frightening and really even the bomb disposal teams were going to call it its so we were afraid to leave. This attack of course coinciding with the eve of National Security forces day in russia check of martin said they were not in 17 found have been the case youve been you know their 1st be their successor tomorrow they will be celebrating their day in russia putin is going to speech on the eve of that day ironically talking about the importance of tackling street wisdom of rooting out. Fundamentalism or ideology to prevent things going further when people feel they do have a need to act violently to prove a point this is a fragment of a speech earlier on today. But they were used to extreme we need to be more active in countering extremism its necessary just compromising lisa president of occasions who violence that seems to drool people is officially you into the social radical actually that you are that is good but i mean the basic. Well as the investigators carry out their work theyll obviously be looking at 2 forensics at c. C. T. V. No doubt we may even see some further raids coming tonight by Security Forces when they find out their identity of this attack of their family their friends who are they communicating with was this purely a. Had entirely acting alone was inspired by a religious group a terrorist group that political motives was it simply something to do with Mental Health always questions of course will be answered in the coming hours on base camp. David the key points within the c. D. s we have been getting analysis from multiple guess throughout the last few hours antiterrorism expert david low thats the possibility not been ruled out that this could be a terrorist attack and expert david lowe noted that lone wolf attacks are particularly difficult to defend against. The head of any Counterterrorism Police or any have those Security State security they will tell you its virtually impossible to stop everyone especially you have an individual if theyve not been on the system or that not been assessed as a great risk of the being on the system were acting on their own initiative its very hard but what we are seeing what we are seeing is making it very very difficult for organized cells to operate i mean one example in the u. K. Was a month just the bombing but he did not work on his own he had all the individuals and its getting harder and harder for them to operate on a no not just in the u. K. And no in other states around europe a number of plots are actually been prevented the work of the Security Service and Counterterrorism Police because theyve got to communicate with each other beyond an individual who is inspired by what they see online my messages and they are acting alone theyre very very difficult to try and prevent those its acts and we see it again globally there might be a Higher Police presence in certain areas that been identified as a potential risk of me i mentioned before you know you got seen boncelles cathedral the kremlin and so. Well they are very popular and you know they be looking out on props increase their physical presence well also props being imo izing again what intelligence states is that and see if you can make any links and what may come out is to look at this individual that once they identify this individual look his promises look at what hes been looking online there may be some links there and we just dont know. So the woman if we have to go and take a quick break hold it within the studio one thing that really grabs me about this deceiving and you see it time and time again when theres a breaking news story very hard to establish whether something is terrorism or not immediately really at the most you do authorities have to do all the hard work what you talking about it in the background because its its its easy to jump to that conclusion not always the case often is and i think thats the danger why so. Big news china idolizing what is a very complex case public concern and that would include of us looking at the. Background look at their social media what clues can you glean from their activities from their movements from their Communications Interfaces we do come to some videos that were playing theyve been filmed seemingly by civilian some accounts of civilian journalist sometimes these videos coming helpful and shed light on an engine but other times they can be very misleading and sometimes people actually post deliberately misleading. Footage we just compute is a complicated everything thats right weve seen that in previous attacks indeed in the London Bridge attack we even used both footage and images from there and indeed analyses off the sort of distorted just as political points famously one of the relatives of each other which victims accuse the u. K. Prime minister Boris Johnson of scoring political points and the school should support him in this case whatever the motives whether its Mental Health or the struggle with this terrorism to look at things objectively look at the facts and obviously come to the right conclusions will serve im doing our best you know interesting challenging circumstances thanks for staying with r. T. Were going take a very short break as i just mentioned more analysis and updated information coming your way in a couple of minutes time. Argentina love it this country is phantasmagorical the people are extraordinary the government and the central bank maybe not so much think of the bank but lets get into the thought of more detail. In the troubled 19 seventies a group of killers rampage through parts of Northern Ireland that was coordinated loyalist attacks particularly a population of tens of thousands forced to flee their homes and what was striking to put these attacks was a p. R. You see the Police Actually took part in the attacks so instead of preventing it they were active participants in the burning of full streets in belfast at the take more than a 100 innocent civilians were. Seniors and we found out more i was surprised about the extent. To which the inclusion was involved in some of those cases the killers would later be named. And were getting i think it went to the very very top i think it is. The water where politicians you know on and give the go ahead. This is a stick from the water bottle phone in the stomach of a fish the brand is part of the Cocacola Company which sells millions of bottles of soda every day the idea was that lets tell consumers theyre the bad ones theyre the litter box theyre trying to sway industry should be blamed for all this waste the company has long promised to reuse the plastic. Thats. In their classes chris. Especially projects funded. On the disease. But for now the mountains of waste only grow higher. One person has been killed in a shooting that occurred near the federal Security Service building in central moscow witnesses have described what they saw. There and you had 5 or 10 minutes past 6 the gunfire began and it was not just a few shots that came in bursts we saw officers taking cover behind because they knew to release footage reportedly shows the shooter at the moment of the attack they say the attacker was acting alone she just identity that has yet to be confirmed