You slowly. Every time I guess to. Have it something else. Which I'm opposed to. I really want to say. Slain. Radio. I was a Rita Ora with a let you love me in before that the new one from over with compiled let it was before you go I love him. I love a new song. I just love love it's called a I don't fancy I'm no Alice producer Alice I'm the guy I think it was about 4 months ago the producer I was confessed to me that she would fancy probably I'm Ok I'm still upset with the but. Coming up at half past 8 in 20 minutes time. We're going to be speaking to c.j. From Yorkshire mesmerize. He's going to be my 10 burning questions guest help answering 10 burning questions about Haiti. Because it's been hate the testing week this last week and on Sunday is National Aids Day. So it's a good time speech and all about how to prevent it what to do if you have it all that stuff. And I'm very excited to have on the before on the show if you're a regular listener you'll recognize c.j. Was wonderful I got tested live on the. So he's going to check to us and get. Very concise 10 questions all about Harvey a very exciting 20 minutes time. I've also got my best Spitz coming up on the show quite fast 9 as I say it's going to be very very good this week says there's a very special thing happening. And. I don't I mean I just I just have no words to explain what's going to go on but. I'm sure you're going to love it. And I half past 9 each week I give you a weekly playlist this week the playlist is movie a mud Jay. Songs that came from films. But not seem songs I'm I'm not doing that stuff now and I know a lot of pop songs that was good songs in their own right but I actually came from felt this is a good concept so I just don't know. All of this and some good music coming up from Georgia Smith Selena Gomez Joel Coen the Katy Perry think is a new one from Katy Perry So 6 are in stick around for that but now it said Sharon and Camilla with south of the books I. Know isn't that was a lie. That's coming up in a minute I'm sorry hold on. I know. Around Oh. I'm going to use drugs. They. Can't let me go. Back at the. Price with the. Books. Know. I want to know but they are wrong. I want to. Go way. Way. Way to go. Let me go I'm going to. Click on face b.b.c. Radio. 0. 0 to be close to the pole to. Be free comes out of the boat in the. Q. You know where that. Comes out. Through a lot of. Who. You are you do. You. Just Smith with where did I go. It is 2020 good time 20 past 8 a minute the 25th of November I'm Beth McCarthy You're listening to b.b.c. Radio York and coming up in 10 minutes time I'll see Jay from your shame as much he's going to be hits Ansa 10 burning questions about HIV and Aids and I'm very excited to have him here because I love raising awareness and smashing stigmas and that's exactly what he's going to do so that's coming in 10 minutes time. So it is no revelation to regular listeners that I love myself some trash t.v. Yes I love it love it and this week I've been a full blown binge watching 1st date Yeah 1st date if you don't know it that is a real shame because it's a truly brilliant show right basically it's a reality dating show where people go on 1st days and you get to watch the whole thing just from start to finish just get to watch people go on the 37th date is a blind date so there's so far that produces the show. Quizzes about what they want in a person involved and then they get matched and then they go to this 1st dates restaurant which is a whole restaurant dedicated to the show the 1st day it's on if it's a real restaurant in real life and I have to look inspect the room. And I have a nice. And then they decide at the end if they want to see each other again and I absolutely love it it's so wholesome I just I think it's just because it's mind me that I love exists and it just I just like that in my mind but you know people can just me in a weird situation and not have any clue about each other and then just gets marriage there after it's just Q This is Q and sometimes horrible cause they don't go on it's weird but it's pretty good show anyway in my binge watching this week a phone myself feed and raise sorry for the boss and right because people can't seem to just order a drink normally it's actually frustrated me I've watched too much is I need a life but anyway they can just go oh yeah clavicle so wanting play the can't do that becomes Co You have a glass of wine or read the menu pick something off the menu that actually exists and go yes I will have that thing that is named that no no no it has to be some sort of weird description or like fumble around something right let me give an example a k. So this 1st guy here is. The guy who is behind the bar will go Oh they'll sit down you know how you write you know kind of get you a drink and this guy this was his response interesting how your most interesting and interesting ale Well the heck is an interesting ale what sorry and interesting ale I can just go I'll have that ale out of the 1st I can see please or that one on the menu that describes what it is no feel most interesting it. No I don't understand I don't understand Ok this next lady this for straight me so I was like What the heck are you talking about I want to get 3. 100 more you know I want to literature in case old coots reach out to you because 3 drink why not this is the other thing right. This is the of they merge lane that's the bartenders name always responds to these things like oh yeah blah blah why not. The guy who will have a bloody pot and he goes Oh God Paul why don't. You still respond like that stop responding like got my leg just have a normal response anyway if you're not sold on this ranting i did i Pod This is another one and this happens in everyday life this happened to me and it's so straight saying Ok you know people have this one object of that they used to describe things that are not this one object of write off what you want to drink I might go right she didn't. She couldn't tell me why not why not to get in some way to change k y y y is a cheeky what makes a cheeky is a going to flirt with you probably not know because it's a trick she teach in and Tony Abbott so often suspicious gin and tonic please. But I have a really you know skinheads gin until I did well you know about cheeky whatever when people say cheeky Nom does well in that show nothing cheeky about it. And this lady this lady told him how whole life story what would you like to drink. And he. Was a good thing only good thing will not last time I did why does why does Millie want to know that you will pay I don't get it oh no nothing you definitely not cope I don't understand it right this one this is the worst the worst ever if anybody was on a date with me and said this ugly. Surprise may. No no no because there's no it never is a thing is a surprise may be there's always a follow up question well what spirits do you like oh well what kind of thing no you can't say surprise me make a decision yourself just makes it I've really liked his response that this was the response finally supporting Yes. If you think he got the one surprise you I mean a ha moment just beautiful beautiful man. Who promised the world enough cell phone would. Put you 1st and you would dog it You plan this the. Put you for the new. Surface. McCarthy b.b.c. Radio. I was Selena Gomez with the song just makes me want to cry every single time I hear it Lucy to love me she's come back with a vengeance I'm sure that Selena a mom a for any man. So it is hard pressed 8 on Monday the 25th of November I'm Beth McCarthy You're listening to b.b.c. Radio and I'm very excited because I have a new guest in the studio it's. All right. So c.j. Is joining me from Yorkshire Mez McCabe you look branch a few options mac and that house the house life it's good thank you yeah it's busy but it's good yeah amazing you've joined me you've been on the show before talk about this exact topic yeah yeah and but I thought we would bring you back in to talk about this because it's been the testing week last week the House yet just finished and and on Sunday it's National Aids Day World Aids Well yeah well actually. I'd say so it seems like a really good time to keep raising awareness about HIV and Aids and just basically smash them stick was like you always have to do a job and get to the bottom of it so you're going to be answering 10 burning questions Ok about hate Harvey and it's precious all my reading. So closely 1st let's cover the basics what is hate. So HIV stands for human immunodeficiency virus so it's a bit of a long commute loo title is a lot of what it is quite a few words but in essence it's it's a virus so it's a virus that's passed on usually through a protected sex but it's it can be passed on through coming into contact with infected bodily fluids basically so it's usually through a protected sex. But it can be through sharing needles by mother's breast feeding them in other ways in which you can come into contact with infected blood. So it's a virus that goes after your immune system basically so it goes after the the white blood cells the t. Helper cells in your body which help you know protect you from infections. Of the virus goes after those it takes them over replicates and over a period of time it basically will attack you immune system until it's really really the word not good and at that point then you have the ability to get infections that you wouldn't normally get so really kind of unusual things different types of pneumonia different types of cancer that the body normally protects us from getting because of the effects of HIV then we can get those and that's what we call aids so that's quite immune deficiency syndrome and that's where the virus is basically done its job with an open to get these infections which can be quite serious so high HIV kind of leads to a Yes yes h. Of these the actual virus itself and aids is not a particular disease as such it's more of a syndrome which allows different diseases and infections to get into our body and then have its effect on us so yeah the 2 separate things so what are the symptoms of hate Harvey Are there any can you detect it kind of by yourself just be aware of the fact that you may have may have been around and well yeah that's always a good one to start with yeah it is a tricky thing so usually a person will have what's called a seroconversion illness so that happens a few weeks after they've been infected HIV It's usually things like having the flu like a really bad case of the flu you might get a Russian you chest to run your feet you might get swollen lymph nodes in the neck . Those are kind of signs and symptoms of HIV infection but you know a lot of people miss those because a lot people got the flu a lot of people get rushes a lot of people who. Of sort of nodes of you know colds about the kind of infection so it's really easy to miss these symptoms and then HIV won't have any signs of symptoms for the brave years so people could go 678 years even longer without realizing they have HIV unless they get tested. And it's only until we reach those later stages of HIV where you know those kind of strange infections those aids defining illnesses come into play that that you know a person might realize that they have HIV So it's a tricky one so before we get into any more about the kind of medical side of it role and the kind of really important stuff yeah I think my next question is about the stigma surrounding it because a soon as you say aids to anyone Yeah that's just a stigma immediately people have preconceptions I remember it being almost uses a joke in school and been the butt of many jokes and it's been a big part of you know that kind of really negative stigma in science so why does that come from why is that that well I think I think it's a few different reasons for I think initially it's historical things so when HIV Aids 1st became present almost 4 years ago so we saw the 1st cases of Aids in the 1980 was the 1st kind of cases we saw it primarily affected the most marginalized groups in society so gay bisexual men largely sex workers took uses in America's particular problem on how you should so people from the island of 80. You know really marginalized groups of people and so you know big alongside that modernization goes bigotry that a phobia homophobia all these kind of things and so I hate having a became a kind of uneasy way of. Horror I don't know a kind of go along with with these already in-built prejudices so it kind of stems from that. And you know I think the stigma still continues today because it's you know 95 percent of cases of HIV in the u.k. Are sexual based transmission so it's through a protected sex life and you know sex is a funny funny thing it's a lot you would only talk about it. A lot of people feeling comes from talking about it there have been very to boost. Personally and I yeah exactly Yes So it's one of those you know let's not muscle shy about that you know it goes on but so I think by not having conversations around something whatever is it automatically builds a stigma so it could be HIV It could be a number of other things if you know having those conversations if you feel too shy ashamed to talk about it all too embarrassed to talk about it that it's not really going to create this sense of stigma so I think that's probably another reason why why we still continue to see stigma around it so yeah it's definitely know a kind of combination of historical cultural some other aspects as well which all contribute to this kind of ongoing stigma unfortunately sadly but hopefully we're kind of moving away from it a little bit and yeah yeah I'm going to be here for the next 20 minutes or so and talk about HIV and Aids can be answering 10 burning questions he's done 3 of them so I've got 7 left I'm really good at math. Thank you sir thank you thank you thank you. Thank you thank you thank you thank you thank you thank you thank you. Thanks for this was. Would like to thank you actually write out a thanks thanks thanks. Thanks thanks thanks thanks to done a baby advance thank you thank you thank you thank you Susan thank you thanks the north and thank you thank you thank you thank you thank you. Thank you. Thank you know thank you. Thank you. Thank you thank you thank you thank you. Thank you thank you thank you I saw you in just a few of. The great. Us You are just you. Thanks. Thanks thanks. Thanks. Thanks. Thanks thanks. Thanks. Thanks. Grave nice for b.b.c. Radio your. Just funny to 9 not on that Monday the 25th I bet you forgot what day it was nearly not in a few hours it'll be the transects every. Coffee and I'm joined in the studio by c.j. From Yorkshire I'm as much talking about HIV and Aids 10 burning questions it's also very tough it is a bit I just read a lot yes let's get. You on some 3 of my burning questions my next question for you here is. How can it be prevented Ok. So the good news is that there's a plethora of ways in which we can prevent it so because it's usually called protected sex and there's ways in which we can make having sex safer in terms of preventing HIV So the kind of big warning most obvious one is using condoms so protecting ourselves from HIV using condoms is really really effective. It's you know it's the kind of the classic method that we have in terms of preventing HIV. So if you're having sex then using a condom is it really really recommended if you want to prevent HIV also prevent other Ice-T. Ice as well. So you know economy is great protecting itself against you know a range of different things as well as HIV. We also have prep so Prep is a fairly recent development so it stands for pre-exposure prophylaxis So it's another . Word but we generally call it prep and it's basically it's basically the equivalent of the contraceptive pill but it prevents HIV rather than preventing pregnancy so people can either take the bet it's a single pill you take every day and you can either take it on a daily basis or you can take it on an on demand basis by taking it means that regardless of the type of sex that you have whether it's protected or protected you must have the massively reduce the chances of getting HIV So it's you know it's got a success rate of over 99 percent. Preventing HIV and that's room protected sex so combining condoms on prep together massively reduces the chance of acquiring HIV which is great and it's a bit of a game changer in the fact that we're now seeing each of the rates fall largely because of. Pressure being introduced so in your Currently we have a prep trial that's being run by a lovely partners at your sexual health. That's providing at the moment I think it's 70 gave us actual men medication for free will hoping that it's going to be rolled up further in the coming years so we'll see a prescription based system if you do so that things crossed but people can also purchase online as well you can buy it through online pharmacies for you know less than 20 pounds a month for 30 pills supply so yes Prep is a great thing. There's also a pet as well so we've got prepped and had proper pap so slightly confusing how. Cold. You have got prepped which is pre-exposure peppers post-exposure So Pat is a means of if we see the crap. The contraceptive pill the pap is a bit like the morning after pill so if you have protected sex and you feel like you may have been at risk of acquiring HIV then you can access this medication called Peppe you can get it from the hospital get it from the Such a health clinic by taking back then you get massively reduce the chance of HIV replicating anybody so even if it's got into your body through a protected sex then Pap will hopefully flush out so that's another good thing to know about. Just regular testing as well so regularly testing is a really great way of knowing if you stay this way you're just kind of getting a number to every few months. And kind of being aware of your status and I guess either additional thing is if you know people are using needles injecting drugs which can be a source of HIV risk just using clean needles not sharing needles that's a kind of you know a basic method which we have in which we can prevent HIV through intravenous drug users as well so those are kind of the different places we have to go from as a small subquestion Yeah I didn't have plan but from what you just said. In terms of the. Comparison to the contraceptive pill obviously you know you take every source that you can take every day or you can take on an on demand basis yeah obviously as a contraceptive pill if you miss a pill you've got to be really careful and you know that's the kind of drilled into you with contraceptive pills yes how does it work with the. You know. How do you have to take it for its work as a prevention Yeah I mean it's so it's a little bit tricky of on demand because sometimes we don't know that we're going to have sex in advance but if we do that that's. You know if a person is going to have sex on a Friday night that really we recommend they think just to get the calendar they would recommend a prep dose for Thursday Friday and Sunday Ok so you. Doing before on the day and then afterwards as well and that should give you the same or similar level of immunity to acquiring HIV is as David daily dose. A lot of the research that we have on prep is based around daily doses so we can't be certain of the. The effectiveness of a kind of on demand kind of schedule book we are pretty certain that it provides a very similar level of protection against HIV Yeah Ok say next question Ok that was an off tangent question actually that question. Next question how do you go about getting tested and what's the process. So again look leaders or you know there's lots of different methods they can do you know which is great so you can come and see. So. If you're in New York then we are based on America claim. We are also have sessions that we run at the university we do sessions in different places around town we also have offices and testing sessions that we run in different parts of North Yorkshire. We offer community based us things so that means it's a non clinical setting so if people have difficulties in accessing the clinic if people have fears around access in clinical settings then we're altered in that regards and we work with most at risk populations so we provide testing and support and other over things for specifically for those most a response relations which are largely gay bisexual men trans people sex workers intravenous drug users and black African populations. So that's that's our kind of cells so covered see us if you if that sounds good for you but we also have you know numerous clinics around New York and around North Yorkshire the rabbi all of the partners at your sexual health who are the main social service if you could North Yorkshire and do really fabulous work and. They will offer HIV testing as well. They should be testing that we offer in our service is what's called a rapid point of catalyst so that means that you basic at your result in a matter of minutes all that really is required is a finger prick from your finger which I have done on the last time where it was very easy yeah it's actually a couple drops of about. You get a result of the 20 minutes that will give you a kind of accurate you know good HIV status basically. The same as offered arts are part of your sexual health but they also offer you know a logical example so they can test for other viruses like hepatitis h.p.v. Other things like syphilis as well and then you also have the option of home kits now so you can order a home to live and you do it at home again it's I think a protest you just kind of take a few drops of blood that you put in the post and you get your results by text message and you can also purchase a home kit so you get the result straight away as well so you can buy those at pharmacies or you call them offline as well so there is lots of different options and you know some people if they're going to the doctors if they're going to hospital you know pregnant mothers if they go for a scar they will be offered a HIV test so there's lots of different venues and different spaces in which you could get HIV test. But it's just about seeking out and and having it you know with in your mind if you're if you're having sex if you're if you have an active sex life if you think you may have been at risk in some way then you know there's no there's no worry there's no shame there's nothing like just go get tested it's it's a really simple simple and quick thing about which is good so obviously if you if it comes back negative then that's great and you just get on with your life then yes a protected here if it comes back positive what is the next kind of step for somebody who's come up with a positive result Yes So the next step is to be referred to the HIV. Name your sexual health. They are really wonderful picture people they'll offer you medication to keep you healthy and also if you support. Mental health and you know all the things that can go along with a new diagnosis as well. With HIV Now what we have is since the late ninety's really is a r.t. So it's time for the retroviral therapy it's basically a cocktail of medication in which people take usually just want to 2 pills per day but the the effect that the medication has of a person is that it dramatically reduces the level of the virus in the person's body so he is a curable illness at the moment so it's something that we can't get rid of but we can greatly reduce the level of the virus in a person so that it doesn't have any judgment on the health and it doesn't you know the cop gets the partners as well so that's a really great thing with HIV medication now is that you know it's it doesn't change your your life it doesn't change your life expectancy it means that you're going to still lead a long healthy life as long as you're sticking to your medication which is great amazing right we're going to keep the head for longer That's a lot of incredible information but you also you speak just so fluid so I just absolutely adore you and so we're going to keep c.j. Head just for a little bit longer to answer his final final 4 questions of the 10 burning questions you know you forgot how to count them yet if you have any to add I mean I have them here but if you have anything that's a burning question yourself you can get in touch with us text me on 813 doubles 3 but make sure you start your message with the word York let us know anything that you need to know C.J.'s hair to answer your reading question. While. You can you. Joke already with so right always love saying that long because it Rob. Thanks it's 5 tonight and it's a Monday which means it's May best Makowski on b.b.c. Radio York you've got me till 10 pm tonight looking. So I am joined in the studio by c.j. From Yorkshire mesmeric. Life we have no milk I'm assuming you have to block all of it off you which is fine yeah easy with his lovely black coffee I wish I liked Black Coffee The sugar is fine maybe it's. Just it's just a taste a horrific I think yes I see days have. After him 10 burning questions about HIV and Aids at some a next question for c.j. Is moving full would be with being hit hard be positively kind of just for the last song but. In terms of being sexually active having partners having a long term partner being in a relationship with somebody either you being HIV positive or them being hit hard by HIV positive or both of you etc How do you move forward like what's the situation what are the risks so I mean with the benefit of I'm too much of our therapy so yeah you know the amazing medication that's free on the n.h.s. Thanks to the positive people it means that. Person as I said before as a person who who is HIV positive will be taking that medication. Then you know usually with under 6 months generally that medication will have the effect of reducing the virus in the body to what's called an undetectable level. And that basically means that it's still that still present in them so they still have to be positive. But the fact that the virus has become detectable means that they have a 0 percent chance of passing it on to any sexual partners so whether that's having sex with a combo without a call dog there is a 0 percent chance of a detectable person passing on a picture of you to a. Negative person so the key messages are detectable he calls them transmittable So that's that's a really crucial thing in terms of. Relationships with people so I hate to be positive person big of a tree negative person as long as the person who is actually positive is kind of adhering to the medication then as long as there are detectable they can pass on the virus to the partner you know we've still say you know in terms of general such a health club abuse is still a really good thing because we want to prevent other things as well as the reflections. You know if if somebody is with a positive partner then they have to have the option of taking prep as well so that person could take medication just to be completely certain you know in terms of in terms of not acquiring HIV. But yeah you know the key messages are detectable because of transmittable So that's a really really crucial thing that we have to go on now and it's a really important reason as to why we're seeing the rates fall year on year which is great so let's question almost is off the back. Which I'm sure there are people listening or. You know about that and it will do I even need to tell people that you know Joy even needs tell somebody if I'm positive if I'm taking the right medication and I'm doubtful undetectible that which means I'm transferable so then you know do I even have to tell somebody so what would be your response to that and also how would you support somebody telling someone what would be your advice somebody and yeah. It can be a really really difficult thing you know it's it's particular the stigma that surrounds HIV Coming out was positive even though we know that the person on medication indetectable compas of the virus we know that that person can have a healthy life the stigma around it can still prevent people from wanting to come out as being HIV positive and you know being HIV positive and disclosing that to family to friends to partners is a very personal thing and it's something that. Is really up to the individual and it's about ensuring the you know our sexual health is our own is our own kind of priority and it's our own responsibility so it's it's not anybody else to protect our own sexual health we have to take the precautions necessary that we feel comfortable doing in terms of preventing HIV preventing s.t.i. Use whatever we feel comfortable doing that's what we have to do with ourselves. And so as repulsive person if they feel comfortable intervene so you know can be supporting including I was repulsive to partners and family and stuff. You're such a healthy New York the HIV I have cannot do that Garth he remains a number of. Support groups so we have one in your we have one in Scarborough and one in Haruka as well so the one in New York is. God One is I think it's every. Of African I think it might be every other Wednesday woman there will be the 1st Wednesday of the month I think it is yeah that's what it is. But that's really nice you know it's a peer support environment so it's it's people within the same situation who can offer guidance who can offer support and emotional kind of hope for you if you want to kind of talk about what's going on in your life what's what's the effect of having HIV being on you so that's that's a kind of a good thing there and as Mark as well you know we offer that one to one support for people so if they haven't you have to be diagnosis if they just need some support rather than we can offer that as well. And yeah just kind of seeking those support networks in our relationships in our families in our friendships circles and feeling comfortable to be open and to child about that with people but not feeling like we have to I think that's that's a key part of it as well so talk to me about who is at risk Ok because we've mentioned a little bit about you know major groups of people who are at risk are gay and bisexual men which is you know the stigma is joined to I think we all understand that that's that's the thing yeah but they're not the only ones at risk and what kind of of your knowledge basically who is at risk and he were the most at risk groups yeah that you know. Basically anybody's at risk if they're having perished of sex that's not protected. Or if using injecting needles on sharing those needles but largely anybody that's having unprotected sex is a risk of HIV And I think that's a really important point you know traditionally it was confined largely within those more marginalized groups or largely within gave us actual men so you know the in the 1980 s. Over 90 percent of HIV cases were within care professional male populations but now last year 51 percent of new HIV diagnosis in the u.k. Were from heterosexual populations so you know it's it's not it's not something that's only followed. Gay bisexual men. Interestingly what we've seen in the last year is one in 5 new diagnoses has been from older heterosexual women so this is a kind of new burgeoning have potential risk group the fact that within. Perhaps over 50 over 60 even have the postman a portal so they can't have babies anymore. The coming of relationships coming along to marriages that might be very even so losing husbands and they're going out having sex which is fantastic I have but because the messages perhaps have been guided towards them in the past around safer sex around HIV prevention around condoms you know it's maybe been solely around preventing pregnancy which they basically do not have so they're kind of being Mr those messages of the having protected sex and yeah what we're seeing is new page of diagnoses affecting these older women. So yeah I mean the key message is that anybody who is having a protected page of sex is potentially at risk of HIV so. If you for the agree that it's just about you know using condoms using prep using pap but also regularly get tested just so you have the knowledge around your sexual health then you have that confidence in terms of your sexual health as well so final final question that you've dreamed of maybe maybe it's not final that's just full now that you. Know you've been out so you fantastic and I think just shut an awful lot of light so I'm sure many many people because it's there's so much of a stigma around and there's so much kind of so many misconceptions even in the last little chat you know about it about the people at risk you don't even think and older women who wouldn't have ever thought of it and when they're even really expected that they would have to think of it being at risk and you know all of this research going out it's his quote was one of the. As well of. Those people who don't necessarily see themselves a risk of they won't get tested and so they find out their diagnosis at a much later stage which you know they may have started to have a defining illnesses so the damage to their new system is starts to take place already so that's that's another difficulty the fact that some damage has already been done to them when it comes be reversed largely by the medication but we really should get the stage where they should be is having an effect on people so it is really a case of getting tested regularly to make sure that doesn't happen being conscious of not having any shame to do Yeah exactly yeah so yeah last question I wanted to talk a little bit about the kind of the larger media coverage of HIV Yeah the most recent thing all kind of biggest thing would probably be the rugby player yeah they have a big Captain Thomas and he came out as being HIV positive but that was almost like not his choice that it was more media led because it was found out by the media and . Threatened to be published Yeah yeah so why do you think that's still going on do you think it's a positive thing that he has actually had to come out and say in the end because it sort of banish the stigma or is it creating more because of the reasons why you have to come out and say Yeah well your feelings around obviously the fact that he I mean he was basically blackmailed by a tabloid newspaper in which they went to his parents' house kind of outed him to his parents versus knowledge and then threatened to expose it in a national newspaper which is horrific and you know it kind of hark back to what was happening in the 1980 s. . So you know that aspect of it is horrendous should never happen and it only goes to increase the stigma that surrounds him every. So often that regards it's a really terrible thing but the fact that he did kind of take control of it himself and he made a really fantastic documentary about it for the b.b.c. And he's done some amazing work kind of boosting the stigma around it since he's come out which has been fobbed So you know his kind of public profile. And the work that he's been doing in the in the months since his heart is.