Transcripts For MSNBCW Dateline Extra 20200817

Interest in k12 to get back to school. Parents who need to get back to work. Im spread so thin. The risk of her not having access to education outweighs the other risks. And students whose education is about to include one of the biggest lessons of their lives. Just goes to show that anything can change our lives. This is an nbc news special report. Coronavirus and the classroom. Hello, everyone, im lester holt and thank you for joining us. There may be no greater example of how the coronavirus pandemic has disrupted american life, how it has sown chaos and anxiety along with illness and death and the challenge of going back to school. Tonight with the new school year upon us, families, communities and educational institutions across the country are facing a bewildering array of tough choices and it seems none of those choices are without risk. Teachers want to teach, but can they do so safely in person, in a classroom, full of students . Parents want their kids in school, but will that put those kids in harms way . And how can parents go back to work if their kids have to stay at home . And what about the kids, themselves . Millions of students from kindergarten to college, eager to learn, to get out of the house, to be with their friends. Is that an acceptable risk or disaster waiting to happen . Over the next hour, we hope to bring some clarity to those questions. To bring you the very latest information to help you understand the stakes and navigate the choices your family will have to make. We have our team assembled to take us through it all. Well hear as well from the director of the centers for Disease Control and prevention, dr. Robert redfield, on coronavirus in the classroom. Let me just quickly get this out of the way right now. I am separated by more than eight feet from the nearest person behind a tv camera and, thus, im not wearing my mask right now. Lets get started now. Nbcs tom costello on where things stand right now. Tom . Same story with me, thank you, lester. Nationwide, 90 kids and teens have now died from covid19, but Public Health experts generally agree they need to get, we need to get kids back to school. Its better for their education. Its better for their physical and their emotional wellbeing. But if kids return to school in a covid hot zone, the fear is the virus will spread like wildfire endangering entire communities. Across the country, the morning ritual is changing profoundly. For 56 million k12 students, the school year. For those who return to school in the fall, fewer kids on the school bus. Face masks. Temperature checks at the front door. Fewer kids per classroom. Alternating inclass days. And spaced out cafeteria seating. I think hes needing to go to school, interact, you know, have the teacher be his teacher, not his mom be his teacher. Reporter but for millions of kids and teens the return to school this fall will be virtual. Of the 25 biggest districts in the country, 18 are opening with Remote Learning only. Including l. A. , san diego, san francisco, seattle, denver, chicago, houston, atlanta, and washington, d. C. Other School Systems including new york city, the countrys largest, plan to use inperson learning or a hybrid model. Still, a quarter of new York City Kids are opting for all Remote Learning. No one wants it to be this way. Parents, educators, and students would all love to be back in the classroom. I miss school and my friends and going to different places. Reporter but these are not normal times. Theres a lot at stake here. Theres a lot at stake for kids educations and their social wellbeing and theres a lot at stake for health. Finding that path in the middle is where communities are struggling right now. Reporter first, a fact check. Can kids contract covid19 . The cdc says absolutely. More than 380,000 teens and kids have already contracted the virus. Roughly 9 of all coronavirus cases. While most wont become seriously ill, researchers believe even asymptomatic young people can contactiactively spr virus to others including teachers, parents and the elderly. Cherokee county, georgia, two high schools are closed after dozens of confirmed cases. More than 1,200 students and staff quarantined districtwide. 45 minutes away North Paulding High School remains closed with 35 positive cases after students packed the hallways often without masks. I just feel like thats the risk some of us seniors are willing to take to have our senior year. Reporter across the country teachers are concerned about their own health. Youre packing 300 kids, almost 300 kids, into a school. How is that following the guidelines that everyone has put up . Reporter Marcie Warner is retiring after 40 years teaching in scottsdale, arizona. I love those kids, and and where i taught and what i did, but im not quite willing to die for them. Reporter but the president is still pushing to get students back. All schools should be making plans to resume inperson classes as soon as possible. Reporter providing guidelines similar to the advice offered by health experts. The cdc is pushing inperson learning when possible. Among its member recommendations, no entry into a school for anyone with a temperature over 100. 4. Keep small pods of teachers and students together all day. Physical barriers to minimize the transmission if somebody coughs, sneezes or talks. In addition, continuously disinfect hightouch surfaces like playgrounds, like doorknobs, light switches, teskttes desktops, countertops and restrooms. Harvards dr. Shah says schools feed to prioritize which kids return to school first. The best evidence is that younger kids transmit less and also the best evidence is that younger kids really need that face to face in a way the older kids maybe need it a little less so if i were prioritizing, id start in k12. Reporter in houston county, georgia, school resumed last week. Many stayed separated in the hall and sat divided by plexiglas at their desk. Now its also reporting positive cases. Im looking forward to seeing my friends and just getting back in the school. Reporter but that will have to wait for this 10yearold in maryland who will start fifth grade online. Corona kid graduate, our first graduate of the year. Reporter she completed fourth grade at home in what her dad dubbed corona care academy. You survived Distance Learning at home with mom and dad. Reporter you must be, like, at the top of your class. Youre super smart. I am. See . Reporter her dad was also at home. Serving as the cook, reading, writing, arithmetic, gym, and music teacher, but he was only home because in his real job he is a teacher at another school. Now teaching music online which requires a lot of patience and flexibility. I told some of my students, hey, lets do the lessen on on saturday. I was okay with extending the traditional times of monday through friday understanding that my goal is can i meet the needs of that child . Reporter no doubt about it the 2021 school year is going to be very different. Theres no way to eliminate the risk. You can reduce it quite a lot. You can reduce it for the teachers and administrators. Weve seen from other places an t around the world, when you do that, schools are not a source of outbreaks and it is generally a manageable risk. Reporter doctors all believe that kids who are in lowcovid exposure theirs, they should be able to resume School Without much of a problem. In areas that are hot zone and with how quickly this virus is spreading, its also entirely possible some kids will be online all year. Lester . I love the corona academy. Tom, thanks very much. No group has a greater stake in safely reopening schools than teachers. In new york, here in new york, one the countrys biggest hotspot, but now relatively under control, some teachers are concerned about the citys plan to reopen its 1,800 schools for a mix of inperson and remote classes. Nbc news and qb correspondent Antonia Hilton spoke with some of them. Shut it down shut it down reporter alex has taught special education students in new york city for seven years. Black schools matter reporter hes used to challenging environments. Returning to the classroom in the midst of a pandemic doesnt sit right. Im pissed off. I think theyre so disconnected from reality. Reporter what are your personal fears about what it would mean for you to be back in School Building with your kids . My personal fear is one of my students would get it and they would die. Like, thats the absolute worstcase scenario or somebody would contract it and spread it to their families. Reporter new york city leaders announced Public Schools would return to a mix of inperson and remote instruction. Now that the citys infection rates are under control. Alex is a member of a small social justice caucus within the larger United Federation of Teachers Union called the movement of rank and file educators. And theyre considering calling for a strike or sickout. The city consulted closely with Union Leadership on reopening plans, but some teachers felt like their voices ws s werent heard. Shut it down reporter by School Leaders like schools chancellor, richard caranzza. What i heard from parents is they need their children in school. 1. 1 Million Students in new york city, we have a little over 300,000 families that have elected to start the school year Remote Learning. Thats threequarters of our families that as of right now are saying we will go to a blendedlearning environment as long as its safe. Reporter how will the city respond if teachers decide to strike . You know, i dont know, but im appealing to teachers to say to them, we hear you, we understand. This is, based on the medical science, and weve set thresholds that if that number starts creeping the other way, we will pivot to Remote Learning without hesitation. Im just appealing to teachers to understand that our children need us. They need us now more than ever. Reporter some of them as though rankandfile educators werent brought to the table in the negotiations around reopening. Why werent regular educators included in those conversations . Well, we ive had a number of town halls where there have been teachers that have been part of those town halls. I do know that the uft which represents teachers has been working with us shoulder to shoulder. Ive been a teacher has well. Theyre scary times for all of us. Reporter vanessa plans to return to teach english at her high school in brooklyn. She loves her students, but shes worried about her family. I would be putting my mom at risk of covid. She has high Blood Pressure. Shes undocumented. So she has no Health Insurance and if she were to get sick, i dont know if she would want to go to a hospital because of her status. Reporter do you think theres a chance youd strike . I dont think so. Reporter to what extent does your family depend on you being able to work . A lot because im the run whos helping with rent right now. Look, its mommy. Reporter alex has a 2yearold daughter, miriam. His expartner, gabby, is also a teacher. And they dont know how theyll juggle childcare this fall. We all came into this with the idea we want to do this job to service our children, to do our best. In good times its frustrating, but in times like this, t even its terrifying. That was antonai hilton repo reporting. Earlier today i spoke with the directors of the centers for Disease Control and prevention, dr. Robert redfield, who had a dire warning this week about what the fall season could bring. We talked about recent cases where kids have gone back to school and classes reopened only to have those kids end up in quarantine just days later. I asked him what message that sends to other schools still on the fence about what to do. Well, i think the most important thing, lester, is to realize that schools arent theyre not only central to the childs academic success, but they really are important to provide the mental, nutritional, emotional support, to children and their families and this is why we believe its in the Public Health interest of k12s to get back to school. The most important thing to impact what you just said about kids being found to be covid positive in school is to continue to get control of the transmission within the community. Again, many of these children, obviously, got infected in the community setting. So this is going to be one of the challenges to make sure we continue to make progress on Community Transmission in the communities that open and to really look its in the best interest of our society to work toward facetoface learning. And in schools and communities that are still wrestling with an outbreak, should they be feeling pressure from the cdc and the white house right now to open classrooms or would you give them the space to make that decision . Yeah, we dont want to pressure anybody. Our guidance is there to help them begin to open, as i said, safely and sensibly. The timing of that is going to have to be decided one school at a time. Were there to help provide that tekd ca technical assistance. You alarmed a lot of people with your assessment of what the call could bring. We got the flu season coming up here very soon. You and i both know even without covidpetrie dishes sometimes. Walk me through what we might expect not only in schools but elsewhere. Thank you, lester. I think its really important the emphasis im trying to make that i personal believe that the American Public is taking heed to the messages that we set, the powerful weapons we have. Universal face masks. Distancing. Washing hands. Being smart about crowds. We do that, that were going to have a Significant Impact on covid and were going to have a Significant Impact on flu. I want the parents to realize this is time to embrace the flu vaccine with confidence. Normally, only about 50 of the American Public take advantage of the flu vaccine. If we choose not to get vaccinated, not to embrace these mitigation strategies, it could be a very difficult time. I dont believe thats whats going to happen. I believe the American People are going to embrace these strategies and as a consequence and get vaccinated for flu and were going to get through united this pandemic and flu season together and im optimistic, cautiously, that some time in the late fall early winter wel have ll have andy help, a safe and efficacious covid19 vaccine to apply to counter this pandemic. Youve seen probably the same pictures we have been sharing every weekend, it seems, we end up with these pictures of mass gatherings, people not wearing masks, ignoring those rules. If that continues, flip this upside down, what are we looking at . Well, what id like to do is see how we can get the counterstory out there, too, where we do see universal masks. I think thats why i said it was a tale of two cities. You know, between whether we have two pandemics occurring at the same time, or whether were able to use these tools to mitigate them. Im still going to stay and put my confidence with the American Public. That theyre going to embrace flu vaccine. Theyre going to embrace these mitigation steps. We are seeing a change in the number of jurisdictions now that have an upward trajectory. And as you know, parents right now, theyve just really want some guidance. They want somebody in authority with the knowledge to say, its okay to send your child back. Its going to be okay. Or maybe its not. What do you say to folks watching right now who really need to hear from you or someone like you . Well, i think its an important thing. We have tried to put out checklists for parents, as you know, that weve reechcently pu out to help them make that decision. We are going to be putting out additional Reference Material to help based on the amount of transmission in different areas. I think its important for people to realize this is a process. Not everybody has to run at the same pace. We have to rebuild the confidence. Obvious aas students, parents, and teachers. Clearly those areas that are having limited tran tran obvid zones one has to be more cautious. I dont want to pontificatponti yes, you have to open if youre green, no, you cant open if youre red. I think we have to take each of these situations and evaluate them for the unique circumstances. You made the pitch, of course, for a flu vaccine. The Antivaccine Movement is alive and well in this country. And theyve come at odds with schools over requirements. Are you worried about an acceptance of a vaccine in schools . Yes, and this is why i really call on my colleagues. Im a physician by training. I call on physicians, nurse practitioners, p. A. S, nurses, the medical community, to invest the time. It doesnt help to ridicule the parent thats nervous about vaccines. Were all never about making a mistake, the health of our grandchildren or children. Take time to work with those individuals so that they condition understand whether they should be nervous if theyre leaving this vaccine on the shelf. They want their grandchildren, their children, to benefit from it. The same for the people that have been misinformed. Theres a lot of people that are misinformed. You cant change their view by just telling them, you need to change your view. I dont agree with you. No, its going to take time and dialogue to move individuals from what i call Vaccine Hesitancy from either fear or misinformation, to bringing them into what i am trying to coin vaccine with confidence. I need basically my medical community to go allin on this and i need those individuals that understand the value of this important, most powerful, scientific gift of modern medicine, vaccination. To embrace that vaccine. Dont leave it on the shelf for their children, themselves, their community, and their family. All right. Dr. Red feield, we appreciate yu taking time. Its always great to speak to you. We appreciate the update. We hope so. Thank you very much. God bless you. Well take a quick break here, but we have much more ahead. Woel go on campus to Michigan State to see how colleges are coping and what this means for the College Football season. And well have a bit of perspective from some of the kids at the center of all this in their own words. Im concerned that if i do catch coronavirus and bring it back to my family and it will spread, im concerned about that but its very unlikely for it to happen if i stay cautious and clear. For People Living with hiv, keep being you. And ask your doctor about biktarvy. Biktarvy is a complete, onepill, onceaday treatment used for hiv in certain adults. Its not a cure, but with one small pill, biktarvy fights hiv to help you get to and stay undetectable. Thats when the amount of virus is so low it cannot be measured by a lab test. Research shows people who take hiv treatment every day and get to and stay undetectable can no longer transmit hiv through sex. Serious side effects can occur, including kidney problems and kidney failure. Rare, lifethreatening side effects include a buildup of lactic acid and liver problems. Do not take biktarvy if you take dofetilide or rifampin. Tell your doctor about all the medicines and supplements you take, if you are pregnant or breastfeeding, or if you have kidney or liver problems, including hepatitis. If you have hepatitis b, do not stop taking biktarvy without talking to your doctor. Common side effects were diarrhea, nausea, and headache. If youre living with hiv, keep loving who you are. And ask your doctor if biktarvy is right for you. If youre living with hiv, keep loving who you are. Simon pagenaud takes the lead at the indy 500 coming to the green flag, racing at daytona. Theyre off. In the kentucky derby. Rory mcllroy is a two time champion at east lake. He scores stanley cup champions touchdown only mahomes. The big events are back and xfinity is your home for the return of live sports. My parents are a little bit worried. They dont want me going to school. Theyd rather have me do Remote Learning. Since im going to be in high school, i kind of wanted to experience it so i convinced them to let me go to school. For some students, going back into the classroom is not a choice. With so many students attending classes remotely this fall, many families across the country are navigating uncharted territory. Parents already struggling to make ends meet must now juggle work and having their kids at home all day. Senior Business Correspondent Stephanie Ruhle has been looking at that. Stephanie, good evening. Good evening, lester. So many families were living paycheck to paycheck even before covid. And because so many students will be virtual this fall, some parents are forced to make impossible choices. To keep paying the bills and also keep their kids education on track. There you go. Reporter the mullen family started 2020 on shaky ground. We were really thinking literally where are we going to live if we cannot continue to pay our bills. Reporter but things began looking up this spring when chris, an air force combat veteran who served in iraq and afghanistan, finally landed a steady job with an irrigation scene. They were climbing out of debt but covid had other plans. We cannot necessarily make the choice that one of us is going to have to leave our jobs to be able to help with our son during the day. Reporter their 6yearold must start first grade remotely at his home in texatexas. Mom, aubrey, is struggling to juggle parents and work. I feel like im spread so thin. Reporter while she has one child at home, many others rely on her at the texas clinic where shes a pediatric nurse. Its a role where you have to use your heart, but it also causes such confliction. Should i give that much . Because the one that suffers in the end is our little boy. Reporter the mullins say 85 of their income goes to bills. They fear the cost of childcare and say if either has to stay at home to facilitate athome learning for their young son, they wont be able to survive. Weve honestly strived to cut what we can, cable internet, our insurance, our groceries, even our Health Insurance. Reporter now millions of parents nationwide are in the same boat. In an nbc news survey, 45 of families say theyve had to reevaluate their budget due to athome learning. Six in ten say they or a spouse have had to change their work hours. And four in ten say their Financial Stability has been affected. A lot of folks that ive spoken to refer to this as its utter chaos. Are there parents out there who are deciding between caring for their children in person or being able to work and afford to feed their children . I think particularly the Single Parents who have to hold both roles. Theyre the primary caregiver to their children and theyre the primary breadwinner. Reporter like latasha kendrick, a new jersey single mom of a 6, 7 and 11yearold. What is the numberone thing on your mind right now . Finances. My children. Reporter kendrick says shes overcome years of hardship but if her kids have to learn at home, it will destroy all her progress. Im going to quit beif i hav to. Reporter you wouldnt be able to collect unemployment. How scary is this time for you . Its really scary. Going to need a roof over their head, food on the table. Vy to figure it out. Reporter kendrick earns just over minimum wage. She gets some assistance but says twothirds goes straight to essential bills i want to have hope, but i feel i fear. Reporter so when you hear people say, oh, well theres tons of jobs out there, but people would rather stay at home. I dont want to stay at home, but if i have to for the sake of my kids, i will. Reporter parents across the country facing unbearable choices as their childrens education hangs in the balance. We just are trying to rationalize how were going to survive. We know that we cannot afford to stay home like many other families. The mullins are still figuring out what to do. One option is to send their young son across the state to a family who can help facilitate online learning. Lester, no parent wants to send their child away. Latashas case, her School District still hasnt given a final answer on whether her kids will be back at school or at home. Its very difficult. Lester . Yeah, lot of families will find that story very familiar. All right, stephanie, thank you. As weve seen, theres no one solution to reopening schools. Some have open their doors. Some remain virtual. And others are trying a mix of both. Nbc news investigative and consumer correspondent paid a visit to a new york School District where inperson classes have already begun. Precautions are in place and the future is unknown. Reporter lester, im here in pleasantville high school, its just outside new york city. This district serves about 1,700 students. Kindergarten all the way through 1 12th grade. I got a chance to go inside to show you what theyre doing to protect students and teachers. It could be a preview of whats coming to a school near you. Good job, what do you say to dad . Bye reporter dropoff is different. Good, 96. 4. Reporter temperature checks and parents filling out a Health Questionnaire each morning. Thank you so much. Is your child exhibiting any sort of symptoms, covid related, has he had a fever . Reporter added Safety Measures to get back to school. Good morning. Reporter important to karen dunlap and her daughter. For us the risk of her not having access to education outweighed the other risks. Reporter the kids in this extended Summer Program are special needs students. Lets pick another color. Reporter and as we saw, the facetoface contact creates valuable learning moments. Sometimes i speak spanish. Reporter you speak spanish . Yeah, i do. Reporter hola. Coma estas. Muy bien. Thats fantastic. I love math. Math is my favorite subject. English, too. Global not so much. I dont like history and stuff. Reporter hi. Welcome. Were entering into what is our k 1 and 2 space at our high school. Reporter mary fox altar is the School District. Our cameras were allowed inside only after students lest for the day. One of the biggest concerns is indoor air quality. What are you doing to address that . We installed state of the art air handling units so we have this wonderful system to bring in as much fresh air as possible and to remove the air in the classroom. Reporter from socially distanced desks in each classroom to sanitizer stations the school also ordered portable sinks to help with lahandwashin and after five months custodians finally received these 360 cleaning machines that disinfect classrooms. She says the district repaired to reopen under three scenario, all students back in person, a hybrid schedule with some athome learning and Remote Learning for all students. How did you plan for all the scenarios you could face in the fall . I have a district committee. Weve asked for volunteers from the medical community, teachers, parents. Feedback is critically important to the work that were doing right now. Reporter i sat down with a kbr group of teachers for a candid conversation about returning to school. Were any of you anxious about coming back to school . I wouldnt say anxious. Well kind of put our Heads Together with all the information that was out there and came up a plan. Really right now the most important thing is making sure everyone is safe and healthy. Reporter what were some of the Biggest Challenges in making sure your classroom was ready and your lesson plans would be ready . I think it was the lesson plans we were able to do but it was more executing it that was the challenge because, you know, were very oneonone, handson. We do a lot of physical prompting with kids to redirect them. We often get very close with them. So we had to change our approach a little bit. Michelle, i see youre wearing a shield. Tell me about that. Were teaching kids letter sounds and how to read and start blending sounds together mind mate mouth and facial expressions are really important. Reporter what should kids and parents expect if theyre lucky enough to come back to school . The fall . Wearing their masks. Washing their hands. Developing a strong aware wawaf their body, where they are in proximity of other people. Its all uncharted water. So just being ready for that and always kind of knowing at any moment it could change. Uhhuh. Reporter as for the cost of all these changes the district is dipping into savings created when all the schools closed early last year. Plus, theyve set aside 20 of each departments budget for a covid19 fund. Lester . All right. Thank you. Lets bring in our panel of experts to get into some of these issues. Joining us, a family pharmacist. Nbc news medical correspondent dr. John torres. Dr. Irwin redlet e fouter. Hes also an nbc news and msnbc Public Health analyst. Weve got some viewer parent questions were going to get to. I think one of the things that frustrates people is this is a moving target. We feel like were all playing amateur epidemiologists with this thing. And so im curious, do you think we have enough information at hand right now to really make informed choices in this area . Yeah, its a very good question, lester. In fact, im very concerned that we dont have enough information nor do the experts have enough information. Not just the parents are struggling, were all struggling with them. Its personal but a matter of public policy. Were about to do a Massive National experiment involving about 55 million or 56 million children going back to some form of either Remote Learning or hybrid version or back in classrooms. And i think we have a lot to worry about and be concerned about and maybe were moving too quickly to get children back into schools. Many schools, for example, wont have the ventilation systems in place that they need even though they may be practicing handwashing and distancing and all that. We have a lot of concerns including me, personally, with four grandchildren in new york city public School Systems and its a lot for parents to be concerned about and try to process. All right. Well lets get some of the questions that were submitted by the adults. Dr. Torres, this question cois, im a parent of a 15yearold whos about to begin the tenth grade. My concern is when flu season hits, what are the experts recommendation when it comes to coughing, sneezing, and runny noses . Dr. Torres, your advice. Lester, tyese has a great question. Typically in a food and cold season, coughs, sneezes, runny nose, help the virus spread so we want to make sure people cover up and wash their hands plenty of times. The message we usually give out. The difference being this year for the past fur months weve been practicing covering up, wearing masks, social distancing, talking about washing our hands and doing that many, many times. We think those measures helping keep coronavirus under control or trying to keep it under control are also going to help keep flu under control and thats what were seeing in different parts of the world where the flu has already been, that the flu cases seem to be less in number than in a typical year. And, again, doing those three measures, wering masks, washing your hands, watching social distancing, are extremely important, but another important point is to make sure you get that flu shot this year. Like many experts have talked about. Its important to keep flu under control so we can start working on getting coronavirus under control, lester. All right. John, thanks. Dr. Redlener, a question from candria, if occupancy person tajs are forced indoors at restaurants, should the same science informing that be used for schools, classrooms, indoors . When contrary science allows for schools to safely reopen but Indoor Dining to be restricted . How are the two different . Yeah, thats a really great question, left e in fact, the two are not different. In fact, im even more concerned about children gathering in close spaces and i think we have a lot of thinking to do about what we demand or even request that parents consider putting their kids back in the classrooms without the proper protections that were giving to many other settings where people are gathering. Dont forget a lot of children are going to be carriers of this coronavirus. And will be capable of spreading that virus in classrooms if all the precautions are not taken. I personally would be leaning toward as much Remote Learning as possible for those families that can do it, but in the meantime, the question remains very pertinent, why in restaurants are the rules different than they would be in the classrooms where our children are very, very vulnerable, lester . We have another question wed like you to take. It comes from a viewer named stephanie who writes, my biggest question is kids with special needs. What is going to be available to them if Distance Learning is imp le lemented . This is a big question from parents who fear their kids are going to fall even further behind. Absolutely, lester. A lot of those kids with special needs or Educational Needs that go above the taf raverage will struggling if theyre not back in the kploom classroomaverage will be struggli what needs to happen, we need to get a lot more money, funding support, from the federal government, from the state government, from the districts, to make sure those children are getting exactly what they need. This is a great time parents to really see their role as advocates. If you feel like your children are not getting what they need and they do have special needs, go to the school. Go to the superintendent. Go to your legislators. And demand that these children will get the extra support that they need no matter what it takes. Its really important. And there can be special arra e arrangements made for your children and we need to bend over backwards so make sure that no child is left behind in terms of their education and in particular focus on those kids with more needs than typical child. Thats right. This question came in anonymously. Home schooling my 13yearold hasnt been so bad. Its his fear and anxiety that i struggle with. He expects adults to fix all of it. What do you say to this parent . You know, i want to say that i think its so important that we get help and recognize the symptoms of anxiety and depression in young people. Often it might be that theyre not sleeping the way they used to or sleeping too much. Their appetite has changed. Their selfcare and grooming is not there. Their grades are slipping. Their interest in pleasurable activities is not there. I would say im so glad that this parent is recognizing the need for Mental Health help and to get it. You know, if youre lucky enough to have Health Insurance, turn the back of the card, call the number, find out about telehealth therapy options. If a guidance counselor is available at school, have the child talk about it and even talk about it at home. What kids are craving and what they lost are inperson connections. They lost if Remote Learning structure, support, stimulation and its very hard to ask parents to emulate a regular six to eighthour school day. We need to give compassion and grace to the parents and say theyre doing a great job. Im a parent, myself. The home schooling, i can tell you, it was not easy and i know parents are contending with a lot. Theres a lot on their plate. Get help for yourself as a parent. All of us need Mental Health support at this time. 60 to 80 of people are experiencing increased stress, anxiety, depression. That was already one out of four on a good day. So now with the coronavirus pandemic, were all experiencing it and especially young people. So routine, structure, stimulation, and Mental Health support and advice and guidance will go a long way right now. Yeah, its such an important part of this conversation, dr. Ba barber, were glad youre here. Thanks to the panel. Well be coming back to you all a bit later in the program so dont go far. When we return here, how giving it the Old College Try is taking on a whole new meaning in the age of covid19. Hope you can stay with us. I have moderate to severe pnow, theres skyrizi. Things are getting clearer, yeah i feel free to bare my skin yeah thats all me. Nothing and me go hand in hand nothing on my skin thats my new plan. Nothing is everything. Keep your skin clearer with skyrizi. 3 out of 4 people achieved 90 clearer skin at 4 months. Of those, nearly 9 out of 10 sustained it through 1 year. And skyrizi is 4 doses a year, after 2 starter doses. 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There are some 20 million College Students in this country and it is safe to say that every one of them is wondering tonight what the coming semester holds. Will they be attending classes in person or online . Will campuses be open . And if so, will they be safe . Nbcs rehema ellis has taken a closer look. Reporter it just might be the Toughest College course in history. That is, charting a safe course to bring students back to campus. While some schools are going entirely online, many campuses have spent the summer grappling with the enormous task of safely hosting thousands of young adults. And decided theyre going to give it the Old College Try. Case in point, Michigan State university in east lansing. A lot of its based on really applying what we know about coronavirus. Reporter msus president dr. Samuel stanley is an expert in infectious diseases. The question on every parents mind, how will you keep students safe an campus . Thats absolutely the right question to be asking and think its one weve thought a tremendous amount about as we prepare to open for our classes on september 2nd. Reporter the countdown to that collegiate dday is on. Dr. Stanley and Michigan State administrators invited us inside one of their virtual warroom meetings as they made decisions on the best way to bring students back safely. Were in the process of processing the liveathome application. Reporter the vice provost is getting messages out to the students. Our impact Radio Station is producing a number of Public Service announcements. Reporter and the provost updated the faculty plan. 35 will be in person. 15 as of now are a hybrid. Reporter there would normally be 15,000 students living on campus. This year it will be more like 11,000. Even with fewer students officials know how tough it will be to pull this off. We have sleepless nights every day. Reporter covid tests will be given if a student develops symptoms then having them either quarantine or isolate depending on whether theyre positive or been exposed. Reporter most courses here will be online but the University Says students should have the experiences on being on campus can bring. That said, anything can happen. The key word for all of us in Higher Education is pivot. We have to be ready to pivot because we dont know enough about this virus. We dont know enough about the potential impact. Reporter in fact, the University Community has already seen what could go wrong. In june a popular east lansing bar, harpers brew pub, reopened. Everyone was dancing around. There was no social distance. No one was wearing masks. Reporter turns out harpers became ground zero for a superspreader event that led to nearly 200 covid infections. No one was hospitalized, but it was a very close call. How in the world are you going to control this behavior when you and other administrators at the campus and at the university are not watching . And, again, thats a challenge and i wont minimize it. I think part of it is having that conversation with your student and helping them, your son or daughter, helping them understand whats required of them if they go to Michigan State. Reporter it means no large gatherings, period. Wearing a mask is mandatory. And students must agree to a new set of rules. Use a parent. If youre not comfortable that this is a way that your student can be safe, i encourage people to study remotely. Reporter msus Student Government president says shes confident her classmates will pull together to protect one another. Our ability to hold each other accountable. Students have proven that so many times over and over again. Reporter dining halls, dormitories, and classrooms, have been redesigned. And everyone will be monitored. Michigan state developed an Early Warning system using wa e wastewater. When all those cases occurred at the local bar lo and behold, we found a very large peak of the virus in the sewage at the same time that the harpers outbreak started taking place. So we do believe that now we got evidence and we can set up a system for Early Warning. Reporter but as the administration has been finding out, being ready for anything is the name of the game. Just days ago Michigan States Athletic Director was gearing up for the start of the football season. Were excited for the call. A fair bit of trepidation but cautiously optimistic. Reporter then on tuesday the big ten decided to postpone all sports, including football, until at least spring. Its the type of lastminute change the university knows it will have to deal with all semester. For now, the hope is that all the students scheduled to come back will still be here when the snow begins to fly, but after all this is said and done, if theres an outbreak, would you be willing to just pull the plug on oncampus learning . Absolutely. Absolutely. If we feel as though every modality we put in place are not adequate in keeping students, fact ulty or staff safe, absolutely, wed go to fully remote if needed. That was nbcs rehema ellis reporting. Well be back with more in a moment including some words of wisdom from some of the kids in the middle of all this. Were going to hear more from our panel oof experts on just what those kids are up against as we continue with coronavirus and the classroom. They get that no two people are alike and customize your Car Insurance so you only pay for what you need. Almost done. What do you think . I dont see it. Only pay for what you need. Liberty. Liberty. Liberty. Liberty. We see you. Looking out. For all of us. And though you may have lost sight of your own wellbeing, aetna never did. Were always here to help you focus on your health. Because its always, time for care. This is the time of year when going back to school weighs heavy on the minds of most kids. We talked to some of the students about it and asked them what learning in the time of covid has been like for them. If i was a teacher and had to give coronavirus a grade, i would say i would give it a bplus. The c. What . If i was a teacher i would give coronavirus an f. F. F with a million minuses. I would just expel it. When my school was closing down, i thought it would be fun. We just had to go on virtual and do our homework. The one thing i miss the most is being able to see my teachers and talk to them, oneonone. I didnt have a good computer to do it. So it would be laggy. It definitely was very, very weird to have my bedroom as my schoolroom. I would lay on my bed a lot. I get distracted easily. Seeing people on zoom, it doesnt feel like theyre real people. When you ask a question, sometimes they dont see you or hear you. If you want to learn anything, you have to learn a lot of it on your own, honestly. I would like to see them come up with a vaccine, so it could be over like a bad nightmare. It means a lot, building up relationships with great people, doing so many things. And i feel like its being torn down. It goes to show that anything can change our lives entirely. From one little event that happened. Lets turn once again to our panel, and questions from our younger viewers. Before we get to those, doctor, if i could ask you, we think of parents and adults making the health and safety decisions regarding kids. But how important is it to include children and young people in these conversations . Thank you so much for asking that. Because i have two little young ones, and im trying to include them into the fold. As a parent, were used to being in the drivers seat, and then the kids are like, what about me . Do i have a say in the matter . Its important to see where theyre coming from, and have ageappropriate conversations. If youre talking about somebody above the age of 6 or 7, they know what is going on, theyve been listening to your conversations, overhearing, and they have an opinion. We see anxiety in children, and they start to regress, they may be more clingy and anxious. So as a parent, you need to say, what are you worried about . You, me, your teachers, grandpa getting sick . I love that question, and thank you for asking, because we need to involve our children. Theres parent guilt, mom guilt, we feel it anyway at baseline. Now we have to make hard pandemic decisions. So include them in the fold, and you may feel reassured by it. And im going to start with some of the questions, this comes from a 7yearold, layla. Why do i have to wear a mask if were six feet apart. Doc . Lester, i think a lot of us have laylas exact question. When do i have to wear my mask, and when do i have to put it on . If you can guarantee the six feet of distance, then you dont have to wear a mask. But wear a mask, watch the distance, and wash the hands. Those three things work. But if youre out in public, you may not be able to keep the sixfoot distance. A study found in italy, if you wear a mask, people stay six feet away, because they know you want to stay safe. Harry asks, how can my scorety socially distance . What happens if one tests positive . Do we have to quarantine for 14 days . While i respect the role of fraternities and sororities for building communities, i do think 34 people is a lot of people to have in one house. I know a lot of colleges dont want to have more than 30 people in a class. So a lot of places are limiting the number of students, and theyre also saying that rooms should be dedicated for quarantine rooms, whether in the house or offcampus. If we want to facilitate community, lets do as much of that online remotely, as possible. I get that loneliness is a big epidemic in this country, and we want to be aware of that. And sanjay asks, should we start wearing glasses to protect our eyes from the virus . My second question is, which is better, goggles or glasses . Also a good question. And theoretically, you can catch the virus through your eyes. And wearing glasses would probably be okay. Goggles would be most protective. But really we think those types of devices should be reserved for people in close contact with potential patients Like Health Care workers or people working in beauty salons or barbershops. And people that work in airplanes and flight crews, who are with people all day long in closed spaces, they might be wearing eye protection and goggles are better than glasses. Gl glasses are better than nothing. But for the general public, were not ready to recommend goggles at this point, lester. All right. Were out of time. We want to thank our panel and all those who participated tonight, helping us understand and cope with one of the Biggest Challenges this country has ever faced. Closing americas schools some five months ago was hard. But reopening them is proving to be much harder. As weve seen tonight, its going to take all of us working together to make it work. Im lester holt. From all of us at nbc news, thank you for joining us. Good night. vo through our love promise, subaru and our retailers are proud to be replanting 500,000 trees. In areas devastated by wildfires. Subaru. More than a car company. Whthey fell head over heels ing galoveltra flings. With its irresistible scent. Looks like their dog michelangelo did too. Unfortunately for him, its more of a forbidden love. Gain ultra flings with two times oxiboost and febreze. Seriously good scent. And if you love gain flings, youve gotta try the dish soap. You say the customers maklets talk data. S. Only Xfinity Mobile lets you switch up your wireless data whenever. I accept 5g, everybodys talking about it. How do i get it . Everyone gets 5g with our new data options at no extra cost. Thats good. Next item corner offices for everyone. Just have to make more corners in this building. Chad. Your wireless. Your rules. Only with Xfinity Mobile. Now thats simple, easy, awesome. Switch and save up to 400 a year on your wireless bill. Plus, get 400 off when you preorder the new Samsung Galaxy note20 ultra 5g. What did you hear . Laughing, almost screaming. You heard screaming . I have known those kids their whole life. I dont believe for a minute that they made any of that up. Like screaming noises or Something Else . Like laughing, screaming. They believe their father killed their mother. They found her in the bedroom. A young mom, stabbed to death. I can see her fighting, fighting for her life. I was so distraught that she was gone. She was your wife, the mother of your children. Its awful. I wouldnt wish that on anybody. Her ex had been to visit the day she died a trip with the kids. And just like that, he was suspect number one. They had no evidence. I was absolutely flabbergasted. How could anyone think this . Police said they were a key to the mystery. His own young children. She says she peeks through the mail slot. She looks in the mail slot, yes. Daddy wasnt in the living room, he was still upstairs. Ideas were planted in their minds. Were gonna prove him innocent. Two children on the stand. What did they see . That was the hardest day, because i love them so much. I didnt do this. Ready, sam, got it . I think youre good to go. All right, jarod, thanks for sitting down with us. Youre welcome. Thanks for having me. Did you take a butcher knife and plunge it into ciaras neck and kill her . No. Absolutely not that did not happen . No. Credibility, the reliability of yearsold memories. Theres a lot of that ahead because this is the story of a murder. June 8th, 2012. Columbus, georgia. It was an apartment Maintenance Man who found her. Shed been stabbed to death upstairs in the bedroom. In the kitchen sink, a butcher knife. The victim was ciara ingram, a 28yearold nurse and mother. Her good friend kendra smith says she hadnt been answering her phone for days. At first, i thought, you know, why didnt i go down there . Well, i knew something was wrong. Reporter police would later estimate that ciara had been dead in her apartment for nearly a week. I think i was so distraught she was gone that i dont really think that, at the time, i put a lot of thought into, like, who did it or or why. Reporter apartment managers told the arriving officers that ciara had small children. So one of the detectives first questions was, where are the kids now . And that led to a bigger question, one all homicide inspectors ask. What is the backstory here . What was this victims life all about . They began piecing together the story of ciara and jarod. She was your wife. The mother of your children. What do you think about her end, the brutality of it . Its awful. I i wouldnt wish that on anybody. Reporter ciara, already the mother of a young boy, met jarod ingram when they both enlisted in the army in the early 2000s. He and a friend cozied up to the pretty young recruit and tried to get her attention. We started talking about how none of the soldiers who got off the last bus looked like they were gonna make it. And she stood up and she challenged me and she said, im gonna be at the top of the class. And i said, okay. And i asked her if she wanted to go out that weekend. Now, you had a momentous early date. Is that too nosy a question . You know what im referring to, right . I i do. Our first date we conceived a child. Yes. Were you okay with that . Yeah, i was okay and i was excited. Id always wanted to be a father. My father wasnt in my life, and my stepfather died when i was very young. So that was something i wanted to be. Reporter ciara and jarod, intimate strangers, decided to make a go of it when the army forced them into a quick decision get married or be stationed apart. When we got in the cab to go to get our marriage license, the cab driver mentioned to us that she was also a licensed pastor. So she drove us to her church. We got married on the steps. You got married by your cab driver . We got married by our cab driver. Onestop shopping. Yup. Reporter the army, as the army does, moved them about. They tried to build a happy home, had another child. But jarod acknowledged they werent good at living together. Once we got married, we actually had our first argument that evening. On the ten scale, how active an argument was this . A good eight. But that set the tone for the rest of the relationship. That was every night. Why dont you guys just shake hands and say, see you later. Its been nice. The kids, mainly. And there was always an ebb and flow where things started to seem like they would get a little bit better, and it would go back. Now ciara has three babies. Is there something where you need to try to make the relationship work . Exactly. How are you going to do it . I just said yes, no matter what. That was the response. That went on for about eight or nine months, and it still wasnt getting better. Reporter they decided coparenting was the arrangement that worked best for them. They divorced in 2009 and shared custody. By then, theyd both left the military. Ciara had become a nurse. Her friend and coworker at the hospital, samela payne, says the main thing keeping ciara in georgia was being near her ex. She didnt want the children to be without their father. She tried her best to coparent, and, like you understand that she didnt have anybody here. So shed sacrifice her shortterm happiness for the kids. Right. For her children. Thats the type of mother she was. Reporter her friend kendra lived in tennessee, but they were as close as could be. When did you talk . End of the day . Start of the day . Middle of the day . All day. We were single moms, dealing with, you know, our exes and she was my support system. And hopefully she thought of me as hers. Tell me about her personality. Who was she . She was very positive. She was very energetic, she was a runner. She ran every day. She was definitely a compassionate person, very loving. She was a great mom. Reporter by june, 2012, ciara decided it was time for a fresh start. She made a plan to move home to indiana to be near her family. Their kids, ages 6 and 7, would stay with jarod for the summer and join her later. Was she dating again . Yes, she was. Absolutely. She was young. So, of course, she you know, she didnt want to be alone, you know . Reporter in fact, even before the move to indiana, shed already met a guy online who lived up there. He was going to help her move. He was gonna come down to georgia. He had made plans, bought a plane ticket. Reporter and that brings us back to ciaras apartment and the bloody bedroom. As ciaras moving day approached, kendra noticed her friends daily texts and phone calls had stopped completely. I didnt talk to her on the 2nd. So on the 3rd, i messaged her and got nothing. So i was like, okay, shes busy, called her. And then on the 4th, started getting worried some more you wondered . You know, was is she ditching me here . I thought, okay, she dropped her phone in the toilet. But then you think about, okay, well, theres other phones in the world or send me an email, hey, im not ignoring you. reporter samela was worried, too. Shed helped plan a Goodbye Party for ciara at the hospital. But ciara never showed up. I remember us sitting around the table, all the coworkers, looking at each other. And you fully expected she was gonna walk in the door. I wanted her to, but i knew something was wrong. Reporter samela was at work on june 8th when ciaras brother called her with the news. I answered the phone and he told me, we just found ciara dead. I dont remember nothing else after that. Reporter jarod says he got a call that afternoon as well. There was crime scene tape at his exwifes apartment. The coroner was there too. He says he feared the worst and went to go talk to the children, just 6 and 7 years old. We said a prayer. And i told them, you know, no matter what happens, i love you very much. I didnt tell them any details, but i told em, you know, something might be going on with mommy. We dont know yet. Asked them if they had any questions. Did they . Yes. My son asked me if he could have some candy, and did he know his mom was dead . He didnt know. I didnt know. We at this point only had assumptions and worries and fears. Reporter assumptions, worries, fears. And that was just day one. Coming up i see an officer approaching me with his gun drawn. He says, dont move. Police have some questions for jarod. Is there something you want to talk to me about . And for the man ciara had met online. What is going on, officer . Oh, my god. When what they saw continues. Not the doubts, distractions, or voice in my head. And certainly not arthritis. New voltaren provides powerful arthritis pain relief to help me keep moving. And it can help you too. Feel the joy of movement with voltaren. Wow. Jim could you ipop the hood for us . . There she is. Turbocharged, right . Yes it is. Jim, could you uh kick the tires . Oh yes. Can you change the color inside the car . Oh sure. How about blue . Thats more cyan but. Jump in the back seat, jim. Act like my kids. How much longer . Exactly how they sound. Its got massaging seats too, right . Oh yeahhhhh. Oh yeahhhhh. Visit the mercedesbenz summer event or shop online at participating dealers. Get 0 apr financing up to 36 months on select new and certified preowned models. 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Protects your info and gives you 24 7 peace of mind that if its connected, its protected. Even that that petcamera thingy. Can your internet do that . Xfinity xfi can because its simple, easy, awesome. Get advanced security free with the xfi gateway. Download the xfi app today. Reporter ciara ingram was dead. Stabbed three times in the neck and left to die at the foot of her bed. Her exhusband jarod was tending to their two children when a Police Officer reached him on the phone. He asked me if the kids were okay. I said, yes, theyre fine. He said, theyre gonna send some officers out to talk to me, and theyre sending the a counselor to talk to the kids. Reporter moments later, jarod saw a woman he assumed was that counselor in his front yard. As i approach, i look i can see out of my peripheral vision an officer approaching me with his gun drawn. And he raised it up and he said, dont move. And so i put my hands up, he pressed me against the wall and put my hands behind my back and cuffed me. Reporter before he could get his bearings, jarod says his kids were whisked off in an suv. Jarod okayed a search of his home and was taken to the Police Station for an interview. Im detective fairbairn. Im detective lyon. Reporter the conversation started amicably. Jarod said the last time hed seen ciara was six days before. He and the kids had stopped by to pick up some toys before her move to indiana. Kids went in, gave her a hug. They ran right upstairs and started playing with some of their toys and watching tv and stuff. Mmhmm. How long were you there for . It seemed like a couple of hours. Reporter he said they hadnt talked since. That wasnt unusual. We didnt call each other a whole lot when the other one had the kids usually. She wasnt like one of those who wanted to call every day. Reporter detectives wanted to know about the state of jarod and ciaras relationship. How had they been getting along . He said they hadnt had any issues lately, but admitted things between them were strained. Whats been the problem . No problem. Just once we broke up, i felt like, you know, there was no reason to have an argument with her anymore after that. Reporter they also asked jarod how he felt about ciaras decision to move to indiana. I didnt feel any kind of way about it, really. Did she ask you . No. So she just said, im im leaving . Yeah. But i mean, that was her. Reporter after about an hour, the interview took a turn when detectives hit jarod with a revelation. As far as they could tell, no one had heard from ciara since jarods visit with the kids. Meaning jarod was quite possibly the last person known to have seen ciara alive. I feel like youre more than insinuating that im responsible for ciaras death. I dont know. Right now, i dont i i the only thing i know is youre the last one that i know of to see her, and so far youre the last one i know that was there so now is there something you want to talk to me about . No. Are you sure about that . Im sure. Reporter the detective told jarod that as they were speaking, officers were spooling through the video cameras at ciaras apartment complex. What are you feeling right now . Im feeling like i cant wait until you get finished with the rest of that videotape. Mmhmm. And im feeling scared [ bleep ] until you do. Thats what im feeling right now. Now, why would you be scared . Because if i was the last one that saw her alive, then youre gonna put it on me. Well, im not gonna put something on anybody. Im gonna take the evidence for what its worth. Though jarod did mention that, as they readied to leave the apartment, the kids went outside first. They went outside to the car while i was talking to her and i came outside and she came outside and that was it. It wasnt, like, a long period of time. Reporter did detectives really think jarod had something to do with his exwifes murder . Or were they just pressing him because he was the exhusband . They ended the interview on friendly terms. I appreciate you coming in. I appreciate you being cooperative. I appreciate you guys doing what youre doing. Reporter it had been a very long night. Jarod says he was just desperate to hug his kids whod lost their mother. You can see why you became a figure of interest here. When i step back and put myself in the shoes of the Police Officers, absolutely. They show up at ciaras house. They find her body. They go they pick me up. Reporter back at the crime scene, investigators looked for clues to fill in the story. Could it have been a botched robbery . It was hard to tell if anything had been taken. The apartment was in such disarray with moving boxes. And there were no signs of a forced entry. But there was an attempt to clean up the scene with bleach. And they did find a mans watch tucked into the sheets of ciaras bed. Who could that belong to . What about this guy shed met online, the man flying in to help her move . This is sergeant deaton with the Police Department in columbus, georgia. Yes, sir. Reporter his name was ryan morgan. Detectives got him on the line. Were you supposed to come down, come here to help her move . Yes, i was, and then about a week before, i, she quit texting me. Reporter ryan thought hed been ghosted. Said that hed cancelled his plane ticket. And i just text her back. I said hey, thanks a lot for the thoughtfulness and thanks for wasting my money. Reporter detectives didnt tell him right away why they were calling. Whats going on, officer, if you dont mind me asking, because im freaking, im like, well [ bleep ], whats happened . She she was killed. The reason you didnt hear anything from her was she was murdered. Youve got to be [ bleep ] me. No. Holy [ bleep ]. Reporter was that genuine surprise . Oh, my god. Reporter of course, theyd have to check out ryans story and pick though every detail of the last day of ciaras life. That meant talking to her children. What did they see . What did they hear . Coming up daddy wasnt in the living room. He was still upstairs. That final family visit. What was happening inside their mothers apartment . What did you hear . Laughing, almost screaming. You heard screaming . Screaming nouz noises, or Something Else . When what they saw continues. Continues. Tide power pods one up the cleaning power of liquid. Can it one up spaghetti night . It sure can. Really . Can it one up breakfast in bed . Yeah, for sure. Thanks, boys. What about that . Uhh, yep it can . Yeah, even that i would very much like to see that. Me too. Introducing tide power pods. 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Tell your doctor if you have a heart condition or high Blood Pressure before taking it. Do not take trelegy more than prescribed. Trelegy may increase your risk of thrush, pneumonia, and osteoporosis. Call your doctor if worsened breathing, chest pain, mouth or tongue swelling, problems urinating, vision changes, or eye pain occur. Think your copd medicine is doing enough . Maybe you should think again. Ask your doctor about oncedaily trelegy. We know times are hard and were here for you. Find support at trelegy. Com. Reporter kendra smith felt shed found a Kindred Spirit when she met ciara ingram. Losing her was awful. Every day, id get in my car, id cry all the way to work cause i talked to her every day on my way to work. You know . Every day on my way home. I mean, id just be in tears all the way home. Reporter samela payne felt hollowed out when she heard. Her good friend, fellow nurse, gone just like that. So you were gonna be friends for life, no matter where absolutely. Each of you traveled to, huh . Absolutely. We were family. Reporter the day after she got the news, samela drove to ciaras home. She just had to see the place with her own eyes. You went to the scene. I went to the scene, cause i i just still did not want to believe that she was gone. So everythings yellow taped and closed off, right . I was in denial that my friend was gone. Reporter she spoke to an officer who was there guarding the crime scene. What did you talk to him about . Any and everything that i can remember that that she would tell me, and what she was going through. Reporter and what samela said about her conversations with ciara caught the officers ear because it certainly didnt match jarods story. This postdivorce relationship was more than just a little strained. Samela says ciara had long confided in her that it was tumultuous. She would tell me how he would break her computers, break tvs just, im mad at you. Bang. Heres one for your computer. Oh, yeah. Yeah. Reporter the way the stories went, jarod would lash out if he couldnt get his way. Did he ever get physical with her, sam, as far as you knew . She told me that, yes. But you didnt see any bruising or scratches or anything like that, huh . No. If she did, she would hide it. Shes the type that want to be strong. She didnt want you to be upset or worried about her. Reporter as for jarod, he told us any stories about abuse in his relationship with ciara just werent true. Were there any handson altercations here . Her on you . You on her . Absolutely not. She threw some things small things. Not like a remote control. Reporter jarod told us anyone who knew ciara well knew that she wouldnt put up with abuse. She was a very fierce woman. She had her way. Shes not gonna let you tell her any different, and shes very determined. I couldnt see her being in an abusive relationship. Reporter of course, he says, he and ciara had plenty of scorching disagreements during their marriage, but once they split, the drama ended, and, he says, they shared responsibility for the kids amicably. Coparenting, and very successfully. We didnt have any arguments about the kids or their care. We pretty much came to all agreements on that sort of thing. I think the Biggest Issue we ever had was that when she she cut my sons hair. I didnt really like that. He had a big, puffy afro, and it was really cute on him and i liked it. Reporter but given what investigators had heard, they were now very focused on jarod. Did he have any opportunity to murder his ex, what with the kids in tow . Jarod said he put the kids in the car and went back inside ciaras place to get the last of their things. Two kids, sitting in the backseat of a car, a boy and a girl, aged 6 and 7. What did they see, what did they hear in the next few moments of their lives . And importantly, what would they say about it . The police talked to the children the day they discovered ciaras body. What grade are you in . Kindergarten. Reporter the kids confirmed that for at least some period of time mom and dad had been inside the apartment without them. Why would daddy leave you and your brother in the car . You dont know . He never leaves us in the car. Reporter here they are, talking to a forensic interviewer a few days later. Why do you think daddy made you stay in the car . Maybe hes doing something. Reporter jarods 6yearold daughter says she got restless, and did what 6yearolds do. She says she got out of the car and went to the door, lifted the mail slot, and peered inside. She told investigators she saw her dad. What was he doing . I forgot. I mean, was he standing . Was he sitting . Was he he was standing. Was he just standing there doing nothing . Did he have something in his hand . Did he no. He was just standing there doing nothing. Reporter she says he told her to go back to the car, but she says she peeked in again. Investigators were interested in what she saw, and what she says she heard. Mommy was still laughing, but but she she sounded like she was somewhere. Daddy wasnt in daddy wasnt in the living room. He was still upstairs. Mommy was still laughing, though. Reporter her brother says he got out of the car too, and he also heard the laughter. Or was it Something Else . Whatd you hear . Laughing. Almost screaming. You heard screaming. Uhhuh. Yeah . Tell me. Did you hear were they just saying, like, screaming noises or Something Else . Like like laughing, screaming. Yeah . Reporter stream screaming . What in the world was going on inside ciaras home while the children waited outside . Coming up if youre asking did i think he did it, it was an absolute no. Reporter a new relationship for jarod, and new questions about those interviews with the children. Those statements that come out later are, in my opinion, conditioning. What do you mean . The police are suggesting something for the children to say. When what they saw continues. Ntinues. We see you. Looking out for all of us. But you cant lose sight of your own wellbeing especially if you have a serious chronic medical condition. At aetna, were always here to help you focus on your health. Because its always time for care. And ask your doctor about biktarvy. Biktarvy is a complete, onepill, onceaday treatment used for hiv in certain adults. Its not a cure, but with one small pill, biktarvy fights hiv to help you get to and stay undetectable. Thats when the amount of virus is so low it cannot be measured by a lab test. Research shows people who take hiv treatment every day and get to and stay undetectable can no longer transmit hiv through sex. Serious side effects can occur, including kidney problems and kidney failure. 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And they had ciaras cell records showing her phone went silent around the time jarod was at her apartment. There wasnt a single phone call or text after 6 39 p. M. On june 2nd. And the only wisp of a lead, that guy from indiana who was going to help ciara move. She was murdered. Youve got to be [ bleep ] me. Reporter well, his alibi checked out. And that left one person, jarod. So on july 1st, a month after ciaras murder i was leaving to go to work. And then people started getting out of their cars and putting their hands up like this saying you know, dont move. Youre under arrest. Reporter jarod was charged with murder and spent the next 15 months in jail before posting bond and being released. By then, hed lost custody of his son and daughter. Theyd moved to indiana to be with ciaras mom. Are the kids taking your phone calls, because im sure youre trying to reach them. At this point, part of my bond agreement is that i cannot speak with anyone in ciaras family, including my children. Reporter so thats a whole area of your life thats gone away. No contact, yes. Reporter what are you doing for work . At first, nothing. My work was to find work. Reporter nobody could hire you . Nobody. Reporter and the story is still following you. Yes, the story was still there. Reporter jarod says he started attending church and began reaching out to old friends like katie duke, a girl he knew from High School Band days. I always had a thing for him, even in high school. But it was just not good timing, it never was. Reporter this wasnt exactly great timing either. After all, jarod was accused of murdering his exwife. What did you think . If youre asking did i think he did it, it was an absolute no. Why would they even think this . And how could it have possibly come to this . Reporter and youre saying that because of the guy you knew, the yeah. Reporter the character of the man. The the character, just how could it how could it possibly anyone think this . Reporter their relationship grew from a friendship into something more. Howd you decide youre going to get married . We started talking about it, and it was a lot of back and forth, because with Something Like this hanging over your head, do you wait until everything is over and then get married . That sounds sensible, right . Reporter katie disagreed. I basically told him, im im ready, ill marry you, you know. Reporter they began their married life together in a kind of limbo, waiting for jarod to go on trial. He still hadnt been indicted. What was taking so long . Jarod and katie kept their anguish quiet. Lot of people in the church didnt even know his story, right . No. Reporter then, january, 2017, 4 1 2 years after the murder, the indictment came down and a trial date was set. No more secrets now. What did you think when you heard . In my mind initially was just, its impossible. Reporter debbie duke is katies mom. Laura duff and jim odonnell are Church Friends. Did you ever think, my goodness, this young mans a killer . No. Reporter debbie . No. Not for a second. The very notion that somebody could consider jarod capable of this was beyond my belief. Theres just simply no way i could apply my brain to that. Reporter the support wasnt just moral. The Church Friends offered to help any way they could. We had two or three people come up and says, well, what what can we do . Im like, well, pray, i dont but one of them said, well, come on, theres something we could do. What about all that paperwork, couldnt you use help with that . And im like, that would be wonderful. Reporter that paperwork was the case against jarod. Mounds of documents, police reports, audio, and video recordings. And to mount a defense, they would need to understand it. My lawyer was very good, but he has a small practice, just him and his wife, and so as far as leg work, theres not theres not 100 paralegals going around to do Legal Research for him. We had all the paperwork all over the table, all over the kitchen. The whole that part of the house was just covered. Reporter jarod and katie transformed their kitchen into a war room. And those Church Friends became legal assistants of sorts. They vowed to be objective. I was a true believer in jarods character, okay . Reporter but if the evidence had persuaded you otherwise had the evidence persuaded me otherwise, i wouldve gone with the evidence. Reporter the Ad Hoc Church team divvied up the work. Jim, a software whiz, took a crack at the cell phone records. It took me some study and everything to try to figure this out. But it came down to numbers. Simple math. Reporter according to the cell records, ciara was alive and on her phone at 6 39 p. M. Three minutes later, 6 42 p. M. , jarods cell records indicate he is still at ciaras apartment. And 26 minutes after that, jarods phone pings off a tower that the friends estimate is a good 15 to 20 minute drive away from ciaras apartment. Theres not enough time here for him to have committed the crime. Reporter and the the telephone traffic persuades us of that . Yes. The math doesnt work. It just simply doesnt work. Reporter at least by their calculations. Then jarods supporters looked at the bloody crime scene photos, which raised more questions in their minds. And the fact that, if you bludgeon someone the way the pictures show, how do you walk out of an apartment without completely showering, changing your clothes, and doing all that . That would add even more time. Theres going to be blood everywhere. About the only way he could have gotten the blood out of him that would have been sprayed would have been to run through a shower on his way out the door. Because there was not reporter because tick, tock, tick, tock. Hes got to get to that other tower . Absolutely. He wasnt wet. He didnt change clothes. And there were none of his clothes ever found with any evidence on them. Reporter the friends then turned to those interviews with the kids, and they transcribed every word. Including the interview where jarods son says he heard screaming. What did you hear . Laughing, some almost screaming. You heard screaming . Uhhuh. Reporter they noticed that interview took place five days after ciaras body was found. But in the police file, the friends found an earlier interview. The sons story about what he heard on that occasion was completely different. Heres that interview. Did you hear anything when daddy was inside . I didnt hear nothing. Reporter jarods supporters wondered where his son could have gotten the idea of screaming. The first time it comes up on the tapes is in a question from police just hours after they found ciaras body. Was mama screaming or daddy screaming or hollering . Nobody was screaming or nothing . Mmmm. Theres absolutely nothing incriminating about their initial testimonies. Those statements that come out later are, in my opinion, conditioning. Reporter what do you mean . I mean that the police are suggesting something for the children to say. And if you suggest something to a child of that age whos impressionable, its possible that they may say, yeah, i guess it couldve been that. Reporter and there was Something Else laura picked up on. I could hear one of the investigators whispering under their breath, trying to tell the children to Say Something on their recorded interviews. Shes referencing things that were spoken about in the car ride to the Police Station that werent recorded. And they tried really hard to get the kids to Say Something that didnt happen. Do you remember that . Say yes. Hmm . I mean, do you remember that . Reporter was the officer putting words in his mouth . Its hard to say. But the children would speak about that day again, this time in court, where theyd be the chief witnesses against their father. Coming up whats the little girl see . She sees her father standing. He is changing his shirt, and he has a white bottle beside him. Reporter two young witnesses with powerful stories to tell. Were those children coached . Never. When what they saw continues. Ues. I logged 10,000 steps today. Shingles doesnt care. I get as much fresh air as possible. Good for you, but shingles doesnt care. Because 1 in 3 people will get shingles, you need protection. But no matter how healthy you feel, your immune system declines as you age, increasing your risk for getting shingles. So what can protect you . Shingrix protects. For the first time ever, you can protect yourself from shingles with a vaccine proven to be over 90 effective. Shingrix is a vaccine used to prevent shingles in adults 50 years and older. 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Reporter Muscogee County District Attorney julia slater and her team hoped the jury would be persuaded not by jarods supporters, but rather by the cold, hard facts of the case. Is it your belief that jarod ingram murdered his exwife, ciara . Yes. While the kids are waiting in the car. Yes. And the motivation for this crime was what . He did not want ciara to move with the children to indiana, and would do anything to prevent that. And his life was going to be better how, with him dead . He may have more access to the children, he may have custody and wouldnt have to worry about them moving away. Reporter the prosecution called friends like samela payne who testified that ciara told her numerous times that jarod was threatening, violent. Was that unnerving for you . No, because i wanted justice for ciara. Its too long, it had been too long. I just had to do what i had, you know, my part. Hes sitting there. Yeah, to the left of me. You couldnt look at him. No, i was too disgusted. I hate him. I hate to say that, but i do. And i just didnt look. Reporter the prosecution said jarod had another motive. To the tune of nearly 13,000 in back Child Support payments. The prosecution also argued that the forensic evidence pointed squarely at jarod ingram. Police found jarods fingerprint on ciaras cell phone, a cell phone last used about the same time jarods cell phone placed him at her apartment. So did he have enough time to do this . Yes, he certainly had enough time. We know that he that his phone was at the apartment at the time that her phone went silent. Theres enough time to have killed her. He knew where the bleach was. He could get to the bleach, do the the the clean up that he attempted to do and were not talking about extensive cleanup here, are we . No, we are not. A little bleach here, a little bleach there. Right . Throwing bleach a few places in the apartment. Trying to clean her up a little bit. Reporter jarod ingram steadfastly maintained to anyone who would listen that he had not killed ciara. But the prosecution found someone who said jarod told him a different story. He would tell me about how he killed his exwife. He told me all how he did it and all that. Reporter a confession. Jockas gilchrist testified that jarod confided in him when they shared a cell at the county jail. He detailed jarods words in this police recording. And he said he just snapped and he said he had stabbed her in the neck or Something Like that. This witness was able to give details including the fact that she was killed upstairs in a bedroom, that he had turned off the air kiging. No way that he would have known any of this information unless he received it from someone who knew it. He said jarod told him. Reporter but the star witnesses for the prosecution were jarods own children. You hadnt seen them in years at this point. Thats correct. They even look the same to you . No. I had people scouring the internet for pictures, anything i could find of them. The moderators on ciaras memorial page were very good at keeping me blocked. But things would sneak through. Are you making eye contact with them . Are you trying to send them any messages . Im looking at them. Theyre not making aniy contact with me. I did mouth, i love you, and that was about all that i thought i could get away with. Reporter the children, then 12 and 13 years old, told the jury with cleareyed detail what happened that last day they saw their mother alive. And the details were more damning than ever. As when jarods daughter testified about peeking through that mail slot. Whats the little girl see . She sees her father standing. He is he is changing his shirt, and he has a white bottle beside him on the floor that she doesnt know she doesnt know what it is. But a white bottle beside him. Reporter a white bottle. Bleach. A change of clothes. Those sounded like new elements. Were those children coached to give details of their story . Never. Was it different years later than it had been at the beginning . There were more details years later, and there were some things that were clarified. But, no, the the children were never coached. They were forensically interviewed intentionally so that they would not have ideas put in their heads. And they were never coached with what to say on the stand. Are you persuaded that little girl saw her father changing his clothing and doing the cleanup . Absolutely. And that the little boy heard screams. Absolutely. Heard his mothers dying declaration, as it were. Yes. So sad that it that they had to see and hear that, but yes, thats what they saw and heard. Reporter but there was another version of what happened that day. And the jury was about to weigh the credibility of that storyteller. Coming up you took the stand. Always risky. Rarely advised. But you did it. There was no question. Why . I had been waiting six years to stand up and say, i didnt do this. Who would the jury believe . The children or their father . What if this jury says youre guilty . What if . When what they saw continues. Continues. Snt it . Wow. Jim could you pop the hood for us . There she is. Turbocharged, right . Yes it is. Jim, could you uh kick the tires . Oh yes. Can you change the color inside the car . Oh sure. How about blue . Thats more cyan but. Jump in the back seat, jim. Act like my kids. How much longer . Exactly how they sound. Its got massaging seats too, right . Oh yeahhhhh. Oh yeahhhhh. Visit the mercedesbenz summer event or shop online at participating dealers. Get 0 apr financing up to 36 months on select new and certified preowned models. For our families and for our communities. When we spend taxpayers money, we should use it to buy American Products and support american jobs. 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Reporter it had been six years since the crime. Six years of suspicion, but jarods attorney Mike Reynolds says it had taken investigators mere hours to come to a conclusion. You get domestic cases, we get a lot of them. Its automatic that you go to the deceaseds former or current spouse. Thats my man, were going to make it fit. Reporter and, the defense argued, there wasnt a shred of physical evidence linking jarod to the actual murder. No dna. No prints on the possible murder weapon. Nothing. In that bloody scene at ciaras apartment, all the prosecution pointed to was jarods fingerprint on her cell phone. He was over at that townhouse quite a bit. It would not have been uncommon for his fingerprints to be all over this place. Reporter jarod says, sure, he used ciaras phone that day. I just remember my daughter handing me the phone saying that it was her older brother in indiana and that he wanted to talk to me. Reporter and they werent worried at all about that jailhouse snitch. He was totally not credible, as most snitches are not. cause if you talk with any jurors, they dont they dont believe them. I mean, you dont call somebody and talk about another crime unless you expect to get something out of it. Reporter but what about the kids and their ever important stories . The defense questioned the new details. Dad changing his shirt. The white bottle of what could have been bleach. Youre saying that the the cops in this case are seeding the story . Theyre coaching the kids. I absolutely think that they were asking leading questions that were leading them to conclusions that they didnt originally have. And even my daughter on the stand, she said that she believes that what she saw and heard, she didnt understand what it was when she was younger. Reporter jarods attorney was confident the jurors would understand the facts if they heard from jarod directly. I knew that he was gonna make a good witness. We need to decide, are you going to put your client on the stand . We knew immediately we had to put him on the stand for various reasons. But most particularly because he was well spoken. You took the stand. Always risky. Rarely advised, but you did it. There was no question. Why . Whyd you take the stand . Id been waiting six years to be able to stand up in front of a jury and stand up in front of a judge and say, i didnt do this. But it exposes you to aggressive crossexamination by the prosecutor. It does, and that was rough. It seemed like he was doing everything in his power to kind of get a rise out of me. Provoke you so the jury could exactly. Show the jury the monster. Reporter jarod faced the prosecutors questions for more than a dozen hours over three days. So this is a poor set of facts that have come together against you. Youre the last known adult to have seen her. The kids are saying theyve heard screaming in the house. The father acting very suspiciously. Bleach. Its everything seems to be consistent with you going in and killing ciara and doing a rough cleanup and then coming out. Absolutely not. If i had done a quick, rough cleanup, there would have been something on me. Thered have been something in the car. The police had the car in their custody. They combed it inch to inch. They found no blood. They found no bleach. Thats impossible. Reporter jarod denied hed ever been violent with ciara. The defense pointing out theres never been so much as a single report to the police. And, no, Child Support wasnt a problem. He said they were working on it, and he hadnt been upset about the exs move to indiana either. His new wife katie watched from the gallery. Jarod is calm, cool, very intelligent. Hes our evidence. Reporter the jury went off to deliberate. Two days passed without a verdict. Then, in an odd quirk of the court calendar, everyone took a week off. No decision. What if this jury says youre guilty . You know, i we couldnt stop hugging. I mean, we were pretty much always like that. But theres i guess a little more emotion behind it, because of, what if. Reporter jarod was charged with the commission of four felonies, including murder. What were you hoping for in the court . That he would be found guilty of what he did. Reporter it took less than two hours once the jury went back at it. Youre watching the faces as they file in . I am, very intently, and nobodys giving anything away. Theyre just coming in, one by one. Stonefaced. They gave the verdict sheet to the judge, he read it, then the lawyers read it. Reporter and then what, you hear the words . They start reading off the counts, one at a time, and its just not guilty. Not guilty. Not guilty. Reporter jarod ingram, not guilty of the murder of ciara ingram. I grabbed my attorney, hugged him. And i cant even describe the moment. I collapsed back down in the chair. I thanked god, went back, started hugging my family. It was great. I started crying. Ive never in my life cried in happiness, never, and in that moment, i cried in happiness. Reporter for ciaras friends and family, the reaction was much different. I was surprised, and i think that my surprise came mostly from the childrens testimony. I dont believe for a minute that anyone coached them into saying any of that. They told the jury what they saw and what they heard. I absolutely believe that. And if you believe it, that means that hes guilty. Right. You think jarod murdered ciara . I do. Does she need justice . She does. I dont know how theyre gonna get it. Reporter but the Prosecutor Says not guilty is not the same as innocent. I do think that he is the murderer, and we would not have tried him if we didnt have confidence in that. Reporter jarod and katie are grateful to the circle of friends who they say helped acquit him. Theyre now fighting for custody of his children, whove been with ciaras mother for more than six years. The frustration of still not being in contact with my children has been hard. Is it better at this point, given all the poison that you say has been put before them, poisoning their minds towards you, is it better just to let them be raised by their grandmother . And maybe later on in life, when theyre theyre bigger, you can catch up with them . Absolutely not. But they think you killed their mother. I dont know if they think that or not. I think theyve just trained to hate and fear me. It would be better for them to heal this relationship as soon as possible. Reporter the children. What they saw. What they heard. What they remembered. Ciaras friends say whats more important now is what they know about the woman lost on that day. If her kids start to forget her, the memory dims, what would you sit down and tell them about their mother . Mainly how much she loved them. She did. Those kids were everything to her, and, you know, she they they were her world. I am craig melvin. I am natalie morales. This is dateline. How am i doing right now . If i had to put it in one word, numb would be the closest. She was a young actress starring in the role of a lifetime, a mystery. You never heard a gunshot . No. One of her friends was dead. There has been a body discovered in sams apartment. It is hard. She was 23. Anoer